How many practice telekinesis?

Saying something is possibly true because we can't prove it doesn't exist is one of the worst falacies that there are there in the world.

I prefer the safe path. If I can't prove something exists, and/or I don't have enough empirical experience to say that the evidences I've seen about it are enough (sometimes, for me, they are, sometimes, they aren't), then I prefer to assume it doesn't exist.

I would think there's much more evidence for telekinesis than magic, given that telkienesis is more easily recorded, more commonly used ect. However I think it's rather arrogant and illogical to assume something doesn't exist just because you personally never saw it. We couldn't see germs for most of our history. Does that mean those germs never existed? Did cells not exist until we had a means of looking at them? No, they always existed but found out ways of looking into it. The 3rd eye is often known as the "lense" we need to see spirits, energy, ect.

I remember my 4 friends went out at night after hanging out and came across something that was animal like but with human qualities. If anyone is familiar with The Pope Lick Monster you know what I'm talking about. What they saw was a bipedal person running from a little hill jumped off and kept running at a very fast speed and only briefly saw it with the headlights. They saw it had an elongated face like a goat., human hands and goat-like legs It didn't seem human as it moved much faster and didn't even slow down when they saw the shadow jump from the hill. They came home to tell me about it. All 4 saw it and none of them were drunk or high. And they weren't the only ones on the entire planet that saw such a thing. And I seriously doubt a guy with a goat costume was running around in the middle of the night. And it wouldn't move so fast either. I think about these stories and perhaps they did see something like that. I think it's entirely possible. We haven't even begun to discover the Earth. We're still discovering new species. Who's to say this wasn't part of some elusive species we haven't discovered yet?

This thread, interesting it has become. More to this, I think there is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hb54AqQGYvA

Yabuturtle wrote: I think it was in one of the Thor movies, and I know this is just a movie but did say things that stuck with me "Your ancestors called it magic, you call it science. I come froma world where they are one and the same."

This is the first in an interesting lecture series which talks about the historical distinctions to some extent;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K3Zx-qcNZf4

I'm just saying it is not impossible. I guess the best way is to search and find someone who is supposed to be knowledgeable of the practice and see for it yourself. There will be some frauds. I'm not going to pretend every video involving telekinesis is real. Just like I don't except every psychic to really be psychic. I've known real actual psychics before. How they know the stuff they know, I can't say. But I know with my experiences with them for years, when they pin pointed by relationship with my family, the things of yet to come ect. I seriously doubt all of those times were just lucky guesses and crazy coincidences. Now when I've had a reading with a medium, they weren't 100% accurate, but then, nobody is anyway. I'd say 90-95% of the time they were accurate.

Yabuturtle, I've been reading through this entire thread, and your argument has the least weight behind it, and its not because these things don't exist (they may very well do), the problem here isn't whether they do or they do not, its your lack of evidence, and the simple fact you have restated practically the same things over and over and not drawn a conclusion.

A conclusion is a ending argument, which is a natural part of debating, and/or civilized argument. And to keep regurgitating the same opinions over and over leads this discussion nowhere. So, in closing, develop a better case in which you can present some hard evidence, or please let it rest....

Yabuturtle wrote: I guess the best way is to search and find someone who is supposed to be knowledgeable of the practice and see for it yourself.

Actually, no, that is not the best way, and here is why: First, you'd have to gauge who is and is not supposed to be knowledgeable of the practice, and for that you need to have a mechanism by which to tell the frauds from the genuines. The presence of that mechanism however makes your person obsolete to the process though. To see for oneself is seldm a reliable method for such things, because oneself is never completely unbiased, never infallible and never immune to all deception. A much better way is having a group of highly diverse people for judges, an even better way is to have proper machines to take the measurements in the human's stead and even these ways are not perfect. But personal testimony is one of the least reliable ways of them all, frankly.

... I don't except every psychic to really be psychic. I've known real actual psychics before. How they know the stuff they know, I can't say.

Wait, hang on... So are you saying you don't see how they know those things or did you just say you do and that way was psychic powers? Come on now, you can't have it both ways, that'd be just another argument from incredulity fallacy.

But I know with my experiences with them for years, when they pin pointed by [sic] relationship with my family, the things of yet to come ect. I seriously doubt all of those times were just lucky guesses and crazy coincidences.

Fair enough. Now, to all of us that is still hearsay so long as we don't know any specific quotes and time stamps, but I'm willing to grant you that it happened. Now, how exactly did you eliminate educated guesses as opposed to lucky ones? What if these people were trained to observe signs the regular person seldom sees? Are you absolutely certain their predictions were not a matter of interpretation nor open-ended? You see, I'm not saying they were probably frauds, I'm asking you how you came to the conclusion that the only way it is possible for them to have been successful is sorcery. Have you tested their powers on people they did not know, too?

Now when I've had a reading with a medium, they weren't 100% accurate, but then, nobody is anyway. I'd say 90-95% of the time they were accurate.

Well, in order to put a number like that on there we need at least 20 highly specific prophesies, recorded at the time of making, of uncommon and reasonably unrelated future events that could only be fulfilled by one event and no other, which means the prediction must contain a sufficiently small time interval when it be fulfilled and a sufficiently small space where it would be. Mathematically speaking chance alone could still produce that result, unlikely though it would be, but if this is data you are able to produce we would have something on our hands we can actually work with. It is then that we would begin to ask "how exactly did they do that?", and even then we would have to rule a lot of things out before tentatively concluding it was psychic powers.

Gisteron wrote: First, you'd have to gauge who is and is not supposed to be knowledgeable of the practice, and for that you need to have a mechanism by which to tell the frauds from the genuines. The presence of that mechanism however makes your person obsolete to the process though. To see for oneself is seldm a reliable method for such things, because oneself is never completely unbiased, never infallible and never immune to all deception. A much better way is having a group of highly diverse people for judges, an even better way is to have proper machines to take the measurements in the human's stead and even these ways are not perfect.

I just wanted to mention on this point that I watched a pretty cool documentary a few months ago, called "An Honest Liar," which is the story of James Randi. One thing he did was to recruit some young stage magicians to claim they could perform telekinesis, and they were able to fool a team of scientists studying them in what was believed to be a controlled environment for months, until the guilt of deceiving everybody weighed on them too much and they confessed. Those performing the experiments kept making it harder and harder for them to deceive, but they were still able to find ways around it.

Zenchi wrote: Yabuturtle, I've been reading through this entire thread, and your argument has the least weight behind it, and its not because these things don't exist (they may very well do), the problem here isn't whether they do or they do not, its your lack of evidence, and the simple fact you have restated practically the same things over and over and not drawn a conclusion.

A conclusion is a ending argument, which is a natural part of debating, and/or civilized argument. And to keep regurgitating the same opinions over and over leads this discussion nowhere. So, in closing, develop a better case in which you can present some hard evidence, or please let it rest....

I already know some people doubt it due to lack of evidence. I'm telling you some of my experiences. That I know of magic, psychics ect. I can't really prove that anyway on here. What do people want me to do? Make a video? I am not what you'd call an expert on telekinesis so I couldn't do it and if I recorded it you probably wouldn't believe me anyway. Because someone will say it's fake. This thread was not here to convince people, I'm telling you my experiences some people who have been known to practice it ect and people can believe me or not. Not that it matters because I don't want to try to convince anyone. Really it doesn't matter so much to me. All I asked is if there were any that practiced it since some Jedi have been known to practice it. Give what a rest? I'm just asking if anyone practices it, not if anyone believes it is real. It was to ask who practiced it and I find it strange that people who don't believe such powers exist would comment.

It would be like if I went to a Christian thread and said "Jesus doesn't exist you know" Wouldn't that be kind of rude? Why would people who disbelieve go to a thread to proclaim they disbelieve?

Yabuturtle wrote:

Zenchi wrote: Yabuturtle, I've been reading through this entire thread, and your argument has the least weight behind it, and its not because these things don't exist (they may very well do), the problem here isn't whether they do or they do not, its your lack of evidence, and the simple fact you have restated practically the same things over and over and not drawn a conclusion.

A conclusion is a ending argument, which is a natural part of debating, and/or civilized argument. And to keep regurgitating the same opinions over and over leads this discussion nowhere. So, in closing, develop a better case in which you can present some hard evidence, or please let it rest....

I already know some people doubt it due to lack of evidence. I'm telling you some of my experiences. That I know of magic, psychics ect. I can't really prove that anyway on here. What do people want me to do? Make a video? I am not what you'd call an expert on telekinesis so I couldn't do it and if I recorded it you probably wouldn't believe me anyway. Because someone will say it's fake. This thread was not here to convince people, I'm telling you my experiences some people who have been known to practice it ect and people can believe me or not. Not that it matters because I don't want to try to convince anyone. Really it doesn't matter so much to me. All I asked is if there were any that practiced it since some Jedi have been known to practice it. Give what a rest? I'm just asking if anyone practices it, not if anyone believes it is real. It was to ask who practiced it and I find it strange that people who don't believe such powers exist would comment.

It would be like if I went to a Christian thread and said "Jesus doesn't exist you know" Wouldn't that be kind of rude? Why would people who disbelieve go to a thread to proclaim they disbelieve?

Obviously you've missed my point. When does it become pointless, you voice your opinion and you keep stating the same thing, this is no longer becoming a discussion, but an unintelligent regurgitation of opinion. Why continue? You stated you don't want to convince anyone but all you're doing is beating a dead horse in the attempt.

I want to state that quite a few of the members here have dabbled or practiced with magic in the past, or continue to do so within their path. It shouldn't even be put in the same field as telekinesis. Shouldn't even be brought up in the same discussion because they really have nothing to do with each other. So for the record, nobody here practices telekinesis, (if they do they're not speaking up) if that's what you came looking for, your at the wrong site. I hope you don't take my replies as aggressive behavior, I am being as civil as it gets, thank you...