Is this how Jedi should act?

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6 years 4 months ago #308443 by
This is an honest question. The answer has much to do whether I stay or leave. I want to live a life of love and compassion and if this Temple doesn't do that, then I don't want to be associated with it. I want to believe in this place. The spoiler material is a conversation I had with a Knight with whom I will keep anonymous out of respect for them. I just want to know if this is what all or most Knights believe.

Warning: Spoiler!
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6 years 4 months ago #308445 by MadHatter
No, I will flat out say it's not proper behavior for a Jedi. But I will add to this we are not perfect. We all have bad days and act poorly. The fact is that we all fail. Knight or Novice we all stumble.

The fact is that we are going to get the same questions over and over again and we should all work to give answers with compassion and if we cant then we should not bother to answer at all.

Knight of the Order
Training Master: Jestor
Apprentices: Lama Su, Leah
Just a pop culture Jedi doing what I can
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6 years 4 months ago #308446 by Zenchi
Replied by Zenchi on topic Is this how Jedi should act?
I'm not like the rest of the knights here, lol. If my telling somebody multiple times to read the front page and not to give spoilers offends anybody, here is a quarter and a tissue...

I'm not here to validate you, and shouldn't be the goal of a Jedi. If your not here to be challenged and grow as a result, if your easily offended and/or looking for a "safe place" this isn't it, and you would do well to look elsewhere...

Focus, Knowledge & Wisdom are also a part of that Doctrine you continue to throw in my face, remember that before you preach next time please...

My Word is my Honor, and my Honor is my Life ~ Sturm Brightblade
Passion, yet Serenity
Knighted Apprentice Arisaig
TM- RyuJin
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6 years 4 months ago - 6 years 4 months ago #308447 by
Replied by on topic Is this how Jedi should act?
I care about people. That's all. I want a place where I can grow as a person, not necessarily a "safe place". I didn't take offense, I just thought that we could treat people better. I want to be inviting to people. I'm sorry if I offended you or seemed like I was judging you.

Edit: I started this thread, not to point fingers, but to see if I should stay here or not.
Last edit: 6 years 4 months ago by .
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6 years 4 months ago #308449 by Brick
Replied by Brick on topic Is this how Jedi should act?
I'm guessing from your comment, that you're the knight in question Zenchi? Based on that assumption, my comment on this would be as follows:

Nami, I think it really depends on the Jedi. And also how well you know the Jedi.

When I read the discussion as being between yourself and an anonymous knight, I must admit to thinking it quite out of character of what I imagine a knight to be (though as Hatter said, we all have our days). And I personally would not speak like that to you were I a knight.

That being said, once I knew who the knight in question was, my opinion of the conversation has changed considerably. Some people are, quite naturally, significantly more blunt than others. When you add in Zenchi's past as a sith, it makes even more sense for the bluntness. Though I understand this bluntness can be difficult to deal with, I've had a few pretty strongly worded 'debates' with Zenchi myself in the past :laugh: I don't think it was his intention to offend anyone. Zenchi encourages people to be their best all the time. He just doesn't do this by being 'nice', he does it by pushing them to think for themselves, rather than being spoon-fed.

With regards to the doctrine elements you quote. I guess they are open to interpretation. One can be loving and caring without being overly nice. When a parent tells their children off they do it out of love for them. The 'engagement in petty behaviour' is likewise open to how one interprets things.

I see the points you make, and I think them fair and reasonable. But I also know Zenchi, and he's not necessarily being 'mean' to people because he can't be bothered with them, or because he wants them to bugger off, but because he's trying to help let them find their own way.

Apprentice to Maitre Chevalier Jedi Alexandre Orion

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6 years 4 months ago #308450 by
Replied by on topic Is this how Jedi should act?
There is a time and place for everything. Anything that pushes people away is not becoming of a church. Thus why I asked the question. I didn't and still don't want to discuss specifics. I just want to know if this is a place where I can be proud of saying that I'm a part of.
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6 years 4 months ago - 6 years 4 months ago #308451 by MadHatter

Nami wrote: There is a time and place for everything. Anything that pushes people away is not becoming of a church. Thus why I asked the question. I didn't and still don't want to discuss specifics. I just want to know if this is a place where I can be proud of saying that I'm a part of.


Any actions that pushes people away? Do you mean that literally? I sincerely ask this because that would mean every church is unbecoming of the title. To have standards of behavior pushes some away, to have no standards pushes some away, to make people work for rank pushes some away, to give rank away easily pushes some away, to accept many views pushes some away, to not tolerate some views pushes others away, etc etc. Do you see how its a no-win situation with that standard?

While I think that we should generally strive to be helpful and kind in our wording it gets easy to become frustrated with hearing the same things day in and day out. Now as I said earlier I think Jedi should compassion where we can, we are as my own Master says Practicing Jedi not Perfect Jedi. We will all stumble and we will all have human failings/frustrations.

In keeping with our creed try to understand before being understood. For both sides of this. By that I mean we have shown we agree with and understand why you feel as you do. Or at least I feel I have. Now I ask you to try to see it from the other side as to how seeing the same question asked at least 10 times a week could possibly make you want to scream to look at the dang FAQ.

Knight of the Order
Training Master: Jestor
Apprentices: Lama Su, Leah
Just a pop culture Jedi doing what I can
Last edit: 6 years 4 months ago by MadHatter.
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6 years 4 months ago - 6 years 4 months ago #308452 by
Replied by on topic Is this how Jedi should act?
Pushing people away by being rude is different than pushing people away because they don't want to do the work to better themselves.

Edit: Yes, no one's perfect which is the reason why I messaged him privately. So we can strive to be better. I've seen way too many people pushed away from here already, and I haven't been here that long.
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6 years 4 months ago - 6 years 4 months ago #308453 by MadHatter

Nami wrote: Pushing people away by being rude is different than pushing people away because they don't want to do the work to better themselves.


Rudeness is often subjective and how you read it as Brick said often depends on how you know the person. It can also be tinted by how you feel at the moment, how you yourself would mean the words if you typed them like that etc. Now again I stress I agree with the idea of being kind and helpful no matter how frustrated we are.

But I also ask you to try to understand that people might not always mean things as you read them and that it can get very frustrating to answer the same thing over and over when that is what our FAQ was designed to help with. While it may be the jobs of Knights and other leadership roles to help people with questions when we put forward tools to help you find the knowledge for yourself and people appear not to use them it can be annoying. And over time our responses can come off as rude/blunt/harsh etc when really we are just trying to point people to the area that they can find the information and much more by themselves. Does that make sense so far?

Edit due to previous post edit LOL

This path is not easy and often people come here seeking healing. While we strive to help those that need it we also cannot always tip toe around things and we will all come off as harsher than intended or people will react in ways we did not expect. We cannot control that and often people need to be able to hang on past hiccups if they are to make it as a Jedi. We must be able to deal with misunderstandings or harsh words from time to time

Knight of the Order
Training Master: Jestor
Apprentices: Lama Su, Leah
Just a pop culture Jedi doing what I can
Last edit: 6 years 4 months ago by MadHatter.
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6 years 4 months ago #308454 by Zenchi
Replied by Zenchi on topic Is this how Jedi should act?

Nami wrote: There is a time and place for everything. Anything that pushes people away is not becoming of a church. Thus why I asked the question. I didn't and still don't want to discuss specifics. I just want to know if this is a place where I can be proud of saying that I'm a part of.


Of course you don't want to discuss specifics, but you want to preach, and post private pms while pointing fingers and judge, and for what?

"something something, Home page & FAQ, something something mumble grumble"

That's what set your knickers in a bunch....

Well Nami, if you knew anything about me or this Temple you'd know that's me being polite. I've risked being banned and having my account deleted over how others have been treated here, I raised the damn roof for the membership here. And no, that doesn't mean I think or feel I am entitled, not at all...

It shows where my priorities are, and if you or anyone else is overly offended by mere words or sentiment, I recommend getting sincere professional help, in all do politeness...

Anyone can fake niceness, anyone can fake a smile, and many do just that. Be wary here Jedi, not everyone here are as they seem. With me, what you see is what you get, and I can't be motivated or bought with a rank bar. I have went out of my way for the membership here, and I continue do so...

A word of advice, care less for words, focus more on a individuals actions, and do not allow others to be detrimental to your path as a Jedi...

My Word is my Honor, and my Honor is my Life ~ Sturm Brightblade
Passion, yet Serenity
Knighted Apprentice Arisaig
TM- RyuJin
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