Practice what you Preach...

Ok… I have noticed some contradictions between what is taught and what is practiced. And I am NOT calling anyone out specifically but I would like to get opinions on the matter.

We, and I teach it too, are taught NOT to let our emotions control us. I have had discussions with others before about different emotional levels and (if I remember correctly) passion was an emotion or could be driven by emotions. The discrepancy comes from the fact that I have noticed (several times) masters, knights and members stating how they are “driven” by their passions.

I realize that the “Sith” are driven by their emotions and passions, but the ones I am referring to are proclaimed Jedi.

Any thoughts?

Yes, you are correct... We do talk about controlling of the emotions...

Passion is not a bad thing... Nothing is..lol...

Letting the Passion lead you around by the nose ring is what needs to be watched for...

Our passions for being Jedi is what will excel our site...

But, as none of us are perfect, we have to practice this "controlling of emotion"...

And when it is your passion, you might slip before you catch it...

It happens... Forgive the transgressor (even yourself) for their slip, and move on...

From my journal, on the Jedi code:

“There is no Passion; There is Serenity."

Within this statement, passion is not to say “vigor for living a bright life”. It means “impulsiveness”. There are times in life when we are enjoying or wanting of something so much that we may become impulsive toward it and do something foolish. At times like these, patience is a critical thing to have, for within patience, we find the ability to be truly calm, to let things be the way they are meant to be and fall where they are meant to fall. Passion (in this sense) tends to act as a pressuring or rebellious resistance upon the current reality of things. Learning calmness allows us serenity and enables us to keep from being consumed by impulsiveness in the moment or circumstance.

In short - The Force guides us to serenity in times when passion (ie. attachment) may consume.

I personally view it as described in "The Vows of the Jedi" seen here .

The Vow of Contemplation: A Jedi must possess a clear mind and approach life and situations from an objective perspective. Emotion, while not bad, can influence the perceptions and judgment of a Jedi and care must be taken to insure that the position of the Jedi is unbiased. To this end meditation is a highly recommended practice that can both clear the mind as well as teaching patience. Meditation is a key in the life of the Jedi and it affords the Jedi the opportunity to commune with the Force and leads them to a greater self-understanding.


The Vow of Moderation: Balance is key to the life of the Jedi and moderation in all things contributes to this balance. Too little of a thing can lead to deprivation and covetousness. And yet too much can lead to greed and waste. A Jedi must strive to attain only what they need and desire within the bounds of reason. Too little or too much of a thing can be equally destructive and both leach at the peace and contentment of the Jedi.


The Vow of Attachment: Attachment is vital to the life of the Jedi. The Jedi must know life and be intrinsically tied to it in order to better serve the will of the Force. Jedi must possess ties to the people around them and are encouraged to love. Love is a strong connection to the basis of humanity and can serve as a strong foundation of strength and encouragement when a Jedi needs them most.


The Vow of Restraint: A Jedi must learn restraint and must strenuously practice it in all their dealings with others. As conscious conduits of the Fore the Jedi must restrain themselves in their dealings with others. As people Jedi possess passions and opinions and the Jedi must take care not to force these views upon others. A Jedi must realize that their thoughts, feelings, and even intentions leave impressions upon the Force that echo outwards and touch the world and people that surround them. Above all, a Jedi must learn physical restraint. Conflict is a necessary and inevitable aspect of life and yet a Jedi must take care to minimize this conflict. Physical violence must be regarded as only a final and most desperate alternative when all attempts at reason and negotiation have failed.

I know they're not required but I consider them to be fairly sound reasoning so I do.

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pas·sion   [pash-uhn] Show IPA
noun
1.
any powerful or compelling emotion or feeling, as love or hate.
2.
strong amorous feeling or desire; love; ardor.
3.
strong sexual desire; lust.
4.
an instance or experience of strong love or sexual desire.
5.
a person toward whom one feels strong love or sexual desire.


It is essential to being, it is essential to living. Without it, what are you? If you are not driven by the things you have a passion for, then what drives you? What motivation for anything do you have? Part of peoples identity comes from the things they are passionate about. Passion in and of itself isn't an emotion, it is as described above; a product of emotions, feelings, and desires. Now look at the first lines of the Sith Code: Peace is a lie, there is only Passion. Through Passion I gain Strength. I offer up to anyone to prove how this is not true. Even when you think you are operating solely of of "knowledge" it is your feeling or desire to act in that way that drives the action, it's your passion for acting off of what you know more than what you feel, however you are still doing just that in essence.

Let's take a look at "Peace"

peace   [pees] Show IPA noun, interjection, verb, peaced, peac·ing.
noun
1.
the normal, nonwarring condition of a nation, group of nations, or the world.
2.
( often initial capital letter ) an agreement or treaty between warring or antagonistic nations, groups, etc., to end hostilities and abstain from further fighting or antagonism: the Peace of Ryswick.
3.
a state of mutual harmony between people or groups, especially in personal relations: Try to live in peace with your neighbors.
4.
the normal freedom from civil commotion and violence of a community; public order and security: He was arrested for being drunk and disturbing the peace.
5.
cessation of or freedom from any strife or dissension.

Looking at definition 3, and then looking around at the world we live in, current events, and most importantly history; I think the statement "Peace is a Lie" holds up rather well. Sure, it may exist temporarily here and there, but it never holds, and even within so called "Peaceful Nations" there are numerous examples of "Peace" as defined in other definitions being in short supply. Look within your own communities and you can see unrest between people and groups especially. So where is this "Peace"?

Looking at definition 4, once again "Peace is a Lie" holds up rather well. There is not one community you can name in the world free from commotion and violence, not matter how much order and security is enforced or sought after. The reality is that these things will always exist so long as mankind exists.

Looking at definition 5, once again "Peace is a Lie" holds up rather well. Freedom from strife or dissention? I think we can all look at reality, at our lives, and see that this state does not exist and never can exist so long as WE exist. There will always be strife, there will always be dissention. One may try to take on the utopian idea that someway, somehow, someday man will evolve to the point where this is so, but I think we all know otherwise. There is no way to stop people from having pain in their lives, and to do so would change the dynamic of the human experience. We learn from pain, we learn from our struggles, and this idea that we can attain this great peace where everything is great, where no pain exists, everyone gets along, etc....It's a nice idea, but the reality of it is a lie.

Now finally, lets look at Strength, which we gain through the passion which drives us.

strength   [strengkth, strength, strenth] Show IPA
noun
1.
the quality or state of being strong; bodily or muscular power; vigor.
2.
mental power, force, or vigor.
3.
moral power, firmness, or courage.
4.
power by reason of influence, authority, resources, numbers, etc.
5.
number, as of personnel or ships in a force or body: a regiment with a strength of 3000.

Does this not speak for itself? I think it's kind of self explanatory how we gain strength through passion. Your passion forces you to find whatever form of strength it is you need to meet the goals of your desires. This strength empowers you, you gain the power over the situation, and in doing so then are led to victory, to achieving your goals. And, it is only when you lose this passion that you relinquish the strength and power you had. I think this applies heavily to the challenges that we face in anything we work towards. There are always obstacles and hindrances and these things can put out our fire if we allow it, and that is when we lose control of the situation. However, if you hold onto that passion, if we let it erupt in flames instead of fizzling out, the resolve, the strength you gain from that (and it is an act of will) will lead you on to victory and nothing can stop you. You will find a way, you will not accept defeat, but you must choose it. It very much is a conscious decision to be stronger, to take the power into your own hands by eliminating the obstacles or finding ways to break through the walls, by your will you will succeed, by the power and strength of your passion.

I am more of shadow and at times allow emotions to control and drive me..


Weacli Warde your thread is now got me thinking about emotion and jedi, your are correct in what you say...

From my journal, P.9

Sajjad Heydari wrote:
I've heard many places from many people that anger must be controlled, it shouldn't be freed or it may harm others. But recently I met some 'strange' guys, who believe in something really funny at first and amazing when you look closer. They told me that anger is in human nation, if you control it, you are saving it, and then one day you will get out of memory and spoil your anger all over (lol), so you must get rid of your anger slowly, or in good ways.

I asked them what do they mean by good way, and their answer was really amazing! Anger could make you stronger, it might be dangerous, but it is useful on it's place.

These guys completely changed my opinion about anger...! it could be good...!

I made up my own superior :lol: definitions into a matrix;

Tier 4:
. feeling (physical sensation)
. thought (conscious thought)

Tier 3:
. emotion (strong feeling incorporating subconscious decision making (thought))

Tier 2:
. loss/sadness (strong emotion feeling aspects of sacrifice).
. anxiety/fear (strong emotion thinking about aspects of sacrifice).

Tier 1;
. passion (strong emotion integrating aspects of self-sacrifice)

Feelings can be generated by the direct peripheral nervous system signaling, subconsicous thoughts, or by specific conscious thoughts </guessing>.

I chose these definitions because it seems to fit best, and it is supported somewhat in their literary roots;

feeling = old english felan, meaning to perceive.
emotion = latin emovere, meaning without movement.
passion = ancient greek pashko, meaning to suffer.

So in this thread perhaps the self sacrifice in passion could be when a poster betrays their own standards in trying to achieve a point in a post.

I still agree all those things can be valuable and used.... its just I think that the deeper the emotion the more subconscious input starts to interfere with conscious reason. At Tier 4 conscious control might be >90%, but it probably decreases down to some manner, say Tier 3 at 80%, Tier 2 at 70%, Tier 1 at 60%->0%. Zero percent being when your subconscious takes over completely momentarily in a fight of flight response as a pure state of passion.

There is no Passion, There is Serenity

Passion, yet Serenity

The code is written 2 ways for a reason. The first way tells us that even in our external passionate endeavors, we must remain serene in our inner mind.

The second way tells us that both Passion and Serenity can co-exist.

Both ways compliment each other and intertwine the concept of reaching goals.