Discussion: TotJO Culture Problems

Stephen wrote: Jedi Zenchi,
As an advisor you were still with the council to a degree.
I was thinking more of a council monitor. No input with council matters, but someone to ensure that the Council Honourable.
What if you had been in that position instead.
You would be someone both sides, so to speak, would trust.

Again, short of being council secretary I'd be down with it, however it's not up to me, and contrary to what the site used to say, I'm not the most popular individual here...

Jedi Zenchi
It's about being trustworthy.
I think all would agree, you want the best for the Temple.
You would be for the members.
If the Council and other offices truly want transparency...
Building trust and stopping the endless " Nothing is done and never changes "
We talk of accountability.

Stephen wrote: Jedi Zenchi
It's about being trustworthy.
I think all would agree, you want the best for the Temple.
You would be for the members.
If the Council and other offices truly want transparency...
Building trust and stopping the endless " Nothing is done and never changes "
We talk of accountability.

Historically speaking, things have not been quite that simple. Its easy to put it in words, harder in practise.

Hoping these new changes that we're being told are being discussed may make what you're stating as simple as it sounds. One day...

I would like to hear a member of the Councils thoughts on this.
I understand it would be a personal view not the Councils view.

Stephen,
I was previously an Adviser. Now I am a Councillor. I didn’t ask to be either. Hopefully I can clarify a few things.

First, the Advisor role was a position elected by the Knights to represent their voice in Council. Advisers did not have a vote. We were meant to inform Councillors of the membership’s desires to better inform their votes. We were also to bring proposals for policy change to Council for them to consider. In turn, we’re were to inform the wider membership of what was happening in Council to make it more transparent. Their were five of us elected by the Knights in an election that Council had no say in.

We were all very eager to make changes, but Council was a bit cautious and quite frankly, some felt threatened. We did not understand going in how slowly things work in Council, and certain Councillors also did not respond well to our demands for immediate action. The communication became toxic and two Advisers resigned over it (Zenchi and my own Teaching Master tzb). Tzb had his own personal battle with a few Councillors that spilled over into the public forums and crap hit the fan in a big way.

The remaining three Advisers got caught in the middle and got beat up by both sides. Members accused us of being weak, or even worse, traitors. Council’s response was “I told you so, Knights can’t handle the real business of this Temple.” Any attempt at being transparent was met with mistrust and doubt, as it still is. I don’t believe I have ever lied to anyone here about my actions or intentions, but I still am not trusted by many simply because of a badge under my name. Ironically, I had access to Council forums long before as a Security Officer, but I guess that doesn’t matter.

I understand the mistrust based on some pretty egregious actions in the past, but it is time to move forward. It is in pardoning that we are pardoned. Forgive us if we move more slowly and carefully this time. We’ve all been burned before.

Jedi Senan,
Advisors give advice to the council, they are involved in the process.
What I was suggesting was someone to just watch the process, without getting involved in any way.
Then if anyone asks what is being done about such and such.
The monitor can answer.
By not being involved, the monitor will have loyalty to the truth.

Stephen wrote: Jedi Senan,
Advisors give advice to the council, they are involved in the process.
What I was suggesting was someone to just watch the process, without getting involved in any way.
Then if anyone asks what is being done about such and such.
The monitor can answer.
By not being involved, the monitor will have loyalty to the truth.

So... Jedi Whistle-blowers?

Advisory did a good enough job ensuring we knew what was going on upstairs as it was. I do hope we get new Advisory members (or single member) in the future to continue that work.

Reason I'm mentioning single member is because if the advisory council position leads into a potential Council position, well... last thing we need is every active knight eventually ending up on council. So maybe one a time going forward?

Why is that the last thing we need? Knights need to do something other than stand around looking pretty with orange badges and train more knights doing the same.

steamboat28 wrote: Why is that the last thing we need? Knights need to do something other than stand around looking pretty with orange badges and train more knights doing the same.

Whats the point of a council if everyone ends up on it. Rather than have their knights sit pretty, the council should be using them, realising a goal and finding knights to head certain tasks.

They have done this, of course, but whom will do the delegating if all the knights are on council?

Its not a Knights job to train other knights to be knights. Its a Knight's job to train apprentices to be knights. If knights are sitting pretty and doing nothing I'd have to equate that to their training.

Who's doing the delegating now? Is it the Council, or individual offices? What's the point of a council that never delegates? If leaders do everything themselves, they spend too little time actually leading, and none preparing the next generation to lead.