Question...

Francois wrote:

Br. John wrote: Some are going to be familiar with the material. Nobody has to cover it via mp3 or video. The text version is an option. That's something that's not clear on the lesson plan.

Hello Br. John,

I am up to lesson 3: The first story tellers. Can I just take it from this section in text?

Thank you.

Yes. You have the choice of any of the three options.

ren wrote: Well the star wars myth is based on the campbell monomyth. He's an obvious choice.

See, now that leads me into something else that I've been confused about for quite some time as well.

Do we want to identify with the Jedi from the movies or not? So much of the introductory information on the home page of this site says that we do not. But so much of the content of this site says we do. Do we not see this as sending "mixed messages"? What am I not understanding about that?

I would think that if we don't want to identify with the fictional Jedi, then it doesn't matter who Lucas drew inspiration from for Star Wars, because we only took names and terms from the fiction for the sake of convenience. But, if we do want to try to draw parallels between ourselves and the Jedi of that fictional universe, why would so much effort be spent on saying that we don't?

Do we take the Star Wars films to be allegorical, mythic accounts of our faith, much like the sutras for Buddhists, and the bible for Christians? Or was it simply an oversight? Or perhaps it was intentional, but for a reason I haven't thought of?

Alluvius wrote: I had never heard of Joseph Campbell before TOTJO either, but I've been listening/reading/learning about the mythic cycle and hero's journey since elementary school. I have no specific people in mind, but Campbell is horribly dull in his approach (in my opinion). Please understand also that, I'm not saying that I'm "right" or that Campbell is "wrong". I'm not sure it's really possible to be "right" or "wrong" here. I was just curious about the thought process. Or was Campbell chosen simply because Lucas "likes" him?

Lucas liking him had something to do with it. I was there and I don't remember all the reasons. Since you already know about this subject and find Campbell boring - what's the use? You could use your responses to explain the idea your way and maybe mention where and how you learned about it.

Wescli Wardest wrote: Sometimes you just have to go with what "feels" right.

I was not here during the begining and couldn't even begin to assume why certain choices were made, but where TOTJO is now... they must have done a pretty good job at some point!

I do not dispute that TOTJO in general has done a "good job" of presenting Jediism...I'm here after all. After visiting countless other "Jedi sites", and reading nearly endless information on the interwebs about Jediism, I chose TOTJO. I recognize that fact. I'm just a bit curious about some of the "hows" and "whys". Please understand that it is not my intention to "rile anyone up", "ruffle feathers" or "attack" the leadership here. But there are questions that I need answers to, and once again, I ask publicly because I think that everyone can only gain from those answers. Either by offering them or reading them.

Br. John wrote: Since you already know about this subject and find Campbell boring - what's the use? You could use your responses to explain the idea your way and maybe mention where and how you learned about it.

First, knowing about a subject, and having nothing left to learn are radically different things...that's the use.

Second, I did not know until this thread that I could "re-hash" the lesson in terms of, how I would express it. I was under the impression that I was required to discuss his view in a way that showed what I learned from him. And I have been having trouble with that as he hasn't said anything "new" to me.

From here on in, I shall take a different tack when posting on the IP lessons.

It's a mixed message. Isn't is suspiciously like a Koan?

Br. John wrote: One challenge for those who find it familiar is to give a brief essay on how they'd explain or teach the concept to someone who's new to it. Some might not agree with the ideas and explaining why they don't is a good answer too.

I recently was in a PM exchange with someone who didnt like Campbell, and thought he was full of the southside, of a north bound horse...

I dint say the person exchanging was wrong, merely discussed how I saw it, and they, how they saw it, and we left it at that...

It is not Campbell we are stressing, so much as the concept he explains...

Do we want to identify with the Jedi from the movies or not? So much of the introductory information on the home page of this site says that we do not. But so much of the content of this site says we do. Do we not see this as sending "mixed messages"? What am I not understanding about that?

Sure it is confusing...

We would prolly embrace it more, if it werent for the kooks, lol...

We can only distance ourselves so far, no matter what we say...

FOr when we call ourselves Jedi, that ties us to fiction...

We just want people to understand that you dont have to know the fiction 'religiously', (haha, get it, we are a church... I keeelll me!)...

That people like V and myself, barley know anything but the movies...

Br. John wrote: It's a mixed message. Isn't is suspiciously like a Koan?

That would depend on intent...although I can, if I look at it right, see the Koan-esque value of presenting the "fiction vs reality" of Jediism the way it has been presented here.

It's easy to like campbell from his hour long soundbites. I highly encourage people to delve into his more expansive works. Basing entire view points off of the interviews is like using cliff notes for the bible.

Andy Spalding wrote: is like using cliff notes for the bible.

Errr....

lol.... so, this is wrong?

I would rather the cliff notes, and see if its worth expanding my knowledge on...

Just my thinking...

I haven't read the Campbell books...