What does being a member of the group "Jedi" mean to you?

While studying here at the temple I have intently considered the Jedi Doctrine. What I have found over time is that I have either modified (sometimes radically) or abandoned much of the doctrine in favor of something that speaks more favorably to me. As I have gone through this process I have begun to wonder why my path has diverged like this and yet I still pursue Jediism? This seems to be a similar process for most I speak to at the temple. Our paths seem very diverse. I have begun to wonder what it means to be “Jedi” not as an individual, but as a group.

Individually each person defines what their spirituality means to them and that varies quite drastically from person to person. But when you attribute yourself to a group, the reason you do this is because there is some underlying unifying principle or purpose that all in that group agree upon. However, whenever any discussion breaks out on the boards that attempts to quantify or define what “A Jedi” or “The Force” is, for example, no consensus is ever reached. It seems that to call one’s self Jedi is to relegate yourself to argue any philosophical issue with other Jedi to the point of ad nauseam. And that’s just at this temple. Travel to another and their philosophies may be even more radically different. A Sith temple for example.

I contemplated this for a while and the only conclusion I could come to was our common base was the movies themselves. The movies are a single unifying thread that all Jedi can agree upon no matter what temple they are members of or personal philosophies they adopt. However this leads to another dilemma because the movies were never meant to start a religion. Similar to the “Cargo Cults” of the south pacific, Jediism evolved out of an imaginary religious/spiritual component of an equally fictional universe designed to tell a story using the concept of good vs evil and nothing more. At best this leaves the movies as a conduit to some common deeper hidden meaning but what is that?

Within the context of this group setting of “Jedi” I began to wonder what being a Jedi really means and what others feel it is that draws them to this particular calling. So my questions are, “Why is it that even though, as a group even the simplest of terms/philosophies are typically not agreed upon, you have still decided that your personal spirituality is similar enough to others in this group that you are comfortable in allowing yourself to be defined by the single unifying term of Jedi instead of any of the movies various underlying philosophies (Taoist for example)? What is it that you feel all Jedi find a universal commonality in when it comes to this chosen spirituality besides the "conduit" of the movies themselves?"

For me, the unifying Force (pun intended) behind Jediism is the freedom to diverge as you have described while still being welcome and accepted here.

As a Catholic growing up, there was no diversion allowed. It was more than frowned upon; we were punished for it. For instance, if I was to say that Jesus is awesome and I love his message and he is my personal savior, but I don't believe in the virgin birth, people in my church would lose their s**t. If I asked about the possibility of reincarnation, the answer was "nope, those people go to Hell." You get the point.

The very fact that we can congregate in a Temple and argue about the fundamental foundations of Jediism is the reason I come here and call myself Jedi. I don't have to be Sunni or Lutheran or Mahayana or some other specific denomination. I can just be Jedi and know that despite differences in philosophy, I will still be respected here.

My major problem is that, moreso perhaps than any other religion, we all point at the same source material and wildly, wildly diverge from it. It's true there were many kind of Jedi in both canon and the newly-defunct EU writings, but we don't even necessarily hold together that well. It's interesting that we all choose to use the same word to describe something that is so wildly, vastly different from one another, and I'm curious if it just comes down to interpretation of that original source material, or if the word itself has been forgotten as a part of this movement.

What does it mean to me? Diversity and inclusion. What Steam and Kyrin have both identified, and many others have pointed out in the past, as being a problem is actually one of the things I love the most about it. And you know what? My version of Jediism allows us both to be right!

When I first came here one of my favorite parts was how inclusive the group was. We don't care what your color/race/culture/age/history/height/weight/sexual orientation/whatever is. I also don't care what your definition of Jediism or the Force is. We obviously have enough in common to still be here together. Even if all we have in common is that we all like Star Wars that seems to be enough and that's awesome. What that tells me is we're not cookie cutter. We don't hand you something and say "memorize it, repeat it, believe it or leave." We say "here, read this, tell us what you thought. Be unique."

The first thing I like to tell newbies is to be honest in the IP. If you don't like Watts, great! Tell us why. If you LOVE Campbell, fantastic. What about his work do you love? You think that believing in the inherent value in all life means you want to ban abortions? That's your choice (see what I did there? ), tell me why. You believe that valuing life means using the death penalty to reduce the risk of escaping inmates killing more people? Let's talk about it.

I view subjects like philosophy and religion to be like English classes rather than science and math.

In math and science there is a yes or no, a right and wrong. 1+1=2. I'm sorry, we can get as technical as you want but that's going to be the answer. Mix chemical A with chemical B the right way and it will explode, exactly the same, every time. That's the point of science, repeatable results.

In English class, however, you can take any stance you like so long as you can back it up. You believe that Horatio was the best character in Hamlet? Back it up and I can't tell you that you are objectively wrong. Did that one character's hair being described as "steel gray" symbolize her being emotionally shackled to something? Tell me why you say that. Once again, I can't tell you you're wrong, objectively.

People who come here and don't like that tend to leave. That's what happens. Good for them, I hope that they find a place they like better, and may the Force be with them. I love that though, so I'll stay. Let's discuss the Doctrine until the day we die.

I don't think everyone here is a fan of star wars actually. There is a portion of us who don't really like it or attribute the path to that (at least not so literally, and yet some a bit more do).

That being said, I do believe the commonality here is an agreement to something that Joseph Campbell points out: That we are all a "hero" of some sort on a journey (being our lives). In our particular case, we have all chosen the symbolic avatar of the Jedi as our handle for that truth in language (because we have found that it is the most accurate as a symbol to what we believe), and have selectively taken on certain aspects of that avatar to fill out that image to those beliefs and feelings about ourselves in society (the code, for example). In that process, we took the "stock image" of the Jedi, and actually tailored it to fit into the conditions of the real world and our own individual diversity in perception (aka our own individual beliefs in the Force).

From that point, the tree branches out into many directions.

Everyone has their own 'spin' on religious details.

Disagreement is healthy, the IP is the first step into larger world.

Differences help enrich and bring us all together.

These are all just some of the wonderful facets of Jediism, and I think we should continue to embrace them.

Perhaps instead of worrying about EU material, or the specifics of Star Wars Lore, or even how Jediism flexes and evolves for individuals, we should reflect on the 'basics' of Jediism, which I truly feel everyone here agrees with and still upholds.

Ask a friend, or family member, in all seriousness, what their perception of a 'Real Jedi' would be, who magically appeared before them. Right out of Star Wars.

After the jokes are put aside, they most likely would say something along the lines of the following comments. I've also asked this question before, and these are real responses.

- They're a protector.
- They'll keep me safe.
- They're fair, just, and balanced.
- They're kind.
- They're a mediator.
- They're very educated, and know a lot about different cultures and people.

The list goes on and on. This is all implied by the base 7 movies... that's it. Sure, there's a lot of more fun lore out there (love it myself) that we can take or learn from. But there, above, is the heartbeat of Jediism, to me.

We're all trying our very best to improve ourselves, mentally, physically and spiritually. We wish to become mediators who protect and serve others. Education is sought after with happy vigor. We work to accept and understand our fellow humans.

Our tenets, code and creed all reflect this. So, if those, along with the imagery above, forms an ideal you'd like to strive / work towards, then you are a Jedi within the Jediism community.

Apologies if this doesn't make as much sense as it does in my head, but I hope that I was able to help bring a different viewpoint to the discussion.

Thank you Proteus. I'm one of the people that has a strong dislike for the franchise. 7 is the only movie I like.

Being a Jedi is about:

Being Tolerant of all ideas, even when they are against yours- until they begin to bring physical harm to someone.
Being Objective when considering everything, but not being afraid to solidify your beliefs/opinions based on your experience- even when others don't agree with you.
Working towards a goal which benefits a community you value (LGBT, your hometown, overcoming Human Trafficking, becoming a cop, becoming a lobbyist, become a counselor, etc, etc).

I could go on, but the whole of being a Jedi boils down to this: Nothing is about you, it's about others. But you have to become a person that can benefit others. That takes training, that takes radical introspection of yourself and those around you. Taking inventory of what is necessary to alter yourself so that the world will accept your assistance.

Senan wrote: For me, the unifying Force (pun intended) behind Jediism is the freedom to diverge as you have described while still being welcome and accepted here

Goken wrote: What does it mean to me? Diversity and inclusion.

These are interesting thoughts. LOL sort of reminds me of the island of misfit toys. Not to say that anyone is broken but its just the idea that we are all different enough as individuals to have very diverse philosophies, but at the same time similar enough in some way to cling to one another and form a group.

It seems that just our diversity would not be enough to hold us together. So what is it about us that is similar enough that we find comfort in as a group? Do you think it nothing more than the paradox of the island of misfit toys? Meaning each of us as individuals have searched but have found no meaning in other groups/spiritualitys. So we have come together in an ironic group called Jedi because we have that one thing in common, that we find it impossible to conform to any one preset doctrine. We each have radically diverse and individual spiritual paths that we carve out for ourselves vs following a crowd. We are nietzsche's uber-mensch and in that we find a commonality?

Cayce wrote: - They're a protector.
- They'll keep me safe.
- They're fair, just, and balanced.
- They're kind.
- They're a mediator.
- They're very educated, and know a lot about different cultures and people.
The list goes on and on.

I think some of the things you mentioned are great. But the problem is that not all Jedi pursue these things or pursue them to different degrees or pursue other things outside these things. For example I consider one that calls himself “Sith” as a part of the “group spirituality” we call Jedi – they are just a subset. I think you can find an almost never ending array of other subsets as well. Maybe not quite as defined but nonetheless there. So I’m looking for more than action or doctrine, I’m looking for an underlying, unifying philosophy.

Cayce wrote: We're all trying our very best to improve ourselves, mentally, physically and spiritually.

I think you have begun to touch on something here! This is more of a philosophy with out the details or actions to stifle the execution of that philosophy. How one goes about these things is irrelevant to the fact that every Jedi pursues these things in their own way as best they see fit.


I think these things go hand in hand with what Proteus says about Jedi considering themselves on that heros Journey. Jedi philosophy is one that never fears to carve their own path and to "take up the adventure" so to speak, no matter what that adventure is.

To me, being a Jedi means aspiring to the archetypes represented by the fictional Jedi. The Jedi Code is a perfectly good representation of what the qualities of those archetypes are, so a more practical answer might be living in accordance with the qualities presented in the Code as it may apply to any given situation, idea, metaphysical system, etc.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: These are interesting thoughts. LOL sort of reminds me of the island of misfit toys. Not to say that anyone is broken but its just the idea that we are all different enough as individuals to have very diverse philosophies, but at the same time similar enough in some way to cling to one another and form a group.

It seems that just our diversity would not be enough to hold us together. So what is it about us that is similar enough that we find comfort in as a group? Do you think it nothing more than the paradox of the island of misfit toys? Meaning each of us as individuals have searched but have found no meaning in other groups/spiritualitys. So we have come together in an ironic group called Jedi because we have that one thing in common, that we find it impossible to conform to any one preset doctrine. We each have radically diverse and individual spiritual paths that we carve out for ourselves vs following a crowd. We are nietzsche's uber-mensch and in that we find a commonality?

I feel like that's a pretty good analogy. :laugh: I do believe, however, that at least a small majority here agree on the doctrine in general, just not on the interpretations or applications of it.

Goken wrote:
I feel like that's a pretty good analogy. :laugh: I do believe, however, that at least a small majority here agree on the doctrine in general, just not on the interpretations or applications of it.

Thanks! Yes I would agree completely about the doctrine group. I would consider that another subset group as I described above about the Sith subset. This "doctrine" group tries to follow the doctrine on this site as it was written and try to live up to that code as Dude says above. but not all Jedi do this. Other Jedi at other temples do the same for their particular code. Christian Jedi do this as well for a version of code they find meaningful and so forth. But beyond that I wanted to try to get to the underlying philosophy that binds all these groups together.

Goken wrote:

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: These are interesting thoughts. LOL sort of reminds me of the island of misfit toys. Not to say that anyone is broken but its just the idea that we are all different enough as individuals to have very diverse philosophies, but at the same time similar enough in some way to cling to one another and form a group.

It seems that just our diversity would not be enough to hold us together. So what is it about us that is similar enough that we find comfort in as a group? Do you think it nothing more than the paradox of the island of misfit toys? Meaning each of us as individuals have searched but have found no meaning in other groups/spiritualitys. So we have come together in an ironic group called Jedi because we have that one thing in common, that we find it impossible to conform to any one preset doctrine. We each have radically diverse and individual spiritual paths that we carve out for ourselves vs following a crowd. We are nietzsche's uber-mensch and in that we find a commonality?

I feel like that's a pretty good analogy. :laugh: I do believe, however, that at least a small majority here agree on the doctrine in general, just not on the interpretations or applications of it.

The Doctrine is pretty universal and easy to follow for the most part. Myself I simply dislike the Name "Doctrine" and alot of the interpretations/descriptions and.....Its way more lengthy than it needs to be. Very repetitive.....But the Ideals are no different than any other Jedi group with their own sets of behaviors/codes/tenets.

Being a Jedi was once about discovering myself and to train to be better than I was....And then I reached that Gauntlet.

Then it became about the community and how I might be apart of it's evolution and growth....And then I reached that Gauntlet.

Now it's about setting up my own legacy so that one day my daughters can learn about the best of themselves and find an honorable direction in life.

The meaning and purpose of being apart of a Jedi Group or the community in general - is to follow your own Hero's Journey that lead you here. Perhaps it will one day lead you away from it...or perhaps you will forever hug the edges as you continue forward. That is indiidual.

@ triskar

I can understand that. I have followed a similar path in my journey as a pagan. I had that season of deep intospection, that one of selfless sacrifice to community, that selfish one of deep training just for me and so on. Do you think we as Jedi find ourselves seeking that group of kindred spirits that are walking separate paths but also somewhat parallel paths? We follow our heros journey but through the thick of the wood we see others also walking towards what seems to be a similar destiny and we can wave at them and say hi, maybe even share a meal. And we find a comfort in the fact that we are not alone in this dark wood that we have decided to tread but where most others fear to go. This seems the very core of what Cayce touched on with the idea that we seek to challenge ourselves at every opportunity physically, mentally and spiritually. We never turn down that "heros journey" in any aspect and when we find others of similar ilk we are drawn to them. And that is what binds us as Jedi at a most basic level?

From my experience it is just the name. Get rid of the name and watch the numbers die out with a quickness.... :dry: But I suppose that could just be my pessimist shadow seeping out it is past midnight here.... :whistle:

The name is Appealing. Its represents the best parts of what we all want to be...so we cling to it.

I wish I could say it is because we are drawn to the people in the community....And while parts of it might be true there is equal measure of people here we don't care for and often but heads with....Force knows there are plenty in the community I could live without :whistle: :dry: So....Why stay?

So its the ideologies that appeal to us. The Doctrines/Codes/Tenets/Teachings..... Except that these things are found in many faiths and belief systems. Not Just for Jedi. So....why not just be Pagan and stick to it? If that is truly what you are most familiar and comfortable with why bother trying to make something else work when it clearly doesn't? For me it could be because....even though I have encountered plenty of unpleasant people in the Jedi Community....I have also made some real close friends. I stay....because of them...And even that has been....faltering.

But now we get to the part that many here don't like Experience. Myself I have stuck to this for a very...very...long time. I have poured so much heart and soul into this single word "Jedi." that it is hard for me to just turn around and walk away. I have suffered great pains and experienced great joys and it takes up a great measure of my life since I was sixteen...

And so that is the crux of the matter. At least to me

Each of us stumbled upon this community by one means or another. We found things that was interesting....some things that were not so much....and over days....weeks...months....years....we weigh and measure its worth and in that course...make friends and personal soul deep history.

Like attracts like.

okay....now im just rambling aimlessly....I best try that whole "Sleep" thing....Night!

I think jedi sounds cool. Imagine if Lucas had called them the "splurts" or something like that. :laugh:

What I find holds us and calls to us as a group is enlightenment. We all have found our own truths to the world. We have learned ourselves and our place in the world. It is the search for our own personal truth that binds us.

steamboat28 wrote: My major problem is that, moreso perhaps than any other religion, we all point at the same source material and wildly, wildly diverge from it. It's true there were many kind of Jedi in both canon and the newly-defunct EU writings, but we don't even necessarily hold together that well. It's interesting that we all choose to use the same word to describe something that is so wildly, vastly different from one another, and I'm curious if it just comes down to interpretation of that original source material, or if the word itself has been forgotten as a part of this movement.

It's always been that way. Our differences (oddly enough) are what make us whole. Like my friend Tionne from Jedi Creed used to say, we're all part of a mosaic:

The Mosaic

A mosaic is a picture comprised of many different colors and materials, all forming one picture. A shard of yellow topaz could form the center of a flower, with bits and pieces of green glazed tile for grass and leaves, and bits of white porcelain for the petals. Around that could be lapis lazuli for the sky, and perhaps diamonds for stars. Terra cotta tiles could form the trunk of a tree, or perhaps a rock. Yet all these many pieces comprise one picture, with no one segment any more or less important or useful than the rest. We are all a mosaic. We are all the lapis lazuli sky. We are all the diamond stars, the terra cotta rocks, the green tile grass and leaves, the topaz and porcelain flowers. We each have our own color and texture to add to the human experience. We all have our own different lives to add to the bigger life Force. We are all different, and yet we are all one. Our differences unify us, just as many different colors and textures form the mosaic.

—Tionne

Trisskar wrote: From my experience it is just the name. Get rid of the name and watch the numbers die out with a quickness.... :dry: But I suppose that could just be my pessimist shadow seeping out it is past midnight here.... :whistle:

The name is Appealing. Its represents the best parts of what we all want to be...so we cling to it.

Thats been my dilema, i cant decide if there is nothing more to jediism than a name or a movie which to me leaves us just sort of pretending to be something we are really not. Or is there some deeper inderlying philosopy that has been tapped into, even if accidently that we are striving as a group to develop.

I know what you mean about the people. For me its not the relationships im developing so much as the attraction to the heros journey philosophy that we have undertaken. However i still cant decide if all or even most jedi have that same focus or if they are more enamored by the name as you say. Thats the reason for my inquiry here. To get other opinions.

I get what your saying about the investment in time in a community as well. I have experienced something similar in my pagan path. Invest all to have it shatterd at some point and then having to make the decision to either carry on with the lie or leave the path you were on. Its a hard decision to make. In my case i chose to leave and ironically that decision was what brought me to explore jediism.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: Thats been my dilema, i cant decide if there is nothing more to jediism than a name or a movie which to me leaves us just sort of pretending to be something we are really not. .

The greatest strength of Jediism is that we know its mythology is fictional. So, if you want to take the traditional approach towards fitting into a religion, from the very start you are pretending to be something that you are really not. And as long as you keep trying to fit in, you will forever be overly concerned with definitions, labels and what is and not Jedi.

Or, you can simply enjoy the fact that there is nothing to fit into. YOU make Jediism, not the other way around. After all, the purpose of myths and symbols are not for us to emulate them, but to use them as tools to discover who we are, what we want and more importantly, live accordingly.

Manu wrote:

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: Thats been my dilema, i cant decide if there is nothing more to jediism than a name or a movie which to me leaves us just sort of pretending to be something we are really not. .

The greatest strength of Jediism is that we know its mythology is fictional. So, if you want to take the traditional approach towards fitting into a religion, from the very start you are pretending to be something that you are really not. And as long as you keep trying to fit in, you will forever be overly concerned with definitions, labels and what is and not Jedi.

Or, you can simply enjoy the fact that there is nothing to fit into. YOU make Jediism, not the other way around. After all, the purpose of myths and symbols are not for us to emulate them, but to use them as tools to discover who we are, what we want and more importantly, live accordingly.