Rants far and wide

ren wrote:

CryojenX wrote:

ren wrote: Transwomen who threaten men with violence and public shaming should face fair trial and receive an appropriate sentence.<sup>1


1</sup> I say this after reading someone's very grotesque comment while browsing totjo last night.

It would be nice if trans women who don't commit crimes at all could get a fair trial, however I do agree with your statement.

Correction it'd be nice if everyone got a fair trial. It just takes one unfair instance to make the whole system unfair.

Not a correction. It would be nice if no crimes were committed by anyone ever, thereby forgoing the need of a trial (I can play your silly game too if need be). I replied to your post about trans women receiving a fair trial. Simply because I single trans women out for a single post does not mean I have such limited mental capacity to be unable to grasp the concept of equality under the law for everyone, and to assume otherwise is a ridiculous assumption to make. That mindset reeks of the person who does nothing but correcting people's grammar and spelling, and is rarely ever productive.

There is a lot of hate here.

Was the purpose of been a jedi not to control our fears and hate?

I was just about to ask why this thread even exists.

rant‌ (rănt)
‌v.‌ ‌rant·ed‌, ‌rant·ing‌, ‌rants‌
‌v.‌‌intr.‌
To speak or write in an angry or violent manner; rave.
‌v.‌‌tr.‌
To utter or express with violence or extravagance: ‌a dictator who ranted his vitriol onto a captive audience.‌
‌n.‌
‌1. ‌ Violent or extravagant speech or writing.
‌2. ‌ A speech or piece of writing that incites anger or violence: ‌"The vast majority [of teenagers logged onto the Internet] did not encounter recipes for pipe bombs or deranged rants about white supremacy"‌ ‌(Daniel Okrent).‌
‌3. ‌ ‌Chiefly British‌ Wild or uproarious merriment.

[Probably from obsolete Dutch ranten.]

‌rant′er‌‌ n.‌
‌The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
‌rant‌ (rænt)
‌vb‌
‌1. ‌to utter (something) in loud, violent, or bombastic tones
‌2. ‌ (‌intr‌) ‌Scot‌ to make merry; frolic
‌n‌
‌3. ‌loud, declamatory, or extravagant speech; bombast
‌4. ‌‌Scot‌ a wild revel
‌5. ‌‌Scot‌ an energetic dance or its tune
[C16: from Dutch ‌ranten‌ to rave; related to German ‌ranzen‌ to gambol]
‌ˈranter‌ ‌n‌ ‌ˈranting‌ ‌adj‌, ‌n‌ ‌ˈrantingly‌ ‌adv‌
‌Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged

‌rant‌ (rænt)

‌v.i. ‌
‌ 1. ‌ to speak or declaim extravagantly or violently; talk wildly; rave.
‌v.t. ‌
‌ 2. ‌ to utter or declaim in a ranting manner.
‌n. ‌
‌ 3. ‌ extravagant or vehement declamation.
‌ 4. ‌ a ranting speech or other utterance.
[1590–1600; < Dutch ‌ranten‌ (obsolete) to talk foolishly]
‌rant′er,‌ ‌n. ‌
‌rant′ing•ly,‌ ‌adv. ‌
‌Random House Kernerman Webster's College Dictionary,

A rant thread seems by its very nature to be completely counter to the aims of the Temple, let alone having a rant thread and then correcting people for the hyperbole contained within, when hyperbole is one of the features of most ranting to begin with. No longer dignifying this thread with any more posts.

Actually, this thread was for venting ...

Not entirely in-congruent to Jedi principles : we have negative feelings and meditation is not the only answer to them. We do not "stink" of "Jedi" (a reference to "stinking" of Zen).

Think of it more as the 'Wailing Wall' in Jerusalem : we whine here and it is supposed to be whining with other people, not ranting at other people. We all have difficulties. Public display of them is ritualising that common ground.

The TotJO is indeed a sanctuary, but in order for it to serve as such, one has come in here to rest from the struggles of the World outside. If one brings the actual fight of the causes one champions out there in here, there is no more sanctuary.

So, ranting is fine -- DO NOT RESPOND to other peoples' rants. They are only to vent, not to debate ...

Gettin' real tired of people accusing me of things they're just as guilty of. Gettin' real tired of being ignored when I do things the "right way", and then, when I get frustrated with that, being called names and openly insulted for doing things in a way that actually gets attention. Gettin' real tired of complacency for complacency's sake, people who hate change without being able to recognize that sometimes it's necessary, hypocrisy, uptight people who claim they're laid back, and everybody being so damn touchy and getting so personally butthurt with things that literally have nothing to do with them.

If I hadn't promised people I wouldn't leave it, I'd set fire to every bridge that leads to this situation so nobody else would ever have to deal with this sheer amount of nonsense and circlejerking.

Redanketon wrote: There is a lot of hate here.

Was the purpose of been a jedi not to control our fears and hate?

Not all of us are finished growing into the Jedi we aspire to be. :laugh:

Seriously though, I'm the one who fueled this into something it should not have been. I could have ignored it and this whole thing would have looked very differently (or maybe not, somebody else might have done something similar to what I did).

My point is: I reacted in anger and said some things that, although they made me feel better in the moment, do not reflect the "best practices" of a Jedi. So, my young friend, I thank you for reminding me where my head should be.

Jamie Stick wrote:

Redanketon wrote: There is a lot of hate here.

Was the purpose of been a jedi not to control our fears and hate?

Not all of us are finished growing into the Jedi we aspire to be. :laugh:

That is why I say, "We are practicing Jedi, not perfect Jedi..." :lol:

Proteus posted in the "Grateful thread, and said:

Proteus wrote: http://www.templeofthejediorder.org/forum/Miscellaneous/105316-the-grateful-thread?start=130#202905

Since I've posted in the rant thread recently, it's only fair to post here

I loved that...

Because as our friend Rickie would say, "Its all about the ying-yang baby!"

We all should be as smart as Proteus on that point...

Gotta throw my two cents in here....

I totally understand the need to vent. It is very satisfying and makes us feel better. It's natural to want to express our frustration. However, I have always believed that expressing negative emotions negatively tends to make it more likely that we will react in the same way in the future. This may or may not be true.

People will always need to blow off some steam but it is all too easy to simply leave it at that. What makes ranting valuable is that it TELLS US WHAT IS FRUSTRATING US! Anger is a sign that there is something hurting or scaring us. Anger is always secondary to some other emotion.

Because of this, ranting or venting is awesome if it leads to our discovery of what we need TO DO about the problem, or how we need to adapt to that which we cannot change. It can tell us what we need to be taking responsibility for within our own perceptions, expectations, and relationships. In this sense, even a Jedi can rant and maybe even rave, as long as it's used for good in the end and doesn't harm anyone in the process.

Lastly, I am very new here, and I apologize if I am overstepping, but I have seen a lot of name calling, sarcasm, and passive aggression displayed on this thread towards our fellow Jedi. For those engaging in this it may be a good opportunity to practice feeling the Force and strive first to understand, but that's entirely up to you. However I also believe that as soon as you are blaming someone else for something you are giving up your ability to make a change, or are putting the responsibility for change on someone else.

Rant over.....

I think the South Park episode was important. The overly politically correct people in the world aren't a good thing. Let people be offended. Say what you want about me. It is my choice to be offended by what you say or not. Freedom of speech means that nobody has the right to never hear what they don't want to hear. So let people act how they want to act, you act how you want to act, and relax.

TheDude wrote: I think the South Park episode was important. The overly politically correct people in the world aren't a good thing. Let people be offended. Say what you want about me. It is my choice to be offended by what you say or not. Freedom of speech means that nobody has the right to never hear what they don't want to hear. So let people act how they want to act, you act how you want to act, and relax.

I agree...

However, further extrapolate that...

Call me what you like, but, I may like to be offended, so then I will retaliate... Thats my right, correct? If nothing more than to point out how rude that be taken... I am offering some constructive criticism... Not falling into the accusatory ways I feel I am seeing...

Now if I retaliate with words alone, then more than likely, you will return the volly with more words, until the first of us 'isnt playing this game' and feels like we are on the 'high road' for getting out when we did, and the other may feel like 'they won'...

There are still ways of communicating and doing things that are less offensive than others... And if you offend? freaking apologize, unless of course you are in love with your ego, and think your poop dont stink... Cause you be the jedi-y-ist jedi to ever jedi... :lol:... Otherwise, why create all that negative energy? Those nasty exchanges I bring up in the next paragraph or so, leave me wrecked... Ask some of my close friends...

But, instead of words, could be the pop in the mouth I give you... Turn around an punch you right in the kisser.... People think that laws are what keeps us all polite, and when they open there big, unthinking mouths, they have to expect an ass whooping... Becasue that guy you are talking to, may not be 'all enlightened and shit' nor looking for it.... Yea, I may get arrested, but guess what? Its a fine... And, I might find it worth $100-$500 worth of my money to teach some little jerk some manners... Decisions, decisions... :woohoo:...

Some of us, actually try to not be offensive, and only use it as a last resort... Sometimes it is the only way to get things done... Or get a point across...

Sometimes, it is just lazyness on the part of the rude person....

IN a recent thread, I was kind of, not-nice... Actually, twice recently, and yet, out of the 10K posts Ive made, and way higher number conversations, you will find probably less than 5A% were me being that way... (Id say less than .01%, as I am generally nice to even the rudest folks [think James Bond to his villian], I have no statistics for 'proof') Its not necessary, and the one I am talking to might pop me in the mouth... Or in the case of TOTJO, decide that we are all like that, and not want to stay...

tl:dr- You have the right to do and say what you want. You also have the right to live with the consequences of those decisions... Including, the Ultra PC people telling you its not PC... Dont want to hear them, dont 'offend' them... You actually control their response to a point... Think of it that way...

You do control some of the waves in your ocean...

Can someone define "ultra-PC" for me? Because all I can imagine is someone who, given the choice, chooses to use terminology others don't find personally offensive... which seems pretty Jedi, to me.

If you have a choice of phrases and one offends less people, why not use that one? The notion of "I'll say what I like, how I like, and I don't have to care who it hurts" seems impressively lazy and self-centred to me. Having the right to say whatever you want doesn't automatically require you to be a dick.

I believe it's the role of Jedi to cultivate harmony. Taking responsibility for the things we say and how we choose to say them is a significant part of that, it seems to me. It's hard to be diplomatic or a force for mediation when you're outraging the people you're supposedly out to help, because you didn't feel it necessary to choose the appropriate words for the situation.

tzb wrote: Can someone define "ultra-PC" for me?



Because all I can imagine is someone who, given the choice, chooses to use terminology others don't find personally offensive... which seems pretty Jedi, to me.

Ever hear the term: "no worse non-smoker than an ex-smoker"?

For those that have not, ex-smokers have this tendency to be vocal (more so than never-smokers) about the dangers, and the illnesses, and get all worked up about smoking even being around them...

I smoked for 20 years, stopped about 6-8 years ago... I was one too fora time, lol...

By 'Ultra PC', I mean the "PC Police', who are worried about you offending anyone, anywhere, at anytime...

If you have a choice of phrases and one offends less people, why not use that one? The notion of "I'll say what I like, how I like, and I don't have to care who it hurts" seems impressively lazy and self-centred to me. Having the right to say whatever you want doesn't automatically require you to be a dick.

I believe it's the role of Jedi to cultivate harmony. Taking responsibility for the things we say and how we choose to say them is a significant part of that, it seems to me. It's hard to be diplomatic or a force for mediation when you're outraging the people you're supposedly out to help, because you didn't feel it necessary to choose the appropriate words for the situation.

Agreed...

Better said than I said it... lol...

someone said this to me recently

" its just part of my Jedi path to assert a higher degree of care to the rest of the society then what might be normal for the internet."

that's a snippet of a broader conversation obviously but its appropriate

ive offended people here myself and I can tell you that its not an easy thing to live down

as jedi it IS important to be aware and disciplined in how we present ourselves and how we treat others

theres a principle behind these things which is bigger than just "PC'

to my mind, "PC", or "ultra PC" is when someone ignores or even censors the meaningful and important topics or ideas because they are or can be uncomfortable to someone EVEN THOUGH they are important topics or ideas

"JERK" is when someone just takes the conversation and makes it uncomfortable because they are stuck in "conflict mode" or "I don't give a sh*t mode" or whatever

Jestor....I'm wondering if this conversation here should split? Its...kind of off topic from the OP's purpose.

I see your point, but I think this has ran its course as well...

I do personally feel like mine is/was a rant... Or as 'ranty' as I get, lol...

I dobt very much we will have to wait very long for the next, rant, unrelated to this little derail...

If Im wrong, I'll split...

As you say *bows*

I just interviewed a person who said the word "like" 43 times and "ya know" 38 times in a 10 minute conversation. It got, like, really annoying, ya know?

When I'm only halfway through the first planet after Telos, and I've already apprenticed bao-dur and atton, got visas on the team, know about kreia/revan, and rebuilt hk-47.

People who are far too serious that they feel new members to a community or group saying "Thank You" is 'Irrelevant' and 'non-productive' to the groups theme. :blink: