Alcohol

Some people have better instincts than others too. I know what you mean most of my family are alcoholics or were. It wasn't what killed them but it definitely played a role in having unstable relationships with everyone around them. My white great grandfather being an exception he never ruined relationships everyone loved him lol the max he did was annoy my great grandmother a little bit lol it depends on what kind of person you are without the substance too I believe any kind of drug will likely amplify certain parts of your personality the drug affects if that makes sense. Even a drug as simple as money that isn't an ingestabke substance only amplifies who we are. If you are rich & a genuine nice giving person you'll probably only be more genuine more nice & more giving but if you're a evil person with money its likely you'll only do more evil. So i imagine certain drugs will amplify certain things about you. If you take pcp or meth i imagine that amplifies your nutty side lmao etc. Etc. Everyone is different so things affect us differently some people may be happy people but when they drink it brings out theur depressive side others are happy people they drink & only get happier lol human beings are very complicated creatures for sure because we are all a little different even tho we are the same.

Alcohol is a drug. It is classed as a depressant, meaning that it slows down vital functions—resulting in slurred speech, unsteady movement, disturbed perceptions and an inability to react quickly. As for how it affects the mind, it is best understood as a drug that reduces a person’s ability to think rationally and distorts his or her judgment.
It’s funny how we say - it lightens the mood or it makes us giggle or it gives courage , when in real life it’s a depressant and not a stimulant. Then again some people are different... some body’s don’t react the same. Even balances can be different as well.

Its definitely one of the hardest drugs out there because of its availability it kills 88 thousand a year i think if i remember right. But yea it is a cns like many depressive drugs it slows many people down while other people may act outright insane on it without a doubt it highly impairs judgement either way but that's the case with every narcotic. Depends on imbalances too some people may take the same medication while one person processes it slower than the other the other person may process it very fast and may even be allergic to it because of it being processed to slow or too fast.

I think, like what other people have said, that it is all about moderation. With all things in life there needs to be balance. i myself do like a drink every now and again with my friends when I go out. However, on the flip side my mother has been an alcoholic for the vast majority of my life.

If you were to consult any medical text, you would see even things that are considered healthy and are necessary for our survival can be detrimental such as Vitamin C. In moderation this is a basic need for survival however, too much or overdosing can lead to side effects from mild digestive discomfort all the way to patients having kidney stones ( in the most extreme cases).

I don't drink for personal reasons not so much anything mentioned previously but just to further echo what others' have said, being informed, personal choice, and moderation. Too much of anything can kill you...even oxygen...water...sugar....at the same time you need all these things to live! But too much can still kill you!

I will say there will be probably some talk about balance within your studies here, some believe in it some don't. While balance is definitely a thing, it's been my experience in my time here that its not in balance, its the constant act of finding balance. If you think of a double-sided scale or weighing things between two hands, its not about finding the perfect middle. It's the movement going back and forth to the middle that makes life worthwhile. In one my of my apprentice journals I believe I wrote about meditation in transitions in noting that the force is more in the change then it is in the existing, or at least in our ability to feel it, at least for me. Everyone's experiences are different.

My *personal* take is that it's a bad thing, very little good can come of it in the long run.

Having said that, I am by turns a teetotaller and a drunk, presumably because of limitations of my own self-soothing and limited access to legal mood modifiers.


I don't know that Jediism has a definite view per se, though you may note a number of the "Feeder" religions and philosophies into Jeddism do, so the "trend" would be towards a life with resources (time, money, health) spent on other things.

Tellahane wrote: I don't drink for personal reasons not so much anything mentioned previously but just to further echo what others' have said, being informed, personal choice, and moderation. Too much of anything can kill you...even oxygen...water...sugar....at the same time you need all these things to live! But too much can still kill you!

I will say there will be probably some talk about balance within your studies here, some believe in it some don't. While balance is definitely a thing, it's been my experience in my time here that its not in balance, its the constant act of finding balance. If you think of a double-sided scale or weighing things between two hands, its not about finding the perfect middle. It's the movement going back and forth to the middle that makes life worthwhile. In one my of my apprentice journals I believe I wrote about meditation in transitions in noting that the force is more in the change then it is in the existing, or at least in our ability to feel it, at least for me. Everyone's experiences are different.

That's pretty much what I was going to say.

It all depends on why you drink or don't drink. If you drink because you feel you need to, that's a problem. That's an attachment. There's a fine line between attachments and addictions which is why you should be wary of attachments in general. Just wary. If you are conscious and aware enough to see the danger and temptation then you may not have a problem. Sometimes its simply the dopamine release that triggers that urge but that urge for dopamine can be satisfied from some other source of dop...amine.

But we don't need to demonize everything that could potentially be a problem, because that... would... be... everything. Some religions spend 99% of the time telling you what you can't do and when you're like "well what can I do?" and they're like "uh... you can pray!" But often those religions are the main culprits that inspire rebellion and revolution. So I think telling people what not to do is less effective then giving people positive goals and if there's anything keeping you from that positive goal then you should simply consider how much energy you put into it. I'd like to do more writing but there's a time and place for everything, including personal enjoyment. And if you don't get enough of that then you might get depressed which might lead to something worse than the thing you were trying to avoid.

So you really have to consider what's right for you. I can go without drinking. And I mostly drink water and smoothies. I wish I had less of a stomach but at 40 yrs old I have to be realistic. A six pack my not be in my future unless it says "red stripe" on it.

Lol i remember in a scene in episode 2 obi wan mind tricked a guy into not selling him deathsticks & going and rethinking his life. I imagine this is a reference to cigarettes or drugs in our society in general it was a pretty funny scene

RaisedFromWolves wrote: Lol i remember in a scene in episode 2 obi wan mind tricked a guy into not selling him deathsticks & going and rethinking his life. I imagine this is a reference to cigarettes or drugs in our society in general it was a pretty funny scene

That brings up a good point, I think.

I think moderation applies to things that you can consume in moderation without doing serious damage to your body. Drinking in excess can do real damage and mess up your liver and I think kidneys. Of course in the short term you could affect your muscle coordination. If you can drink 2-3 drinks and still drive that one thing. But if some drug has the same effect by barely looking in its direction then you should probably just avoid whatever that is entirely. That's kind of how I feel about marijuana vs almost everything else. Marijuana is very good for meditation which is why Rastafarians consider it a sacrament. Other cultures may use ayahuasca which may almost certainly trigger a vision. I definitely think there is a place for both those things but there should be some utility or added benefit like this if it's going to physically impair you. And you can't really do cocaine in moderation... crack in moderation... Although I wouldn't make any hard rules against it, I would question someone's judgment if they were like "hey, I'm gonna snort cocaine in moderation!"

Like Tellahane said, the lethality is in the dose. And alcohol (even outside of acute toxicity) is definitely poisonous.

This applies to other drugs too. I can safely assume none of us are authentic Quechua shamans, so let's be honest with ourselves and agree that we do drugs because we enjoy it (not for some deeper meaning). With that out of the way, is the enjoyability of a drug worth the costs? Smoking just about anything has chronic (pun intended) health effects beyond those of the drug itself.

I'm an alcoholic who is seven years sober (actually my sobriety date is tomorrow).
Should Jedi drink alcohol? I see no reason why not. The caveat of course would be to do so in moderation and responsibly. Being Jedi in my view is a verb so getting drunk and being irresponsible or drinking to unsafe levels seems incongruous to how I would imagine a Jedi.
Can I drink? No I can't. I lost that privilege seven years ago.
I hope you can make some judgement based on the responses above on how to approach alcohol.
The best thing about going sober is it introduced me to Jedi Philosophy in a practical and meaningful way. My blog is sort of a journal to that.
Best

Ps. Here is what Wookeipiedia says about booze:
https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Alcohol/Legends

I remember the episode in Clone Wars when Hondo Ohnaka spikes Anakin's and Kenobi's alcoholic drinks and then tries to ransom them off with Dooku. Have to give it to him, he had some nerve!

Rex wrote: ...alcohol (even outside of acute toxicity) is definitely poisonous.

Hormesis, anyone?

Frequent consumption in small doses might actually be cardio-protective, the same way exercise triggers more oxidative stress (i.e. aging and inflammation), but ultimately leads to better long term health than no exercise.

I would say the drug-of-choice itself is not the problem. The problem lies in how we misuse things (drugs and not-drugs alike) to soothe a psychological and/or physiological pain that is not actually addressed or resolved by the thing, and is thus destructive.

For me, I was lucky to not be exposed to alcohol until very late in college, so I never made the connection between alcohol and coping mechanism, and thus I am less likely to use it as a tool of addiction.

Junk food... that's another matter. Since I can remember, family reunions (where happiness and fun abounds, at least when you have a huge latino family with a hundred cousins) where centered around big heavy meals, life-events were celebrated with french fries, pizza, burgers and donuts, and sad moments were dealt with by downing entire boxes of oreos with milk.

So, I struggle with that stuff all the time, and will probably continue to experience its pull for the rest of my life.

Very good point. I'm not sure what the dosing is for alcohol's hormetic effect(s), but I would assume it's under the liver's metabolic rate for ethanol (~10mL/hr I think) which is less than what most people drink in a session

Most other drugs don't really hit a stimulus point that's beneficial in any way (other than like strychnine which I doubt anyone uses)

The psychological effects are also a very significant part of the problem for sure.

I like Key-lime pie. The store has whole pies for $6, or 2 slices for $4. Common sense and thrift say buy the whole pie, but I know myself. If it's there I'll keep picking at it until I've eaten the whole thing, so I by the 2 slices and avoid temptation until my next shopping run. I'm the same way with alcohol. If it's in the house I'm having a drink. I control it to the degree that I only drink after I'm home from work, and on my days off, but once I start I don't stop till it's time to sleep. My last physical showed elevated Liver enzymes and a ultrasound showed a fatty liver, so I've stopped drinking alcohol completely. My point is that it is a personal matter that each of us has to determine for ourselves. Know yourself and how it effects you, then decide what works for you and do it.

I recently became a certified sommelier (wine/spirits expert). Prior to this, I drank maybe one ot two servings of alcohol every few months. Since completing my program, and starting work at a vineyard, I now drink an average of several servings per day, on most days.

I know that alcoholism is addictive and terribly destructive. I keep on top of it by frequently asking myself: "Is this indulgence or compulsion?"

I believe that responsible indulgence is healthy, but as soon as it turns to compulsion you have a problem. Its similar to the Buddhist concept of loving kindness vs attachment.

What is the Jedi way when it comes to alcohol? If I were to make a call based on the Jedi Path I've been walking, it's that alcohol itself is not inherently bad. It's our behaviour toward it that makes it healthy or destructive. As long as your consumption is in balance with your life and health, then cheers my friend! I'll drink to you and your Path!

At one point, I had a list of every topic where we discussed Jedi attitudes on drugs of every kind, cloaks, robes, and lightsabers. Maybe I should dig that back up.

We just need a superthread/sticky for these oh-so-common topics (including "physical temple?")

In the UK we have a massive drinking culture, its how we bond with others, its how we relax, its how we let loose, its often how we self-medicate (bad idea).

I've heard people talk about how much Brits drink in compared to the rest of the world, but never really realise the difference until I'm in another country. I've just come back from a week in Italy and had expected to have a lot to wine whilst I was out there. I think I had 2 glasses with 2 meals the whole week, is stark contrast to what I'm used to haha!

In terms of Jediism, I see no issue with drinking alcohol. I think that's a matter for the individual in question. However, I would say that (like everything) it should be done in moderation, and people should know their limits.

As a side note, I do Sober for October every year and I think that does a good job of reminding me that I don't actually need a drink to have a good time. It also saves me a lot of money haha!

When I drink I need at least 5 beers or shots to feel anything at all from them. If I want to get tipsy, make it 10. If I want to get drunk, somewhere around 15. Consequently it’s an expensive habit, and when I drink around people from other parts of the country they think I’ve had too much before I feel anything at all, so many of them end up thinking I’m an alcoholic. It’s not like I’m overweight or anything, that’s just how alcohol effects me. If my tolerance were any higher I’d have to drink half a bottle of whiskey to even get a buzz. I usually don’t waste my money on drinks because they do so little to me. Especially when I go to a concert or something, it’s $11 for a beer. I make $11/hour, but some of that doesn’t come to me, so I’d have to work multiple hours to afford one beer at a concert and I’d need to spend close to $60 to feel anything, closer to $40 in most bars. It’s not worth it. I don’t even drink often, maybe once every other month, and only at home so I can afford it.

I wouldn’t say my mind is impaired until around the 10-12 servings mark, so I don’t see it as harmful to me, just a waste of cash.

TheDude wrote: When I drink I need at least 5 beers or shots to feel anything at all from them. If I want to get tipsy, make it 10. If I want to get drunk, somewhere around 15. Consequently it’s an expensive habit, and when I drink around people from other parts of the country they think I’ve had too much before I feel anything at all, so many of them end up thinking I’m an alcoholic. It’s not like I’m overweight or anything, that’s just how alcohol effects me. If my tolerance were any higher I’d have to drink half a bottle of whiskey to even get a buzz. I usually don’t waste my money on drinks because they do so little to me. Especially when I go to a concert or something, it’s $11 for a beer. I make $11/hour, but some of that doesn’t come to me, so I’d have to work multiple hours to afford one beer at a concert and I’d need to spend close to $60 to feel anything, closer to $40 in most bars. It’s not worth it. I don’t even drink often, maybe once every other month, and only at home so I can afford it.

I wouldn’t say my mind is impaired until around the 10-12 servings mark, so I don’t see it as harmful to me, just a waste of cash.

You are cordially invited to Ecuador. I will get you drunk for less than $20. :laugh: