There is no Death

...There is the Force.

We've all heard that a million times, eh? But something got my mind back on that topic and seeing it in a slightly different light. That something was the movie Solaris. Don't worry, I won't give away plot points.

My point in posting this is that the movie made me rethink that line of the Code. If there is no death, what is life? The only answer I can come up with is that life is everything, be it in this human form, some animal, or the spirit that lets go of the body after what we call death.

So we must always be moving on, from one form of life to another. There is no "real" and "unreal". No "life" and "afterlife". It all just flows, like a river taking bends in many directions, but is still always a river. And who knows what is floating in that river with us? What is the source of the water? What ocean does that river flow out to? We are here, in this life, this existence, but what makes it real? (please no Matrix references) For all I know I could be "dead" and living in some reality that I am creating with my mind. Is there even a difference?

I know this is all just metaphorical rhetoric, but I suppose if you want to understand why I wrote this, watch the movie.

Love that film. Which version?

I didn't know there was more than one version, so I can't really answer that question. :dry:

Streen wrote: I didn't know there was more than one version, so I can't really answer that question. :dry:

If it looked "new" then it's the latest one (the other two versions were in the 60s and 70s).

Funnily enough, the author of the original story doesn't really like the movie adaptations. He says they focus on human sexual relationships at the expense of his main idea (that is: it's likely that humans would ultimately fail to communicate with an ET). Quote:

This is why the book was entitled "Solaris" and not "Love in Outer Space"

:laugh:

While I have not read the book, nor watched the movie, I understand what you are saying. It is very similar to my own beliefs, and has shaped my personal ability to deal with death and the perception of loss. It's pleasent to know that others have similar views.

There is no Death there is the Force.

The earth is a living breathing organism. Outside of the spiritual sense of things its obvious that your body is borrowed from the earth. In time it must be returned. So upon death you dont go to a place where dead things are you go to a place of life. There is no Death there is only the Force is an observation of this. It may be OUR code but its not a law of the universe. Its just how we understand death. :lol:

The simplest metaphor I've yet to contemplate for my perception of the nature of life and death:

Take a blanket (the universe... the force)

Grab one small area of it

Twist it up into a thin "focused" cone protruding out of the blanket (one human, animal, plant, or other life)

After a while, let go of it and let it relax again (death)

The part you grabbed is still there. It's just not focused into a single point anymore. The whole time, what you were grabbing was the blanket. You would be more thoroughly correct to call it "grabbing the blanket" than only saying "creating a twisted cone", because the cone is simply the shape of that part of the blanket. In the same way, each entity of "life" for us is the universe focusing itself into different shapes out of its whole fabric. Its nature, however, is that of constant change (its always moving, always "happening"), so eventually, that focal point of energy leaves that area, relaxes back into the whole of the fabric, and the energy that created that focal point is re-distributed to other parts of it, to create other focal points of energy in other areas of the fabric. Each focal point of energy is created out of a combination of energies from other parts of the fabric (the force). But the whole time, all everything is, is simply the blanket (the Force). "There is no death, there is the Force" in this case, is saying "You do not end, you simply blend back into the fabric of the universe."

That is a very apt explanation, Proteus It's funny in a way, because we tend to think 2-dimensionally, so the blanket metaphor works well for our limited brains. When I try to take it a step further in the 3-dimensional world, my brain does a backflip because I can't mentally pull matter out of "nothingness", like the cone from the blanket. Which, for me, brings another dimension into play.

I know most scientists say that that Time is the 4th dimension. That may be true, but what is the dimension from which "we" are pulled? Maybe it's Time. Throughout the timeline we do "pull up" and then "flatten out" again. Of course, one may ask, is there a 5th dimension that we return to after we flatten out?

I have a headache now. :ohmy:

EDIT: I just noticed that my current signature is actually relevant to this conversation

Well actually even if there is another dimension that doesn't mean we've came from it... because dimensions are not places... mathematically speaking... we - thinking we are from a 3d world- are part of more... yet we can't see or move in them... but we are still in all of them, because if the world is 4d or more, a 3d objects can not exist in it... like that we don't have a 2d object in our 3d world.. not sure if that makes sense to you.

Many users of the drug known as DMT report interacting with entities that exhibit intelligence while on a DMT trip, and theorize that the drug could be used as a gate to parallel dimensions. Joe Rogan himself has stated that death could be nothing more than a door to this very same dimension as the brain floods with DMT at or right before the moment of death...
http://www.spiritscienceandmetaphysics.com/can-dmt-connect-the-human-brain-to-a-parallel-universe/
https://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dmt/dmt_writings2.shtml

Psychosis as a consistent state of belief in an altered reality does tend to appear to people as a 'new truth', and sometimes it makes more sense to them (then the previous 'sane' shared reality the rest of us seem to live in) - hence the belief and entrenchment of the psychosis. As a result of that process... it can often integrate with other peoples normality/reality in complex 'delusional' relationships (from others perspectives) - even having rock solid belief/faith in other dimensions and beings as seemingly real and existent. It's certainly not proof of other dimensions that people experience them, but ya never know!!!

Having experienced a couple of near death moments myself (not intended, not recommended), my own experiences were that the mind can at times become deluded (or transcendent, depending on ones beliefs) in that manner above. From that perspective there can be lots of complex scenario's which would support some of the more fanciful religious and spiritual concepts of the afterlife. What someone believes about something like death can be quite personal I'd imagine.

So I do not think it's so important if someone believes or does not believe the Code about death literally, its a personal thing of course, and it can certainly help some people when dealing with suffering or death related trauma.

Personally I remain open minded; the shoe marked R here and the other one marked L over there :blink:

I think people can overcome the fear of death by experiencing it - the experience of imminent departure can become familiar, the loss of control of ones destiny realized, and the issues outstanding... clear to be resolved or accepted as unresolved. I guess it makes sense survival is the best remedy for the fear of not surviving!

I couldn't agree more, Adder. It seems we have a little something in common, because I've had a near-death experience myself, and as you said, scenarios play out in the most complex and perplexing ways. Not particularly pleasant, I can say with certainty. Unlike most reports that have that "light at the end of a tunnel" effect, mine was more like a nightmare that I couldn't wake up from. This, I've concluded, was just my mind manifesting what I feared about the afterlife, and didn't actually "die" at all.

Still, that whole experience has more or less cured me of any fear of death. It's really not something I can express in words.

I have many ways I try to equate the cycle of life and how it ties into the Force. My most recent one is this:

The force, the earth, life as we know it is the bass and the drums to the song of the entity we call life. I'm going to use metal as an example because \m/ (that's a good enough reason for me.) I digress, in metal and rock, the bass and the drums set the framework for the song. They are our environment. They sustain us by providing us an eisel to paint our piece on (e.g. Guitars, vocals, keyboard, synthisyzer, etc.) The force (life) provides all living things the baseline, the eisel, the fabric which allows us to interact with the things in our environment.

That being said, there are climaxes and falls in every story. Some see death as a climax, others as a fall. Death is merely something we must meet one day. The more prepared we are for it, I'm sure the less a surprise it will be should we find ourselves in an afterlife. But until that day, I will continue painting my life on the fabric of the force. Few remember the artists face, sound of their voice, or other personal traits. But everyone remembers their works. My philosophy is to reach out and touch as many people's lives in a positive way as much as possible. That way my legacy will be a positive one. Whether or not I'm remembered.

Proteus wrote: The simplest metaphor I've yet to contemplate for my perception of the nature of life and death:

Take a blanket (the universe... the force)

Grab one small area of it

Twist it up into a thin "focused" cone protruding out of the blanket (one human, animal, plant, or other life)

After a while, let go of it and let it relax again (death)

The part you grabbed is still there. It's just not focused into a single point anymore.

You've summed up something I've felt and believed since childhood in a far more concise and eloquent way than I could have managed. I'll be using this analogy next time I come to explain this to someone - thanks so much, Proteus.

Zenchi wrote: Many users of the drug known as DMT report interacting with entities that exhibit intelligence while on a DMT trip, and theorize that the drug could be used as a gate to parallel dimensions. Joe Rogan himself has stated that death could be nothing more than a door to this very same dimension as the brain floods with DMT at or right before the moment of death...
http://www.spiritscienceandmetaphysics.com/can-dmt-connect-the-human-brain-to-a-parallel-universe/
https://www.erowid.org/chemicals/dmt/dmt_writings2.shtml

Thanks for the links, this topic fascinates me. A DMT trip at the start of this year is kind of what centered my focus on my spiritual path. I'm not sure what entity I interacted with, but as soon as my trip started a feminine presence picked me up and shot me in to a different dimension. It was an amazing and humbling experience.


On a different note, the topic of death is what planted the seed of doubt in my mind when it came to the religion I was raised in to. A lot of people close to me died at a young age, and what I was hearing from the people around me did not comfort me like it seemed to comfort them. My family are members of a southern baptist church, and all I kept hearing was how I just need to listen to Jesus and I'll see my family again one day. Then I began to wonder what happened to the people before Christianity and a few years of thought later here I am. I'm glad I broke free from the way death is dealt with by other people, I am so much more at peace now. Everyone I have ever lost is a part of me just as much as I am.

Hum... really, there is no death, but the illusion of separation between life and death... just like there is the illusion of separation between the "me" and the "world", "past" and "future"...

"(...)all the paths are empty (nothingness), do not born, do not end (...)", as the Heart Sutra says...

For a different perspective from which we Westerners we are used,recommend that you read "The Bard Thodol" - "Liberation Through Hearing in the Intermediate State," commonly known as "The Tibetan Book of the Dead", is simple fantastic.

That is the next book that I planned to order, so I'm glad to hear that! Remember Be Here Now was a very eye opening book

Zeph wrote: "(...)all the paths are empty (nothingness), do not born, do not end (...)", as the Heart Sutra says..

True (to a point), it's what we do with it that matters. Jediism as a path is essentially nothing until it is molded and wielded into a workable philosophy that instills it's followers with the awareness that they each possess the power to better their lives and the world around them...

Zenchi wrote:

Zeph wrote: "(...)all the paths are empty (nothingness), do not born, do not end (...)", as the Heart Sutra says..

True (to a point), it's what we do with it that matters. Jediism as a path is essentially nothing until it is molded and wielded into a workable philosophy that instills it's followers with the awareness that they each possess the power to better their lives and the world around them...

Exactly the point! All the phenomenons are "empty of inherent meaning".

When we say "all," that means everything, including the the path. We see a phenomenon as something with characteristics, and as an object that is conceived by a subject. To hold that an object is something external is ignorance, and it is this that prevents us from seeing the truth of that object.
The truth of a phenomenon is emptiness, which implies that the phenomenon does not possess a truly existent essence or nature: we (our minds) construct and give meaning to the phenomenon...