A Problem.

You Are correct, I do not know everyone here, as you said; muchless yourself. However, just because I do not know a person does not mean I cannot show them respect or respect their opinions and or beliefs. As you pointed out, I do not know you. However, I respect your opinion as you have given it, as it is your opinion and you are entitled to it. I'm not trying to get people to believe me, i'm just sharing my opinion just like everyone else. I believe that you can respect people you do not know. people do it all the time. I've walked down the street and greeted a stranger and there have been times a stranger has greeted me. even in it's smallest form a greeting is a form of kindness and respect.

steamboat28 wrote:

Someone wrote: That doesn't seem very Jedi...

This sentence holds us back. This sentence keeps us from being who we should be. And no matter how often it's true, or how overwhelmingly true it is, it is never, ever the right thing to say.

By saying this sentence, you are firstly engaging in the " No True Scotsman " fallacy, which should be enough to stop most rational thinking beings in their tracks. If you don't understand why logical fallacies are a bad thing, we'll get to that in another post at another time.

We're all Jedi here, so saying this wretched statement implies that we're not "real" Jedi or "good" Jedi, which is some arbitrary ridiculousness that we reserve for perfect beings, none of which populate this particular Temple. We are all human. We all make mistakes--some of us more often than others, granted, but none of us are immune. We're all working toward the same goal here, too, so undercutting someone's progress when they slip is, itself, not very "Jedi" if we're going to point that finger.

It also reeks of that "holier-than-thou" crap most of us cite as a contributing factor to leaving other paths behind. If someone "isn't very Jedi", and you're pointing it out, you must be SOOOO much more Jedi than them. Except for that whole humility thing. Right?

Instead of snarkily reminding someone that they aren't "being Jedi", why don't we find constructive ways to suggest that their behavior is not what they are currently striving for?

This is really good ...

Would you consider reprinting this as a sermon ?

It may be the case that each of us imagines a kind of Jedi we would like to be. The various documents included in our Temple Order 'Doctrine' provide us with statements that each of us can interpret and then attempt to fulfill in our daily lives. Perhaps, we have some very specific ideas of what actions or personal qualities we believe a Jedi should embody. We will encounter here, at our online Temple, those who have different ideas, ethical standards, and sources of inspiration. The Temple Order is open and welcoming. Discussing what it means to be Jedi expresses this diversity.

Even so, within this Temple Order, not everything can be included in a definition of Jedi. There are limits, and the discussion of the definition of Jedi is what makes this Temple Order forum lively and interesting. Nevertheless, questioning another's definition should be asked more sensitively. The suggested syntactical variations on the question "That (whatever 'that' is) doesn't sound Jedi?" shows a somewhat unreflective attitude. The question is neither belligerent nor manipulative, but still one that shows that the questioner is unaware that she/he is projecting her/his image of Jedi onto another with the implication that the other somehow fails to live up to the questioner's standard.

SilverWolf wrote: You Are correct, I do not know everyone here, as you said; muchless yourself. However, just because I do not know a person does not mean I cannot show them respect or respect their opinions and or beliefs. As you pointed out, I do not know you. However, I respect your opinion as you have given it, as it is your opinion and you are entitled to it. I'm not trying to get people to believe me, i'm just sharing my opinion just like everyone else. I believe that you can respect people you do not know. people do it all the time. I've walked down the street and greeted a stranger and there have been times a stranger has greeted me. even in it's smallest form a greeting is a form of kindness and respect.

I believe you're missing my point Silver, and please do not view my constructive criticism as an attack, quite a few people here can't take constructive criticism.

You stated "like and respect," and that sounds much more than common courtesy like the greeting of a stranger. Technically, I could be anyone, completely opposite from the person I seem to be online in the TOTJO, same goes for the rest of us.

Common respect is fine, but stretching it further than that, usually people who are quick to like others without getting to know them on some significant level are either insincere or gullible, I'm not calling you either BTW. I just want you to think before you post...

there must be a definition to the term "Jedi" before you can say someone is "not very Jedi"

Dear Zenchi,

I always think before I post. and I did not take your comments as an attack, However the sad fact in my opinion anyways, is that society as a whole has become jaded, cold, sometimes harsh, and untrusting. My beliefs may sound strange to some because the world has changed. There are few of us that still remain that believe or think as I do. The world has become cut-throat and cold. Let me clarify that I am not saying you are that way, I am saying that not many are out there who would show like and respect to a total stranger. I am one of the few who does believe that way. I am a dying breed of person, I hold no ill will to anyone...unless they attack my family...then all bets are off. Like I said in my post before yours and I really am sincere about this I try my best to live my life with Love, kindness, and honor. I strive everyday to uphold what being a jedi means to me. I strive everyday to uphold what the code of Bushido means to me, or the Knights code, or even something as simple as "Do unto others" These "codes", Lessons, whatever you wish to call them run in my blood and I truly believe in them. That may sound like I am crazy or something, but it is who I am. It is who I will be, and I am not ashamed of it. I realize how the world has changed and has become in my opinion a lot more cold and selfish as proven by our government and how they treat us and our service members ( which I will forever support). However, just because everyone else changes does not mean I have to. I will stick with my beliefs and principals and I will continue to live by them and honor them. I will continue to Like and respect everyone as a human being and respect and like them even if our opinions disagree. Zenchi, I took no offense to anything you have said, and I hope you don't take offense to anything I say. Like I said, I'm a dying breed of person, I'm different. But I'm Proud of who I am and what I believe.

Matthew 5:3

"Blessed are the poor in Spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven"
"Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted."
"Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth"
"Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled"
"Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy"
"blessed are the Pure in heart, for they will see God"
"Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God"
"Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kindom of heaven"
"Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me.
Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they were perscuted the prophets who were before you"

Now I am by no means a prophet, I am just a man. But I like to believe that this verse is true and so I treat everyone friend or Stranger the same. I try not to take offense by anything anyone says. I just try to live life and enjoy it, at least until I "become one with the force" That is all any of us can do.

A dying breed? No, but it does sound a bit romantic. The world you described has been like this for quite some time, (it's not the 60's anymore, lol) some however are just slow to wake up and become aware of it, or choose to see it as they so choose, (nothing wrong with that). It's ok, you didn't quite get my point, I placed too much emphasis on your "respect and liking everyone" instead of the context it was used in so ill leave it at that as I don't wish to derail this thread anymore than I already have...

It said to me "My default setting leans toward optimism both for myself and those I am about to engage".

edit: This is to clarify how I had taken Silver's initial opening.

Dear rugadd,

I guess that would be a fair assessment, I do consider myself an Optimist. I see good in everyone, and I respect or at least try to respect everyones feelings and beliefs. I may or may not agree with everyone, but that doesn't make me right or someone else wrong, it just means we have different beliefs and ways of thinking, and that is ok. I recently read a post where a member was apologizing for something that was said, so I put that original opening in so I could let it be known that I do not wish to offend anyone. However, I was also being honest when I said that I like and respect you all. I do appreciate your comment about what my opening said to you. Thank you.

The question is neither belligerent nor manipulative, but still one that shows that the questioner is unaware that she/he is projecting her/his image of Jedi onto another with the implication that the other somehow fails to live up to the questioner's standard

Let me change one word....

That isn't very "nice" of you.

Does that change anything?
Is that an insentive statement or a statement resulting of the questioners sensitivity?
Does nice have to be defined?
Is it projecting my image of nice on another or is nice commonly understood?
Is that an unreflective attitude or a statement of opinion? Both?
If someone doesn't live up to my expectation of nice why shouldn't I be able to state that?