The Force vs. Wyrd

3 years 9 months ago #349788 by Cyan Sarden
As we don't seem to have a forum for Heathenry (Pagan believes and modern Heathenry have been drifting apart for a while now), I'll just post this here:

Are there any modern Heathens here? If so, have any of you compared the ideas of the Force with the concept of Wyrd in Heathenry?
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3 years 9 months ago #349801 by Rex
Replied by Rex on topic The Force vs. Wyrd
Wow, it's been a while since I've seen you around Cyan. How are you?
I honestly don't know enough about either to know what's the difference. In your opinion what separates the two?
Also are you suggesting a separate SIG?
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3 years 9 months ago - 3 years 9 months ago #349802 by OB1Shinobi
Replied by OB1Shinobi on topic The Force vs. Wyrd
I will follow Rex’s example and say GOOD TO SEE YOU AGAIN, Cyan. Should have mentioned it earlier, really. How have you been?

Uh, i call myself a heathen as kind of an irreverent jab at religious fundamentalism but i had no idea there was an actual heathen community.
Last edit: 3 years 9 months ago by OB1Shinobi.
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3 years 9 months ago #349810 by Carlos.Martinez3
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic The Force vs. Wyrd
..."In my own search of all my search of my books and stuff in my own library ive found- nothing on the subject." I would love a explanation of your action and pros and cons of it and see if some of that parallels my own heathenish practices. Truthfully, ive been called heathen all my life but it was due to insults and hard jabs at me "NOT" being like others. Im amazed at you just coming back in and stirring my pot my friend. It is good to see ya back. So I ask- is it the "heathen" term here a general inclusion for not Abrahamic or is it direct and have a bit much more to it? I would actually like to know. This is coming from one who practices and studys - everything and sometimes anything. Ive heard of much but this is a huge world my friend - I could be missing pieces to a picture you may be holding or even that newest member who walked right in the door... im down to learn - teach an ol dog new tricks?

Wyrd- I looked it up and found such a general term used to describe the" Force" behind the Norse German Wicken - the spirit of it - What we would call the Force but more shaping mans lifes and fate intervening with direct actions being the possibility of steering with actions?

For me: witch doctors or "curanderos" are not book taught but " experience lead and guided." Book reading came later for me in my seeking and has benefit me and my own family greatly. Personally im not the same as those who came before me but only an addition to what has been- that what has been - is what ive been taught and how i practice is what everyone and thing share. Im amazed to see definitions of things in my real life pop up when they do- even from whom sometimes.

What is that flow? What and which is the description of one thing seen my many others?

I personally look forward to what this may bring.
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2 years 4 months ago #361869 by Silenus
Replied by Silenus on topic The Force vs. Wyrd
I figured that the intersection between Jediism and modern reconstructionist Heathenry was going to be fairly "small," but it is good to see that there is at least one other person who's walked down that path to at least some degree.

So I would say personally that there is probably a decent overlap in the concept of the Force and wyrd (and in turn, luck). Though a lot of people attribute wyrd to be equal to "fate," it's more akin to a starting line, per se.

Diving into the concepts of "Orlog" is where you'd find I think a lot of the meat of this. So with the concept of Orlog, you inherit your wyrd and luck from your ancestors. The people who came before you essentially determine your lot in life and the hurdles that have been set up in front of you. It doesn't mean you're doomed to follow a path from birth (ie - Fate), it's more that's your starting platform for the decisions you make to improve your life and the wyrd/luck you will pass on to your family should you choose to have one.

This starts getting more complicated, of course, when you start getting into the blending of personal wyrd/luck and tribal wyrd/luck. But regardless, the good and honorable actions (or lack thereof) you take that help to build your "worth" ripple through both your family and the "tribe"/community you belong to. Your actions reflect on those your keep company with and hold close. They reflect on your children and your parents. So it is all connected. You, your family, your community/village, and society at large.

And yes, I believe that "heathens of yore" saw this as an energy of sorts that connected them all.

Unfortunately a lot of the evidence for that needs to be pieced together. But I think there's enough of it there to have a good idea. Between outlawry/banishment for misdeeds done to the group. To atoning for the transgressions of your family via weregild. Plenty of the Sagas of the Icelanders go out of their way to show how family lines are connected and you can work to better the "karmic" stance you inherit, so to speak.

Or I'm just rambling a bunch, which is entirely possible, because Heathenry.
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2 years 2 months ago #362989 by
Replied by on topic The Force vs. Wyrd
Interesting that I have been presented with the aspects of my own practice and I am at a loss for words. The Wyrd has to do with the Norns, or the weavers of fate. In a failed attempt to sound Philosophical, here's the deal. The Norns deal with Orlog which is the sum of your past + your presents actions to create the general direction you are heading. Who and what you'll encounter and how the universe will aid you or impede you ( neither is necessarily good). Upon the concept of good/evil, the Norse believed in safe/dangerous. Hero's and villains are both dangerous and each is dependent on the existence of the other.

The Force, at least I think I'm getting this right, is much more akin to the Tao. Which is a place holder of existence in total, since if we define the Tao it becomes a false Tao. Basically, the Wyrd is a vital essence of the Force that controls flow.

I feel the wyrd is akin to the change ( what is read in the I Ching) or karma, while the force seems more like the All or the Tao or Brahma ( tho I know little to nothing about Hindu). Gaia I think or the Great Spirit, is a better representation of the Force. I think personifying it makes less of its understandability. A Diamond is a rock, but that's not why it is special. Heresy all around! May the Force be with you.

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