TOTJO- Proposals and issues for 27th Jan `09

Angelus wrote:

Ah, well then why do we even need representation? We can manage ourselves. Or perhaps we should have a forum! After all, the Knights and Masters are no more important than we are, correct? I'd like to propose that, rather than the apprentices and initiates be represented, why don't we just have our own meetings and forums?

This has nothing to do with importance. This has to do with members having finished their training and using that knowledge to help build the Temple. That is why they are called knights. And if you wish to organise mettings then do so, be my guest.

What's the problem? I meant no harm, I just meant that we should ALL be getting active around here. And I think, regardless of training, everyones input is valuable. Even ours.

I don`t have a problem Angelus. And if you noticed in the first post of this thread I asked all members to place their ideas and suggestions.

Angelus wrote:

That is a nice suggestion, Kana, though, wouldn't it be more appropriate to have an apprentice, representing the apprentices? Again, i'm going through the motions, but we need to be represented by one of our own apprentices, and not a Knight or a Master, who hasn't been an apprentice for some time. If I can, and if he'll accept, i'd like to nominate Nephilim to be the apprentices representative. I trust him, and he is my friend. I know he can serve the position well.

Initiates dont stay that way for long - neither do apprentices (in the grand scheme of things)

Also a side note and not an excuse - the chat room wont cope with too many people on board _ I already feel it may cope as it stands. The idea of this meeting once it gets going as a regulr thing is for the Knights to have a meeting on a regular basis - the Masters already do in their own way (the EC meeting) - the point of the FIRST 'Knights' meeting is for the Masters/Knights and Admins -to bash out the critical items on the agenda and set the subsequent format of future meetings.

Your input is welcome and valued but in terms of who attends - we have to draw a line somewhere. Its nothing against you personally - its nothing against initiates/apprentices/guests - if anyone wished to take offence - then that's up to them - but it inst meant.

Anakin (EP1) wasn't present in Masters meetings - neither were many others.

MTFBWY - A

I fail to see why an apprentice would need representation?

And if you DO need it than that's what your Master is for.

Well - my initial idea was for the 'group' the collective - Initiated, Apprentices and Guests to be served/represented by a Knight = they could give their input to this individual and relay it to the meeting - i dont know its seemingly so hard a concept for people to grasp.

Anyway -

MTFBWY - A

Why do we need to represent anything? Are we not on the same side? We are all Jedi speaking for the Jedi. As I said all members can say what they wish here in this thread (Guests, Initiates, Knights, Masters, Grandmasters...). All comments will be taken up and discussed. The discussions on the 27th are also not final but one of ideas and proposals. It is an opportunity for the Knights of our Temple to start putting their heads together. Nothing more nor less. I don`t see what is such a problem for people who have been trained, awarded the duty of Knighthood to be able to exercise that right without someone else getting upset that they maybe neglected. Maybe we should rethink what training and apprenticeship is all about.

Was that comment directed towards me, \"friend\"? Because if it is, I must contradict. My Master is a fantastic teacher, and I could not ask for a better one. I'm not going to fight with you, but you have absolutely no say over my apprenticeship, and no one should question it.

I propose you let us represent ourselves, or that we just not be represented at all. To the point enough for you?

MTFBWY

Alex we understand your point. Please be respectful here.

He is right Alex. While I am honored by your words. Master Jon is merely saying things in general.