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What is it about society that bothers you so much?
10 Sep 2016 18:39 #256661
by
Replied by on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
Theater is one of the oldest art forms in which the writer lets an actor express her or his thoughts and feelings. Zenchi appears to completely negate the value of art a medium of expression. That an actor spoke the writer's speech does not negate the message. Theater and fiction are a perfectly good forms through which to speak the truth.
The message here echoes Nietzsche. Some parts of the actor's monologue expresses my experience and criticism of popular society, but not all society. Indeed, some heroes are manufactured, some so designated deny the status, while other heroes go unsung. The speaker expresses disappointed that the manufactured heroes turn out to be merely human after all; hardly news to anyone who has been paying even the least little attention, to which I would suggest something akin to 'grow up'. Harsh perhaps, but to me the point is to be our own heroes (a definition of Jediism), or to give up the need for heroes at all.
The message here echoes Nietzsche. Some parts of the actor's monologue expresses my experience and criticism of popular society, but not all society. Indeed, some heroes are manufactured, some so designated deny the status, while other heroes go unsung. The speaker expresses disappointed that the manufactured heroes turn out to be merely human after all; hardly news to anyone who has been paying even the least little attention, to which I would suggest something akin to 'grow up'. Harsh perhaps, but to me the point is to be our own heroes (a definition of Jediism), or to give up the need for heroes at all.
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10 Sep 2016 19:01 - 10 Sep 2016 19:29 #256663
by Zenchi
Not at all, seems you may have missed my point, and if I didn't make that clear I do apologize. I don't ignore the value of artistic expression, I rely upon it to make a living. I asked questions for a reason, because as it seems to me the external, artificial perspective is all we're concerned with anymore, it's where many of us go to seek "truth."
I'm just as guilty as the next person. Adi corrected me on using a Harrison Ford pic holding a sign that suggested "don't vote." Turns out the pic was photoshopped, lol.
Replied by Zenchi on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
Alan wrote: Theater is one of the oldest art forms in which the writer lets an actor express her or his thoughts and feelings. Zenchi appears to completely negate the value of art a medium of expression.
Not at all, seems you may have missed my point, and if I didn't make that clear I do apologize. I don't ignore the value of artistic expression, I rely upon it to make a living. I asked questions for a reason, because as it seems to me the external, artificial perspective is all we're concerned with anymore, it's where many of us go to seek "truth."
I'm just as guilty as the next person. Adi corrected me on using a Harrison Ford pic holding a sign that suggested "don't vote." Turns out the pic was photoshopped, lol.
Last edit: 10 Sep 2016 19:29 by Zenchi.
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11 Sep 2016 09:04 #256724
by x57z12
Replied by x57z12 on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
I had a classmate in school deliver the same speech at some point (not as eloquent, but including relevant points). I remember watching him, casting a disdainful glance across his shiny new IPhone, speaking about the terrible, terrible thing globalization is.
Hypocrite.
You want to lecture on the horrible society from the safety of your recliner while sipping on your Italian coffee and scrolling on your smartphone? Don’t mind if I don’t take you seriously. Fake insight, fake heroes … those are always the others. Couldn’t be me, proclaiming the truth from my comfy spot, certainly not, after all I speak out against it!
Why yes, I do think that a lot of society is shit but damn, it’s the best shit we’ve had in a long, long time. Especially when pointing out the thread about human progress (what, with how people live longer and better than ever and such).
They sneer at society, speaking with disgust in their voice while reaping the benefits, living it, and engaging its’ very core elements. Like posting a video of their repulsion of Facebook of all things. Got to appreciate the irony right there.
Now run along, sedate yourself with the hoax of seeing through this, the lie of being different because you see. You can enjoy the benefits, after all you are not fooled by it, right?
I liked Watt’s take on this. Those who proclaim to be without ego, are those whose ego has reached the last stage of self-preservation: Feigning not be there anymore. I think it applies here to. Thinking they know and see they are engulfed in their own hubris. Proven by how they change nothing, deny themselves nothing, unwilling to give up any of these sedative things.
Hypocrite.
You want to lecture on the horrible society from the safety of your recliner while sipping on your Italian coffee and scrolling on your smartphone? Don’t mind if I don’t take you seriously. Fake insight, fake heroes … those are always the others. Couldn’t be me, proclaiming the truth from my comfy spot, certainly not, after all I speak out against it!
Why yes, I do think that a lot of society is shit but damn, it’s the best shit we’ve had in a long, long time. Especially when pointing out the thread about human progress (what, with how people live longer and better than ever and such).
They sneer at society, speaking with disgust in their voice while reaping the benefits, living it, and engaging its’ very core elements. Like posting a video of their repulsion of Facebook of all things. Got to appreciate the irony right there.
Now run along, sedate yourself with the hoax of seeing through this, the lie of being different because you see. You can enjoy the benefits, after all you are not fooled by it, right?
I liked Watt’s take on this. Those who proclaim to be without ego, are those whose ego has reached the last stage of self-preservation: Feigning not be there anymore. I think it applies here to. Thinking they know and see they are engulfed in their own hubris. Proven by how they change nothing, deny themselves nothing, unwilling to give up any of these sedative things.
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11 Sep 2016 14:04 - 11 Sep 2016 14:05 #256738
by Edan
To be fair, it is very difficult not to be a hypocrite in this situation.... we are all part of a system that has issues, and we are all actively participating in said system, and we all benefit from said system (for the most part).
Many of us are hypocrites, who shout about world peace, but do nothing to further it, or environmental destruction, but still drive our cars 1 mile round the corner. No-one is perfect, no-one is doing all they can... and I say this as someone who knows they can do more, and should.
It's not about hypocrisy, it's about the message. Don't worry about who the speaker is, or what they do, listen to what they're saying... a message has value even without its speaker (especially without its speaker). What can you do? (General 'you')
It won't let me have a blank signature ...
Replied by Edan on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
Hypocrite.
To be fair, it is very difficult not to be a hypocrite in this situation.... we are all part of a system that has issues, and we are all actively participating in said system, and we all benefit from said system (for the most part).
Many of us are hypocrites, who shout about world peace, but do nothing to further it, or environmental destruction, but still drive our cars 1 mile round the corner. No-one is perfect, no-one is doing all they can... and I say this as someone who knows they can do more, and should.
It's not about hypocrisy, it's about the message. Don't worry about who the speaker is, or what they do, listen to what they're saying... a message has value even without its speaker (especially without its speaker). What can you do? (General 'you')
It won't let me have a blank signature ...
Last edit: 11 Sep 2016 14:05 by Edan.
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- Carlos.Martinez3
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11 Sep 2016 15:11 - 11 Sep 2016 15:19 #256744
by Carlos.Martinez3
Pastor of Temple of the Jedi Order
pastor@templeofthejediorder.org
Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
I m not sure what this topic is about.
Me personally, I have gotten to the point, a very long road, where society has minimal effect on me.
My uncle Curtiss told me one time, " carlus...u know what I do with my teeth when they hurt? " naturally my reply was what's that uncle Curtiss. He loved this one because he would pull them out and yell with a gum filled smile to the teeth on the counter " go ahead and hurt there."
Crude but the point is of some things bother us so much... maybe we should... take em out a bit. I am fortunate to be a free mi.ded thinker in a sense I no longer subscribe to the common thought and therefore do not often have the common annoyances and results as being " in it" it's a hard thing. So many times its the road less traveled that I choose cuz, it's less traveled and less paved with common opportunities to stumble. If society wants to hurt and maim them selfsame so be it. You can choose to NOT follow the common trend flow. All in all I like society. I like the places I take my family, I like to see the sights and marvels of the world, but I have learned you don't have to be a mechanic to be the only one "allowed" to wave at a pretty sweet car when it passes by, or be a musician, to sing along with my wife when I hear a song we know on the radio, anywhere. We have found our own set of rules. That is one of many possible solutions I think. What's wrong with society, to me, nothing. Am I part of it duhh...but I'm not common. We don't have to be similar to the things we see. There's no rule that says WE the PEOPLE must act all like this. I give the space needed some times. Hope this is another view rather than the common.
Me personally, I have gotten to the point, a very long road, where society has minimal effect on me.
My uncle Curtiss told me one time, " carlus...u know what I do with my teeth when they hurt? " naturally my reply was what's that uncle Curtiss. He loved this one because he would pull them out and yell with a gum filled smile to the teeth on the counter " go ahead and hurt there."
Crude but the point is of some things bother us so much... maybe we should... take em out a bit. I am fortunate to be a free mi.ded thinker in a sense I no longer subscribe to the common thought and therefore do not often have the common annoyances and results as being " in it" it's a hard thing. So many times its the road less traveled that I choose cuz, it's less traveled and less paved with common opportunities to stumble. If society wants to hurt and maim them selfsame so be it. You can choose to NOT follow the common trend flow. All in all I like society. I like the places I take my family, I like to see the sights and marvels of the world, but I have learned you don't have to be a mechanic to be the only one "allowed" to wave at a pretty sweet car when it passes by, or be a musician, to sing along with my wife when I hear a song we know on the radio, anywhere. We have found our own set of rules. That is one of many possible solutions I think. What's wrong with society, to me, nothing. Am I part of it duhh...but I'm not common. We don't have to be similar to the things we see. There's no rule that says WE the PEOPLE must act all like this. I give the space needed some times. Hope this is another view rather than the common.
Pastor of Temple of the Jedi Order
pastor@templeofthejediorder.org
Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova
Last edit: 11 Sep 2016 15:19 by Carlos.Martinez3.
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11 Sep 2016 18:00 #256758
by rugadd
rugadd
Replied by rugadd on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
I think building up and having to break down our perception of the world is part of the human experience. I have changed my world view multiple times. I expect to do so again.
This wasn't any more than disillusioned teenage angst to me. Not to down play how hard that stage of life can be. I was there. I felt it too. I completely rejected a lot of things because of those perceptions and feelings.
Now-a-days I am way more appreciative of suffering and what it can teach us...of the benefits of pain, hunger, and disillusion. This isn't about good/bad...it's about things flowing along a river and the dips and turns that come with that journey.
I don't think I'm making much sense.
This wasn't any more than disillusioned teenage angst to me. Not to down play how hard that stage of life can be. I was there. I felt it too. I completely rejected a lot of things because of those perceptions and feelings.
Now-a-days I am way more appreciative of suffering and what it can teach us...of the benefits of pain, hunger, and disillusion. This isn't about good/bad...it's about things flowing along a river and the dips and turns that come with that journey.
I don't think I'm making much sense.
rugadd
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12 Sep 2016 01:47 #256803
by Adder
Replied by Adder on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
Because people forget what pain is, and the brain cannot allow that to happen else it will weaken its function in our survival. And so the subconscious has to maintain a continual sensation of discontent weaved through our perception - to allow pain to jump back front and center as fast as possible into our consciousness so we can instinctively react when needed. Like a neuron has a resting potential, its alive and waiting ready to fire up. It 'idles' in this way, and so we can 'sit' in it and view everything in that negative light, but also use it to cast aspersion where none is needed because lets be frank, it's easier to be discontent when others are as well. Because of all this it can make a person feel like anger is the most real version of themselves..... but from another point of view there is no greater hypocrisy then holding onto that tiny resting pain to the extent that we forget what real pain is and so create it upon ourselves and others to justify our fixation on it.
That is my initial reaction, and along those lines all the things he talks about need to be seen in an equivalent or greater context - which is completely lacking and therefore unbalanced and only representative of its own imbalance?
That is my initial reaction, and along those lines all the things he talks about need to be seen in an equivalent or greater context - which is completely lacking and therefore unbalanced and only representative of its own imbalance?
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12 Sep 2016 23:51 #256931
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Replied by on topic What is it about society that bothers you so much?
"What is it about society that bothers you so much? "
Too much bull shit. It's a short answer but that is what came into my mind first.
Too much bull shit. It's a short answer but that is what came into my mind first.
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