Child Abuse or Discipline?

Legaliz human roadkill? My god I thought we were Jedi. I thought we were here to spread peace and justice throughout the galaxy. And here you are, a proponent of senseless murder. I realize you may be joking and that you may not actually want to commit vehicular manslaughter but you do seem to be on the side of abuse.

I am a shadow Jedi, and godless as well. Not only does the end justify the means, but the end is the only justification to the means.Do-goodie light Jedi always say that what matters is the mental state you're in. Like those bastards who send free food, what better way is there to destroy the primary sector of an economy. Oh and only distribute to those who approve of your methods. Better than PR and religious fanaticism put together. Pure evil. So yep, I disagree with that philosophy.

I don't value life more than non-life. I do not approve of abuse but accept mild violence. For instance, you cheat on your wife, expect her to slap you and throw a couple of plates at you. An eye for an eye only works when both parties equally want an eye, so cheating after being cheated isn't necessarily right. I don't think that's abuse or wrong, but a basic form of justice, where it is those you have harmed and betrayed who judge you, not other people who really should mind their own business.

Also Peace and Justice does not mean manslaughter cannot be commited. Killing one man can have a dramatic effect. Why wait for war and send thhousands of soldiers (it's accasionally been millions) to their death when a couple of snipers can do the same thing faster and better? Because assasins are evil and full blown war isn't?

Because of that guy who cut my finger I can no longer play the guitar (I used to teach classical) and can no longer feel the F and J keys, which is annoying when you're a computer scientist. I planted the guy's knife in his crotch, but sometimes I feel i should have broken his back. Difficult to assault people when you're in a wheelchair. His feelings are irrelevant, he should have thought about it first, and that's exactly what I taught him. And believe me, I really wish his parents had given him a good beating. He'd still have a functional richard and I'd still have a functional finger.

I have a 12 year old daughter. And I think she is pretty well behaved. I have given her three spankings in her life and all three where for fibbing. But; no matter what she might be in trouble for, I always try to set her down and explain what she did wrong, why it is wrong and what her punishment is going to be before it is dealt out. I agree that CONSISTENCY IS THE KEY when raising children. And spankings consisted of nothing more than a few swats on the bottom. They couldn’t have been terrible; because, I only had to tell her to bend over and she did. I was calm and we had talked about it already and she knew what was going to happen before we started. I think it was more that she was being disciplined that really upset her. There have been few other punishment s since she was very young. Usually, we just talk. I believe it is because at an early age the” rules “, for better lack of a term, where set in place and I was consistent.
Not overbearing, aggressive, mean, cruel, tyrannical or any other absurdity that commonly passes for discipline today.

Thanks for correcting me and putting of the real meanings for negative reinforcement and positive punishment coryduran. Like I said, I don't have kids, I have a dog, so my education on the subject came from the Complete Idiots Guide to Positive Dog Training. Positive reinforcements and negative punishment work the same on humans as dogs though so I think it's relevant. Besides. Those terms are SUPER easy to get mixed up. Haha

Master Ren
A lot of people that commit violent crimes often received lots of good beatings when they are younger. But if no lesson is taught how can the lesson you want them to learn be learned? Violence begets violence. I do agree with several statements you made, “I don't value life more than non-life. I do not approve of abuse but accept mild violence” and the entirety of the third paragraph.

I would not send food to those who do not have; rather, teach them to feed themselves. And agreeing with my views is not a prerequisite for my assistance. I have found that it does little to no good to help those who do not wish to help themselves.

You do have my sympathy for you injuries. I too was injured by an individual with little regard for others. I have lost a good deal of feeling (85% nerve damage) in my right arm to my hand, and I have no cartilage, or very very little in my right knee.

But, on a different note, I do believe that the end does NOT always justify the means. One can not have light without dark and vice versa. And, history judges us not only by the outcome of our actions.

Socrates wrote: Thanks for correcting me and putting of the real meanings for negative reinforcement and positive punishment coryduran. Like I said, I don't have kids, I have a dog, so my education on the subject came from the Complete Idiots Guide to Positive Dog Training. Positive reinforcements and negative punishment work the same on humans as dogs though so I think it's relevant. Besides. Those terms are SUPER easy to get mixed up. Haha

Hah don't worry, I was a psych major for over a year until I actually learned that I had them wrong as well. They are super easy to confuse, and most people don't even really know that along with pos/neg reinforcement, there is also pos/neg punishment.


As for the other conversation happening in here. The ends do not always justify the means. I would agree that assassins are not necessarily evil and sometimes necessary and capable of saving millions of lives, I agree with you there, but these are ends that are coming about by means done with a positive and morally balanced attitude, motive, and intention. I think the intention, and motive are almost, if not just as important as the actions themselves. Just because they are "invisible" or harder to know, doesn't make them unimportant.

I don't see anything wrong with defending yourself Ren, unless of course you did it for the wrong reasons. I do not see anything wrong though with striking someone who has struck you. I do think though, that the retaliation needs to be appropriate. I would definitely not condone killing someone for something like that, for example.

But, on a different note, I do believe that the end does NOT always justify the means. One can not have light without dark and vice versa. And, history judges us not only by the outcome of our actions.

Let me put it this way: The end MUST justify the means (and the means can only be justified by the end). If it's not the case, then the means are wrong.


And history SHOULD only judge us by the outcome of our actions.

To be honest, the older I get, the more disregard I have for history.

I don't see anything wrong with defending yourself Ren, unless of course you did it for the wrong reasons.

The reason is irrelevent, the result is what matters. You think in a situation like that you have time to think for a reason? What you need is a quick fix. The opportunity presented itself, I ceased it. Afterwrads is when I thought of things such as legal repercussions, and whether this guy would retaliate, or lie down, etc.
You can spend millions on a solid gold car that's going to do 2 miles an hour, or thousands on a steel one that does 100. the value of the car isn't what you put into it (the reason) but what you get out of it (the result). The second car is more valuable imo.

See you didn't have time to think of a reason though, which shows that your reason for doing so was an absolute need to do something, it was self defense. Had you come back an horu later though and did what you did strictly out of revenge, you would have a new reason, and a different intention, which would, in my eyes, make the same outcome, wrong. It's the buddhist idea of "Right Intention" from the eight fold path.

If you are spending millions of dollars on a solid gold car, you are getting a bad result, and you probably had a bad reason (to spend that much on a solid gold car that performs awful would be done out of a place of vanity and arrogance, and now you have bad intention, or reason, which would make your poor results at the end make sense).