Jedi Sentinel Findings

Id be interested to know whether or not the autopsy is allowed to go ahead - ie will the CoS 'decide' autopsy is a breach of somekind. As far as I am aware - in the UK id the coroner calls for an autopsy - it is done regardless of religious practices.

Anyway - my condolences to Mr Travolta et al - I do admit I hate the curernt over use of household nukes - people wonder why we are plagued by 'super bugs' etc - this is the reason - unnecessary and over use of domestic cleaners with ingredients originally designed for agricultural and industrial use.

Some cultures feed babies dirt to build the immune system - something to be seriously considered - and how about the general populous being a little better at personal hygiene? Most people 'catch' cold and flu from having touched a contaminated surface - not being coughed or sneezed on (which is dirty in any case, use your hand and a tissue) - things like public library computer keyboards, atms, shopping malls surfaces (trolleys etc) all are the most likely place to pick these diseases up.

From what has been posted - i see no real harm in terms of Scientology involvement - the use of household chemicals has already been proven and widely documented as a cause of various immunodeficiencies - it has been liked to M.E among other things as well as nervous systems disorders among users in an industrial setting (ie farmers). What these folk do within their own circles is their own business - it when it gets to physical and mental harm of people, especially those who are not and do not wish to be involved with such groups that problems arise.

Anyway - once again - my sincere best wished to Jett's family and friends - I guess with a history of seizures - this could be deemed a tragic accident. MTFBW Him - A

And MTFBWY - A

if everyone went back to basics - washed their hands more often and properly - many people would be spared the inconvenience's of such illnesses and dont forget people do die of such things.

As for the original post - if the female who did not wish to be identified really wanted this, she would have said nothing - im sure this source will soon be traced simply becasie the world now knows the person is female - good move

This is one reason my wife and I are moving to change the types of cleaning solutions. We are buying more natural based cleaners, though it does cost 25%-50% more, it is safer for the enviroment and our pets. Also, getting a little dirty is not a bad thing. Also stop cleaning your hands with antibacterial soap all the time. We need some of those bacterias. How do you expect to fight off germs if you dont expose yourself to them. You know when you get a vacinne, you are injecting the virus into your system, this way your body can recognize it and alsready has the anti-bodies to combat it. Something to think about.

Kana Seiko Haruki wrote:

From what has been posted - i see no real harm in terms of Scientology involvement

The involvement is that Scientology does not allow any kind of Meds to be taken.If Travota's soon had been properly medicated his sons immune system would have been stronger and he would not have suffered multiple strokes.The house hold cleaner might have caused harm still but it would not have lad to his death.

In any case I find Scientology's lack of cooperation disturbing then again what else is new.

OK - my point is that they are not alone (Scientology) in refusal of medical care - Jehovah Witnesses are also against life saving treatments and I have no doubt many other religious groups have similar ideas.

But something to consider - he may well have had the same result with full treatment - epilepsy is a swine sometimes - even the best controlled condition have give a surprise attack with similarly fatal consequences.

At the end of the day - if the person was willing to accept the consequences for not medicating (i assume the USA is similar to the UK in that an individual is responsible for their own medical decisions at the age of 16) or the parents - (they have to live with the outcome of a decision).

Also - would not the child protection agencies have something to say if a child was considered at risk in this manner? the hospitals etc have a duty of care to report concerns in such events - using Jehovah witnesses as the example - it has been known for the social services (in the UK) tto take a child into care to ensure they get the life saving treatments they need otherwise denied due to parental religious beliefs.

I am not having a dig at you Daniel - im just raising awareness of the surrounding points to such a case - its a sad thing at the end of the day - but every aspect needs careful examination before a truly somplete picture can be gained.

MTFBWY - A

Forgot to say that a little learning on microbiology can clue ppl in - and I agree with gabriels points - lemon juice and white vinegar are brilliant cleaning solutions - ok they take a little longer to work on the pans etc - but they do the job - and yes - anti bac handwash - awful idea.

When my mom was training to be a nurse - some 40+ years ago - a chemsit friend of hers told her then 'Detol is one of the worst things to use in the house' - it has its uses in small quantities.

The problem these days is ppl do not allow nature to take its course in its own time - vaccines are something else - some diseases need to be dealt with - but vaccines for flu etc - imho are a bad idea - I know ppl die of flu - but ppl die in cars and from smoking and little is done about these.

The problem with flu jabs is thay protect a single strain (normally) and flu is something that mutates regularly - in this day n age of a potential 'asian/bird' flu epidemic outbreak risk - we should think carefully about how we deal with the lesser variants

I dont fancy facing a super viral version of one of these - there would be no effective vaccine if we continue to force flu to mutate now thru our over and unnecessary use of vaccines.

As a side note - i have had flu vaccines twice and been really ill with flu both times as a result - the following years where i did not get flu jabs - i ended up with mild flu/bad colds nothing more, now that may sound irresponsible but if ppl with real flu etc didn't think it was heroic to go to work whilst infected and spread it - then these problems wouldn't be so bad for the general population.

All things to be chewed over

MTFBWY -A

When I first started this thread.I wanted to find all things that could relate or could be interpreted in to Jediism.

I have just watched 12 Angry Men for the second time in my life.The first time I saw this movie I was in Middle School and I only got what most people get from a movie...entertainment.

Now I'm much older and can now grasp the deeper meaning and see the bigger picture.Why? because in this movie I watched one man stand alone against 12 other men and defend his point to the very end.Slowly people started to agree with him and see his side of things. I myself have been in such a position.I know how overwhelming it can be to stand alone against the world.This movie is so powerful but only to the ones that look for it power.So I recommend this movie not only as a \"Must see movie\" but maybe in time as it could be come a lesson we teach or a reference we use.

12 Angry Men Is a Movie about a jury made up of 12 men that have to decide whether a boy accused of murder is to be sent to \"The Chair\" or set free.At the start of the movie the men take a vote to find out if the boy is guilty or not guilty.The vote end in a 11 to 1 split in favor of Guilty.Now one man must defend his opinion against 11 other men that want nothing more but to get this case done and over with as soon as possible.

The Theory of everything


The theory of everything basically says that EVERY thing is a part of one force field. Much like our description of the force. All thow it is still just a theory it has had much time and energy put in to it. Albert Einstein put a great deal of effort in to this Theory before his death.

To the readers: This is an issue that I would very much like to talk about with all of you. If you could give me your opinion on this matter it would be of great help to me.

---

I'd like to take the time to point out some thing that I've noticed.

I've been working really hard to help the people in my circle understand why I chose to be a part of this religion. Its just not an easy thing to do. They keep comparing me to a Trekkie. People just cant let go of the fact that we follow some thing that \"resembles\" things talked about in the movies (Star wars) I've spent days and talk to lots of people about my religion yet there was no hope. The only thing they did understand is that I didn't want to convert them. So at least they know we wont show up at their door every sunday. ^.^
I was almost ready to give up hope. How ever during one conversation some thing slipped out of my mouth. It was strange because I would have never thought of this. It was as if the Force spoke for me. People could not stop comparing Star Wars and Jediism and I dont blame them. So I went with it. I said \"OK look, We view the Star Wars movies to be the same thing as veggie tales.\" All of the sudden it was clear. From then on any time I explain the differences (and similarities) So long as I tell them that the movies are just movies like veggie tales the tend to understand.

Now there is a problem. Its a problem that I try to avoid when talking about Jediism. I use the word \"We\" without first knowing if the rest of you agreed. Now I feel that I've either found an easy way to help others understand or I've done permanent damage to Jediis.

So I'd like to know thats the way we should view the Star Wars movies? As a means for new follower to learn the basics of our religion but also to be entertained,much like the the veggie tales movies. One good point is that thats one thing George Lucas said in one of this interviews. That the star wars films was meant to get young people to start thinking about religion or that it would appeal to them.

What the hell is 'Veggie Tales' ?

That aside - the simplest method i think is to say Star Wars provides an excellent source of 'parables' and the like.

Also - just point out that mr Lucas (all rights reserved) didnt just 'dream up' the story as such - he based it on existing material and material thats been around for millennia (or millennium falcon )

If you said you were a 'witch' would they say youve been watching too much harry potter?

If you said you were christian - would they say youve been watching 'the life of brian'

The problem with Jediism is the name - if we called it (plucking dumb name from thin air) 'cloud cookoolandism' would people have as much to say about it?

Ask anyone what springs to mind about starwars they will 99% of the time say lightsabers - then ask em where the 'idea' of the lightsaber came from - the symbolism etc and they will not a single clue.

As weve said before - the 'stigma' is our cross to bear - our 'burden'

Bear it with pride

MTFBWY - A

Good on ya mate. Way to hold your space.

I don't think the Living Force cares what it's followers call themselves. I think the word Jedi brings a certain levity when put into religous context. Because we do not have mitochlorian and lightsabers or intergalactic travel, we have to find something else to earn our stripes. Not to offend anyone, the movies are not our bible or sacred text, maybe to some Pure landers, but not to all of us.

We use the Jedi name as a point of reference to those not in the order. All religions come from myth.

Really it takes a certain perspective or attitutde to get past societal labels. This is at the heart of the Jedi order, the synergy of different religions into practical spirituality.

We are making up as we go, but at least we are tryin...

MTFBWY