Mission and Objectives of the Clergy

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01 May 2017 21:28 - 01 May 2017 21:31 #282710 by Aqua

tzb wrote:
No idea what this means, but I will say the Clergy of the last few years has had a huge number of leaders and pretty much no active members outside of that to lead. I would absolutely support a rolling back of the infrastructure which seems built to support far more active Clergy than we have.


I am sorry to say this but.. :( Why do we have 6 and maybe soon 7 bishops and just 3 priests. Just hypothetically.. what would happen if we would have less bishops compared to priests? What would change? And how would this change hypothetically affect the Clergy in doing her duties?

~

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Last edit: 01 May 2017 21:31 by Aqua.

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01 May 2017 21:31 #282711 by user15542
Someone explain to me what the hell a "Jedi Bishop" even means, please.

There are several. Some are involved in Clerical affairs. Others aren't even active at the Temple.

It's an honorific, which, given we're supposed to be a Jedi organisation, is laughable. How about we put down the self-aggrandising baubles and get on with being Jedi?
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01 May 2017 21:35 - 01 May 2017 21:37 #282712 by Aqua

tzb wrote: Someone explain to me what the hell a "Jedi Bishop" even means, please.

There are several. Some are involved in Clerical affairs. Others aren't even active at the Temple.

It's an honorific, which, given we're supposed to be a Jedi organisation, is laughable. How about we put down the self-aggrandising baubles and get on with being Jedi?


The Clergy FAQ Page does not give a description of the Bishop, or what it does. Only a global description of its duties and powers.

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Last edit: 01 May 2017 21:37 by Aqua.

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01 May 2017 21:37 #282713 by user15542
Even if it did, given what our Bishops actually variously do and don't do, it would be meaningless. It is literally a pointless rank. And even in this thread, we're hearing the next Pastor will need to be one before they can become Pastor, meaning an ad-hoc promotion - as per the last two Pastors.

So it's not even that "only Bishops can be considered for Pastor" - we literally just give it to new Pastors, like a free boat.

Madness.
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01 May 2017 21:47 - 01 May 2017 21:54 #282715 by Aqua
I feel confused about this.. I like what you say tzb but simultaneously I wonder were it is written that a Pastor must be a Bishop. :blink: I think that rank could have benefits if it would be not given as easily, if it would hold more duties to be met. The thing is.. what would set a bishop 'aside' from a priest? What makes a bishop 'valuable' or what should make it 'valuable'? Modern day Bishops are responsible for a large piece of land, obviously this is not possible, or I maybe better said, totally not useful in a digital Temple? So what makes a Bishop a Bishop? :ohmy: I am totally unfamiliar with religious ranks, besides my basic know how, have to mention that.. :blush:

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Last edit: 01 May 2017 21:54 by Aqua.

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01 May 2017 21:53 #282717 by user15542

Codex wrote: I wonder where it is written that a Pastor must be a Bishop. :blink:


I can only imagine that is the case, but that is literally rank for rank's sake... as I say, madness. What the hell is the point?
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01 May 2017 22:17 #282718 by steamboat28
Traditionally (outside of Jediism), Bishops:
  • consecrate priests
  • oversee large areas of ministry (cities, jurisdictions, etc.)
  • serve as ministers to ministers

It isn't a useless rank. It's simply one you may not see the usefulness of.
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01 May 2017 22:21 #282719 by Rosalyn J
It could certainly do with being more useful. I'd be delighted to work as deacon and work my way up still (if I were to be given the Pastorship). Pastor is an administrative role and I dont need to be a Bishop to do my job. I would ordain as a function of my office.

I'd like to suggest a proposal to this effect be submitted to council.

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01 May 2017 22:30 - 01 May 2017 22:36 #282720 by Aqua
[removed by me]

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Last edit: 01 May 2017 22:36 by Aqua.

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01 May 2017 22:36 - 01 May 2017 22:39 #282721 by Leah Starspectre
NB: These answers are are coming straight and unfiltered from my mind, and may not be very well thought-out, ha ha!


What is the role of clergy in ToTJO?
I think this needs to be defined first and foremost. I see the clergy as being responsible for the spiritual/mystical side of Jediism (as opposed to knights, who deal with the more practical aspects). Examples: the nature of the Force, how it works in our lives, how we can better connect with the Force, etc.

Should we serve people?
Obviously, but with the focus on spiritual/emotional well-being. I would include marriage/birth/funerary rituals, and non-professional counselling in this sphere.

Is our role really supportive?
Currently, no. But I think it should be. We need a bigger presence in the Temple. More clarity about what it is we do and how we do it. This should be easily accessible to all Temple members.

Is there a difference between being a knight and being a cleric?
As I said above, a knight deal with the practical aspects of Jediism: education, community service, self-improvement. Clerics should handle the spiritual/mystical/emotional side: exploring the nature of the Force, tending to the emotional/spiritual health of the members, etc. I would even say that they represent the masculine and feminine aspects of Jediism. Knights serve and Clergy nurtures. Knights are our outward manifestation, clerics are our introspection. Members can choose to walk one or the other path, or both.

How can we support people?
By offering chat/PM support to those in distress (or recognizing and approaching people who may be in distress based on forum posts), by offering insight when questions about spirituality arise, by regularly writing sermons and/or treatises about Jediism and the Force.

What kind of support should we give?
See above

How can we work directly and indirectly for ToTJO's spiritual health?
See above. Also, as a group, we should discuss and clarify our position on Jediism and the Force, and create/acquire material (writing, art, videos, etc) based on this, both for the benefit of the clergy and the Temple at large.

How do we understand our order? Priests? Bishops? Monks? Shamans?
I think this depends on how we want to be seen by the community. The structure needs to be clarified and organized, that's for sure. Roles out to be defined not just by level of education in Jediism, but it needs to be clear what their roles are. I also wouldn't mind finding a different set of names that doesn't borrow the Christian ones so much. Some like priest/priestess are pretty universal, but others like minister/bishop/pastor are pretty Christian-centric. I'd also like to see more clear demarcations between roles and titles.

What is our leadership profile?
It should be more comprehensive than it is now. I suggest a line of succession of some kind (for some positions anyhow), or a tiered organizational structure. If someone knows that their current role is preparing them for the next one, it would encourage them not only to keep learning/serving in their position, but ready them for the next, should the need arise. Leaders can be in charge of particular roles/projects within the clergy
Last edit: 01 May 2017 22:39 by Leah Starspectre.
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