Physical TOTJO Temple in Texas Project

Jestor wrote:

Drexid wrote: AND the councils agreement.

Agree to what?

Its a good idea?

Lol, there's nothing to agree to..

He means he wants to know if you guys want a temple or not. I do but I get dibs on the top bunk

Payments can have 'references' which are a few words to id what a payment is for, Whyte Horse seems to be saying is if making a donation - to specify its for building a temple, and then when those funds reach a point perhaps TOTJO could realistically consider such a project. I'd suggest using something a bit more descriptive then just 'temple' though hehe the whole site is a temple!! Note; its what he was saying I think, not me.

What if we enumerated this differently...

1. Do we want a building, as a community? A place where we can hold any number of events.
2. Would the council approve of a member-driven committee to begin planning this endeavor?

Those are the ONLY two questions we need to ask first. Once those are answered, then we can ask: "How much is it going to cost"... etc.

Well I would like a Temple but considering the amount of work and planning it will take I don't think we will have one done any time soon. Sure if you want to send in donations earmarked for one then you can do so, but don't expect a building to be built for several more years...

Of course if there is a massive influx then we will probably begin, but it would need to be much greater than the less-than-a-thousand dollars that is donated each year.

To be honest I'm too busy to begin planning one lol, so they can do whatever

Personally, I would like to see one too...

But, as for the reasons listed many times, and in many threads, and still just as valid, I'm not seeing that its time quite yet...

As far as the Council approval goes, its a slippery slope...

What's that mean?

Is permission being sought to bump a donation post everyday?

To go out into each person's local community and solicit donations?

Go to those "donation" websites?

PM every member for a $1.00?

So, while it sounds like a no-brainer, "sure, who wouldn't want that!"

There are many things I think need considered....

For example, if we did the "donation websites" would Disney kick up a fuss about a Jedi temple donation deal?

I don't know the answers...

I know we have, as members, people who know how to raise monies for charities and organizations, but, perhaps they don't want to spend their down time, away from work time, on basically work, lol....

+++++++++++
Take a moment...

Are you supporting the website?

If no one pays the fees next month, how will we communicate about this project idea?

Sure, the Skype and G+ groups are there...

Wescli and I text... Alex and I G+...

But, to communicate, en masse, we use this site which isn't solely supported by donations, yet...

++++++++++++
What about the taxes?

That's every year, $400 needs raised for just the land (that was purposed) and when construction begins, that's land improvement, and as the land improves, the taxes go up....

+++++++++++
These are just some of the concerns...

When the "temple" ideas get brought up, of course we want to say "Go for it!"

But, a Jedi shouldn't rush, but, shouldn't be afraid of the unknown, either... lol...

Calm, cool, decision making...

Just enough hope, with a little realism...

+++++++++
I would say the the Council:

"Cautiously approves"

Its why we allow these threads instead of squashing them from the git-go....

Well, I'm not in support or not in support. My posts in these types of threads are meant to be impartial. As you've seen many times, my opinion is that a temple building project would hurt the community more than help it.

Now, you've brought up the point I hoped you would. What if we did try and work for a donation-supported site? Why are you afraid to ask for money?

I know that money is a slippery slope in itself. It holds danger. Easily, it could be misused. People could feel alienated. People might leave. You might make somebody mad. Then, there's the law to contend with. The legalities of getting money involved are complicated.

But, this website is THE most successful Jedi website, ever. It's why I originally left my little sphere of the net to join here. Because, I believe that this place has the most chance of reaching the most people.

Think about it. We do need to start small. But, we have the ability to do it. You have people who want to support you, but maybe don't know how. I know I've never donated because I just don't know what it would do. There's no community-wide effort. But, if the council made it known their goals, I would understand what the donations would be doing and the purposes behind them. If you put up how much money was gathered every month, people would see the growth. People might get excited and understand why we might donate. People might even start giving to the temple regularly.

This is a good first step to bringing in thousands of dollars a month to build a building, a capital campaign, paying the councilors and other volunteers, to helping charities.

It's a whole new world. Maybe you don't want that world. Maybe it's not what you signed up for, or what you want to deal with.

It's just an idea, as well. I like to keep asking questions, gather more awareness. It's my Jedi way.

https://www.kickstarter.com/ :whistle:

I support those who want a physical temple, but I don't see a need for one myself. One of the things I love about our Temple is that it's so open. A physical temple is geographically located, and to be blunt having one in Texas is about as good to me as having one on Mars. Whilst communication, instruction and learning is available here, why cross the earth for it?

For those of you who see a purpose and could make use of it, best of luck with it. My donations will continue to go to the Temple I can actually make use of, however.

lol... Why...

I'm not afraid... Careful what you say... Don't take my hesitation for fear, you don't know me that well...

Don't want to donate? Don't...

What's going to happen to TOTJO when John is no longer with us?

You can say, "glad I didn't donate, wouldst pissed that money all away"...

Oh, we can worry about it then, sure, but last I heard, he pays more than the rest of us combined....

And people are worrying about a physical presence? lol...

Sure, go start the "kickstarter" deal...

Let me know how it works (not a council endorsement)....

Here's an example the PR department just experienced:

Zazzle, the on-line store like CafePress," wrote: You recently used our Quick Product Create tool to upload a number of new designs. Unfortunately, one or more of your designs is in violation of Zazzle's content guidelines. Because of the way that our Quick Product Create tool works, we are unable to accept parts of an upload. We must either accept all of it or none of it. Therefore, in this case, we cannot accept the entire batch of products in your recent upload.

Below, we have listed all of the products in your upload and have identified, with reasons, the image(s) that are a problem. If you make corrections to the products with problems, or delete them from the batch, we will be happy to accept your products and designs.

Batch ID: 3845784
Number of Products: 10
Product Title: Totjo
Reason Not Approved: Trademark - Your design contains an image or text that may be trademarked. This may be due to the actual design of the product, description or search tags that are associated to your product. Please feel free to submit a new design to our Marketplace from original elements

We keep stuff like this out of site of the general membership because we don't need every person with an opinion to comment...

People like Jedi99 who commented in our last "live sermon" thread that this stuff is fake....

There are things running in the background, but, we don't have the time to debate every single person...

If you know and understand something, then you may want to join/start a project...

The reason I ask that knights run projects?

Because they have shown their dedication...

The same reason I would promote from within than trust some guy with some papers that say he knows something...

Too many people have thought something is a good idea, yet not wanted to run with the idea...

I've got some ideas on how Obama might do better, or NASA could change a little...

But, who am I? My ideas might be brilliant, but, without proper channels, I will get a polite refusal...

Quit debating, and donate...

Dont listen to me, I am but a moment in time, and someday, i will be gone, and the time will be right....

Until we have the money, this is all moot, this is not NOW, this is misplaced attention...

Its fun to speculate, but, that isn't going to do much for anything...

Man, I just gotta laugh, lol...

I don't mean to assume you feel anything. Don't assume the accusation was pointed at you, because it wasn't.

It's only misplaced attention because people don't yet believe in it.

To my core, I believe in it. But I don't run this site. I help run IJRS. And, our temple project is in progress. Has been for years. We are at least moving in a direction.

Here's the problem: I will donate when there's a purpose to doing so.

I'm asking the council to find a purpose. Like I said, website funding, building, whatever. It can't just be "implied" either. It's gotta be a corporate campaign, with money becoming a tool we use.

Money is extremely powerful. That's why I don't use it lightly.

This nonchalant attitude about donating is the reason I don't donate. I don't even know what it would do.

I feel as though I've become an antagonist, here... I don't understand how that happened. But it doesn't make me feel good. So sorry if I'm spouting nonsense. I said earlier I may be wrong. But, I believe in this so much with my soul. There is power in it.

well...
when I start working on cafepress and zazzle i found that "LucasFilm" or whatever is called, own the copyright of crazy things as the word "Jedi" and many others .

Maybe if someone really build a temple there is NO WAY to call it Temple of the Jedi Order
because copyright infringement, so ...

What is the point to have a temple, that can not carry our name?

in my opinion right now, we need to find first what are the LEGAL options to use our name.
or more crazy, try to find why " Jedi" is copyrighted, or worst, try to make "lucasFilm" release the rights of it.
Or even more crazy, go straight to George Lucas. ( maybe doesn't work, because now Disney own some of the rights)
Maybe we need to deal with Disney?

I know, there's money involved in this process too, but the only way to make something Legit/Legal, is to do it right.
and right now, looks impossible to use our name...
Maybe they allow this website just because we aren't big, and because we are just a few guys, and we don't make any money, and there is no presence in the real world.

Looks crazy, but ... it looks that we don't have the right to use even our temple name, outside here.
Maybe that is more important?
Maybe is more important to make this a recognized religion? ( some places/countries don't have a way to legalize a religion) and make release the "Jedi" word to be used freely.

What is the point to have a temple without our name?

Connor Lidell wrote: Now, you've brought up the point I hoped you would. What if we did try and work for a donation-supported site? Why are you afraid to ask for money?

Connor Lidell wrote: I don't mean to assume you feel anything. Don't assume the accusation was pointed at you, because it wasn't.

"As you brought up a point"

"What are you afriad of?"

Lol, don't see anyone else pointing out what I did, lol...

Connor wrote: But, this website is THE most successful Jedi website, ever. It's why I originally left my little sphere of the net to join here. Because, I believe that this place has the most chance of reaching the most people.

Think about it. We do need to start small. But, we have the ability to do it. You have people who want to support you, but maybe don't know how. I know I've never donated because I just don't know what it would do. There's no community-wide effort. But, if the council made it known their goals, I would understand what the donations would be doing and the purposes behind them. If you put up how much money was gathered every month, people would see the growth. People might get excited and understand why we might donate. People might even start giving to the temple regularly.

So our repeated acknowledgements that we need funds to help the internet operating costs have been missed?

Ah, so you want to see our financials each month...

Well, if we had a money person (financial officer?) that we could assign that task to every month, that might happen...

Or, if we didn't (as council) have to give permission or answer these types of threads, lol, maybe we could squeeze a few more minutes out of our day... But, I'm stretched pretty thin...

To my core, I believe in it. But I don't run this site. I help run IJRS. And, our temple project is in progress. Has been for years. We are at least moving in a direction.

Here's the problem: I will donate when there's a purpose to doing so.

It goes toward operating costs of the site...

Our biggest expense is site cost, every dime goes there, and its still short of making it...

Until site costs have a surplus, that is where all the money goes...

And WHEN there is a surplus, we can discuss even more...

I'm asking the council to find a purpose. Like I said, website funding, building, whatever. It can't just be "implied" either. It's gotta be a corporate campaign, with money becoming a tool we use.

Money is extremely powerful. That's why I don't use it lightly.

This nonchalant attitude about donating is the reason I don't donate. I don't even know what it would do.

I feel as though I've become an antagonist, here... I don't understand how that happened. But it doesn't make me feel good. So sorry if I'm spouting nonsense. I said earlier I may be wrong. But, I believe in this so much with my soul. There is power in it.

You have not been labeled that....

But, as everyone else bowed out, and you want to talk, I'm talking...

I'll admit, I'm talking strong, but, I know you can handle it....

There are four trademarks / service marks registered in the US for the word Jedi. They're all owned by Lucas companies. The one that's probably preventing us from selling t-shirts, caps etc is this one. Look at the last paragraph.

Word Mark JEDI

Goods and Services IC 016. US 002 005 022 023 029 037 038 050. G & S: Children's activity books; novels for adults; book covers; book marks; books containing puzzles and games; books featuring photographs; books for role-playing; children's books; children's books combined with toys and sold as a unit; children's story books; coffee table books; comic books; comic magazines; printed instructional manuals and strategy guides in the field of computer games and science fiction; juvenile books featuring science fiction; magazines in the field of science fiction entertainment; novels for juveniles; posters; puzzle books; read-along children's books; series of fiction books; sticker albums; sticker books; stickers; story books; temporary tattoos; trading cards; art prints; animation cels; collectible trading cards; lithographic prints. original works of art created from paper, photographic prints; printed art reproductions; posters featuring printed replicas of characters from movies. FIRST USE: 19931000. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 19931000

IC 025. US 022 039. G & S: Clothing, namely, caps; children's footwear; coats; costume accessories, namely, headwear and belts; crop tops; dresses; fitness tops; footwear; gloves; hats; head wear; jackets; knit caps; masquerade costumes and masks sold in connection therewith; pajamas; shirts; sleepwear; slippers; sweatshirts; T-shirts; underwear; visors. FIRST USE: 20050500. FIRST USE IN COMMERCE: 20050500

Connor Lidell wrote: This nonchalant attitude about donating is the reason I don't donate. I don't even know what it would do.

Congratulations! You're now officially part of the problem.

The donations keep this site afloat, something that doesn't just magically happen because we're a religious organization. This is why other religious organizations solicit donations--because it's their only source of income, and all of them have some kind of expense. Nothing is truly free unless it's given with no strings, including hosting. Websites aren't free (at least not pretty, functional ones), and even if they were, that would mean that someone, somewhere is making a general donation of something that costs someone money somewhere, OR that they've found a way to monetize it.

The fact that you demand a "purpose" for donations before you'll consider donating is disheartening in a thread about a physical meeting place, when our world-wide accessible digital one doesn't make enough money to keep it up and running without becoming someone's out-of-pocket. It's doubly sad when you consider that hosting this website is considerably cheaper than the upkeep on any physical land/building combination, most likely anywhere on the planet.

That is one of the reasons TOTJO will "never" be able to afford a physical temple: because until something really, really ******* drastic changes in TOTJO's bank account and member participation in general, we'll never be able to do anything more than we are currently doing. Hell, we're doing good to tread water financially, and we hemorrhage new members for some reason.

But yeah. No. Physical temple before we get the cheaper, more-accessible version stable. Totally great idea.

*sigh* Fine, I'm sorry. I'll let it go.

I feel as though it's a matter of making it a sitewide focus. But, I'm probably just wrong.

Whyte Horse wrote: 4. Vote

Council's agreement:
Br. John: Said he wants a temple
Jestor: said he wants a temple
Akkarin: said he wants a temple
Brenna: said she wants a pony

Oh wait, maybe I got one of those wrong

Looks correct to me. But im not on council, or you can be damn sure there would be ponies by now!

[Enter Wes on his dark Unicorn Pegasus Pony... Wes, have you named it yet? :lol:]

Jestor wrote: [Enter Wes on his dark Unicorn Pegasus Pony... Wes, have you named it yet? :lol:]

Twinkie.

Brenna wrote:

Jestor wrote: [Enter Wes on his dark Unicorn Pegasus Pony... Wes, have you named it yet? :lol:]

Twinkie.

HAHAHAHAHA.....

So, i was just faffing around on facebook and saw this.






Sure, we arent in the business of feeding the poor (officially anyway) but bottom line... there are more important things to spend our money on than building things.

Like ensuring that the Temple we do have stays up.

Buildings are just shells.



(though if we are ever in a position to have 1.1mil for a building, im petitioning for ponies. Just so you know.

And a hot tub.