This vs That.

scott777ab wrote: :blink:

ok whatever............!



Going to end with this.

All scripture is inspired by God.

That is a verse from the bible which all the religions I mentioned do believe.

That word inspired means GOD BREATHED.
Literally it means FROM GOD.

So say what you want, but the bible itself says it is from GOD.

2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God,, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness.


This verse states many things.

That scripture all of it comes from GOD
That scripture is profitable for doctrine.
That scripture is profitable for reproof.
That scripture is profitable for instruction in righteousness.

If you can not see that then you don't understand the bible at all.
Go back to the beginning.

O side note... not related to this train of thought, I have two questions for you.

#1 What is the REAL NAME of the first woman in the bible, and NO IT IS NOT EVE. That is not her REAL NAME.

#2 I am not sure which is clean or unclean so this is an example only. But for this question lets say the CAT is a CLEAN animal and the DOG is UNCLEAN, and assume that there is only 1 Breed of Cat and 1 Breed of Dog for Noah to contend with.
How many Cats did Noah bring with him? NO THE ANSWER IS NOT 2.
How many Dogs did Noah bring with him? NO THE ANSWER IS NOT 2.

just because the bible says it, doesn't mean all the religions you mentioned believe it!

EOC doesn't believe everything in the bible.

The bible itself says it's from God, yes.
not the point, because that's not what is believed
because a human wrote that

and that's not even what it means

it means that the bible is part of his plan

Jesus himself, in the bible, criticized people who take sola scriptora


you missed the point, Paul wrote that, a man who was very very radical.

should we trust every single word he says?


and I understand the bible, you seem to have an understanding too


1. Orthodox christianity and Old and ecumenical Catholicism don't trust every single word of the bible, and they have alot of evidence from even within the bible as to why.

2. Christians as an established religion, long before Augustine and Calvin who were both crazy and wrong and focused mainly on what Paul said, believed the Bible to be good, but not perfect.


and I am not answering those questions, because they aren't even related to the point, and if you say one more time that christians believe only what the bible says with no evidence, then I'm done

suliskveteba wrote: just because the bible says it, doesn't mean all the religions you mentioned believe it!

Then they have no basis at all for their belief system.

suliskveteba wrote: EOC doesn't believe everything in the bible.

what is EOC?

suliskveteba wrote: The bible itself says it's from God, yes.
not the point, because that's not what is believed
because a human wrote that

That is not what christians believe.

Here are a few more verses that speak about the bible being from God.
2Sa 23:2 The Spirit of the LORD spake by me, and his word [was] in my tongue.
Mat 22:31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
Mat 22:32 I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
Mar 12:24 And Jesus answering said unto them, Do ye not therefore err, because ye know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?
Mar 12:36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
Jhn 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
Act 1:16 Men [and] brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, which the Holy Ghost by the mouth of David spake before concerning Judas, which was guide to them that took Jesus.
Psa 119:130 The entrance of thy words giveth light; it giveth understanding unto the simple.
1Cr 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.
Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Eph 4:14 That we [henceforth] be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, [and] cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
Eph 4:15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, [even] Christ:
Eph 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
2Ti 3:16 — All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
Pro 6:23 For the commandment [is] a lamp; and the law [is] light; and reproofs of instruction [are] the way of life:
Pro 15:10 Correction [is] grievous unto him that forsaketh the way: [and] he that hateth reproof shall die.
2Ti 2:25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
Deu 4:36 Out of heaven he made thee to hear his voice, that he might instruct thee: and upon earth he shewed thee his great fire; and thou heardest his words out of the midst of the fire.
Act 18:25 This man was instructed in the way of the Lord; and being fervent in the spirit, he spake and taught diligently the things of the Lord, knowing only the baptism of John.

If you don't get it, you never will.

suliskveteba wrote: and that's not even what it means

Really?

suliskveteba wrote: it means that the bible is part of his plan

Scripture to prove your point please.

suliskveteba wrote: Jesus himself, in the bible, criticized people who take sola scriptora

Where?

suliskveteba wrote: you missed the point, Paul wrote that, a man who was very very radical.

What he wrote is that he and all other writers were inspired of God. THat is lke me saying to you. Suliskveteba write this down, "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." Is there any room there for personal interpetion? No there is not. That is what the bible in many places says of itself.

suliskveteba wrote: should we trust every single word he says?

According to the bible the answer to that question is YES.

suliskveteba wrote: and I understand the bible, you seem to have an understanding too

Funny part of that is this, we both could be wrong.

suliskveteba wrote: 1. Orthodox christianity and Old and ecumenical Catholicism don't trust every single word of the bible, and they have alot of evidence from even within the bible as to why.

Evidence please.

suliskveteba wrote: 2. Christians as an established religion, long before Augustine and Calvin who were both crazy and wrong and focused mainly on what Paul said, believed the Bible to be good, but not perfect.

No your fostering an opinion by saying Augustine and Calvin were wrong without providing evidence of your own. You require it of me, now so do I require it of you.

suliskveteba wrote: and I am not answering those questions, because they aren't even related to the point,

Did not think you would or even could.

suliskveteba wrote: and if you say one more time that christians believe only what the bible says with no evidence, then I'm done

CHRISTIANS believe only what the bible says, and they do consider all other texts such as the Koran etc as the works of Satan.

you are still, yet again talking about protestantism

no matter how many times I told you I did
no matter how many times I told you the structure of orthodoxy about the bible


but I refuse to deal with somebody who won't listen to something simple like that.

I'll direct you to another orthodox christian more willing to debate than me
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foIXan6l7Xo

this guy is a devout orthodox christian

with research from other orthodox christians, including an archbishop of the church

the orthodox church is the second largest subscription of christianity

as an orthodox christian, myself I can say we don't believe what you have accused us of

but your arrogance has exhausted me

still wanna argue?

take it up with yusuf, he is more than happy to

I'm done

I hope your path in jediism is prosperous and I wish the best for you


but I can honestly say even though I am not angry, your failure to listen has insulted me and I'm done

For this point I have to make a few statements, not that I personally believe them, but so that you can understand what I will be saying.

For this point, assume these things as true, not saying they are, but just assume they are.

1. They bible is directly from God, and has no errors, and no tweaks from man.
(Baptists believe that.)


According to that one simple statement if it is true. Then ORTHODOX CHRISTIANITY IS SATANIC.

Bible demands prayer goes to god only, through Jesus.... NOT MARY.
And that is all that needs to be said about Catholic or any other so-called christian religion that puts an intercessory between man and god beside Jesus.

I can go on but need not to.

Shall I do a break down now of how each christian religion actually picks and chooses verses to build their own belief system?

scott777ab wrote: Shall I do a break down now of how each christian religion actually picks and chooses verses to build their own belief system?

as I said before, I know christian history, I have been studying it for seven years.......

I have never denied that some denominations do this!

and if you desperately need to argue your points, I gave you the man

he is happy to do it....... I am not

why? because you haven't listened to a thing that I needed you to hear

just kept recycling your obselete points, and I can't be bothered to deal with it

my friend, yusuf is much more experienced in dealing with people like you

so, once again and please understand, I'm done, and farewell

Yusuf is happy to do what you have exhausted me on.

I bid you farewell, I hope your studies truly go well, and I will pray for you as I pray for everybody here, maybe we can be friends one day

but, I'm gone, if anybody here would like to continue this topic with scott, go ahead

but I'm done

Only 7 Years? Wow. I've been studying it for the past 20 plus years. I am 43 now, 44 in October, and have been studying it sense I was 20. I have also personally been a Baptist, been a Mormon, been a Jehovahs Witness, and been a pentecostal. And during that time I have studied the Catholic system. I know what I am talking about when I say, "THEY ALL PICK AND CHOOSE."

scott777ab wrote: Shall I do a break down now of how each christian religion actually picks and chooses verses to build their own belief system?

It would be interesting to see how some of the Christians here respond to such a claim, I'd wager. Especially since they don't all regard Scripture the same way.

scott777ab wrote: I've been studying it for the past 20 plus years. I am 43 now, 44 in October, and have been studying it sense I was 20.

I've studied Christianity in its various forms for twenty-five, but that doesn't mean that I know everything about every branch and sect. There are two thousand years of Christendom, and we've studied 2% of that time between us. We may each know a lot, but our ignorance is still boundless on the topic. There isn't enough time for one person to learn enough about a thing to deal in absolutes with regularity.

scott777ab wrote: I have also personally been a Baptist, been a Mormon, been a Jehovahs Witness, and been a pentecostal...I know what I am talking about when I say, "THEY ALL PICK AND CHOOSE."

It bears mentioning that I know octogenarians who have stuck with a single sect of Christendom for over sixty years, and they still don't know anything about it. Being a member of multiple groups over twenty years doesn't automatically make you a qualified expert, it just means you've experienced portions of those faiths firsthand. Short of going to a seminary or multiple decades spent in intensive study, it is very hard to really "get" a religion in a detailed theological sense. Through experience, one can achieve personal revelation and broad knowledge, but your neighbor two pews down may view things differently, given the exact same text.

I'm not quite certain how the discussion has reached this point, but it seems that it is on the brink of taking an unfriendly tone, and I should very much like for it to avoid that. I hope my points provoke thought, however, before this discussion continues.

Ego.

steamboat28 wrote:

scott777ab wrote: Shall I do a break down now of how each christian religion actually picks and chooses verses to build their own belief system?

It would be interesting to see how some of the Christians here respond to such a claim, I'd wager. Especially since they don't all regard Scripture the same way.

scott777ab wrote: I've been studying it for the past 20 plus years. I am 43 now, 44 in October, and have been studying it sense I was 20.

I've studied Christianity in its various forms for twenty-five, but that doesn't mean that I know everything about every branch and sect. There are two thousand years of Christendom, and we've studied 2% of that time between us. We may each know a lot, but our ignorance is still boundless on the topic. There isn't enough time for one person to learn enough about a thing to deal in absolutes with regularity.

scott777ab wrote: I have also personally been a Baptist, been a Mormon, been a Jehovahs Witness, and been a pentecostal...I know what I am talking about when I say, "THEY ALL PICK AND CHOOSE."

It bears mentioning that I know octogenarians who have stuck with a single sect of Christendom for over sixty years, and they still don't know anything about it. Being a member of multiple groups over twenty years doesn't automatically make you a qualified expert, it just means you've experienced portions of those faiths firsthand. Short of going to a seminary or multiple decades spent in intensive study, it is very hard to really "get" a religion in a detailed theological sense. Through experience, one can achieve personal revelation and broad knowledge, but your neighbor two pews down may view things differently, given the exact same text.

I'm not quite certain how the discussion has reached this point, but it seems that it is on the brink of taking an unfriendly tone, and I should very much like for it to avoid that. I hope my points provoke thought, however, before this discussion continues.

The unfriendly tone is the one thing I am trying to avoid. I've just felt this whole time as though suliskveteba seems to me as a know-it-all. I stated early on that I was only talking about Christianity as it appears here in the USA. I was not implying that Christianity was a western religion or anything of that nature. The second point I was making is that trying to compare any religion with another is like comparing a rock with an orange. Yes you could find similarities, but each faith is so different from the other that each stands out apart from its neighbor.

@Elementry it has nothing to do with Ego. I did not mention how long I have been studying Christianity until suliskveteba did.