The obsession with Rank

Streen wrote: Personally I see no purpose for rank in itself. What it represents, however, on a site such as this one is that it makes it easier for people seeking guidance to know who to go to for help. It shows experience and clarifies where one stands in relation to everyone else.

But like I said, I don't care about the title.

Heh. Streen gave the answer I was about to give It's more just a flag to new members saying "Hey! You can ask me questions and I can possibly help you."

I think that people become either obsessive about or not even remotely concerned with rank for a variety of reasons. The thing with ranks (in general, not just here) is that they are something that can have both internal and external meaning. Internally, ranks can be a reminder of something accomplished or worked for, which can be a positive thing for people attaining them. For some people, this matters and they appreciate the validation of their efforts. For others, they know what they have worked for and accomplished and view ranks as unimportant. However there is also the external meaning that comes with ranks. In many cases ranks are respected and people who hold them are seen in a different light from those who don't. Some people crave that external validation and the respect of others and may not want to work for it. It's two sides of the same coin.

I personally dislike rank and see my rank of knight as a byproduct of the studies that I have done.
I don't expect anyone to see me as more knowledgeable or wise than anyone else, and is why I prefer that others do not call me master; I am still also on the learning journey.

We ask our initiates and apprentices 'why do you want to become a knight' when I think we should really be asking 'why do you want to continue your studies'.

It's natural, but egocentric, to want something that makes one look better.

I have other thoughts but perhaps not appropriate to post them here.

Like all of life, it is balance...

We have all had bosses that werent worth a shit...

And co-workers who knew how to do everything...

So, I will repeat myself, and say, "Not all doctor's get A's"... When you meet a 'rank', you (should) give them the basic respect that you would want for yourself, and adjust your opinion from there...

Those worthy of respect will get it, those not worthy, will not...

Although sometimes, we have to begrudgingly listen to those not worthy (jobs, whatever), not here, thank goodness.. lol...

I look at rank as "level of study achieved", not "experienced". I've seen Knights and Apprentices post in topics statements that go directly against the Doctrine in those statements posted, which doesn't scream experienced. Although nobody can ever really know everything, it makes me wonder if the doctrine is more of a guide than a set of beliefs. But all religions ranking systems are flawed, just look at the corruption in the Catholic Church. But what I love about TotJO is the amount of training, and the time taken to train someone, so it's hard for a power hungry nut job to rise the ranks and take over and build a Death Star so to speak.

SkiddyJ wrote: I look at rank as "level of study achieved", not "experienced". I've seen Knights and Apprentices post in topics statements that go directly against the Doctrine in those statements posted, which doesn't scream experienced. Although nobody can ever really know everything, it makes me wonder if the doctrine is more of a guide than a set of beliefs.

I see the doctrine as a guide for those at the 'beginning'... disagreement doesn't = inexperience, in fact it can say the opposite.

Edan wrote:

SkiddyJ wrote: I look at rank as "level of study achieved", not "experienced". I've seen Knights and Apprentices post in topics statements that go directly against the Doctrine in those statements posted, which doesn't scream experienced. Although nobody can ever really know everything, it makes me wonder if the doctrine is more of a guide than a set of beliefs.

I see the doctrine as a guide for those at the 'beginning'... disagreement doesn't = inexperience, in fact it can say the opposite.

I looked at the Doctrine and read it about 20 times before I registered, I made sure that they fell in line with what I believed as a guide. But if were to be accepted as an Apprentice I would strive to gain knowledge, but I wouldn't stray from the Doctrine that becomes the foundation of the journey that follows. When people pick and choose from religious text what to believe that's when religions/belief systems become corrupted and people take advantage of them.

SkiddyJ wrote:

Edan wrote:

SkiddyJ wrote: I look at rank as "level of study achieved", not "experienced". I've seen Knights and Apprentices post in topics statements that go directly against the Doctrine in those statements posted, which doesn't scream experienced. Although nobody can ever really know everything, it makes me wonder if the doctrine is more of a guide than a set of beliefs.

I see the doctrine as a guide for those at the 'beginning'... disagreement doesn't = inexperience, in fact it can say the opposite.

I looked at the Doctrine and read it about 20 times before I registered, I made sure that they fell in line with what I believed as a guide. But if were to be accepted as an Apprentice I would strive to gain knowledge, but I wouldn't stray from the Doctrine that becomes the foundation of the journey that follows. When people pick and choose from religious text what to believe that's when religions/belief systems become corrupted and people take advantage of them.

Jediism is a syncretic system, so 'picking and choosing' is what sort of what we do(simplified). Also, don't hold too tightly what you want for the future, your experiences while learning will almost certainly change your feelings on things...

SkiddyJ wrote: it makes me wonder if the doctrine is more of a guide than a set of beliefs.

SkiddyJ wrote: But all religions ranking systems are flawed

Yes sir...

Edan wrote: I see the doctrine as a guide for those at the 'beginning'... disagreement doesn't = inexperience, in fact it can say the opposite.

Idk 'opposite', but, 'ability to think for oneself' for sure...

DJ SkiddyJ wrote: but I wouldn't stray from the Doctrine that becomes the foundation of the journey that follows

Well, it is not "straying', but "wider understanding", I like to think...

Our content management system, Joomla, uses the term "rank bars". That led to degrees being referred to as ranks. At TOTJO Knight is a degree awarded for completing a particular initial course and then the experience of unique personal studies and projects with a Knight.