Taking Part in the Process...As an experienced Jedi

Our definition of Jedi here doesn't include opportunities for learning being a "waste of time".

Streen - I for one would love to read and learn from what you would write in your IP and Apprenticeship journals I don't know what your time constraints are like but I can't imagine the IP would take you that long . . . and I'm sure you'd have a lot of flexibility in an Apprenticeship to pursue studies that would be entirely consistent with where you are at now. I apologise for my short-sightedness but I can't see what you'd have to lose!

Khaos wrote:
I have no interest in what someone once did.

Except for all the historical, philisophical, religious, and educated leaders of our past as far back as back can go for some that we study not only in the Jedi practices but in every day life and regular schooling practices. History, is part of the human culture.

I see alot of bias in this statment (not just you Khaos but in general) So many here at TOTJO saying "We don't care about what happened" and yet most of the IP is made up of old people from what "Once Was." And most of the Doctrines comes from "The Old Guard" days with very little revision or updating to apparent "Present Changes"

If all we cared about was what we did right now....we would have no hero's and guidelines to follow.

I believe it is important and respectful to honor those that have spent time, years, dedication and effort to the path. People like Streen have indeed earned at least that.

Does that mean he or even I get a free pass? No. Nor would I expect it.

But there IS something to be said about the past as there is about the future and especially the present.

One more thing. In my eexperience of being a former master here then leaving for a long time and coming back. I did not get to just pick up were i left off. I asked for a rank demotion and had to prove myself again by taking on responsibility , catching up and really getting to know people.

So perhaps you could do the same

Kitsu Tails wrote:

Khaos wrote:
I have no interest in what someone once did.

Except for all the historical, philisophical, religious, and educated leaders of our past as far back as back can go for some that we study not only in the Jedi practices but in every day life and regular schooling practices. History, is part of the human culture.

I see alot of bias in this statment (not just you Khaos but in general) So many here at TOTJO saying "We don't care about what happened" and yet most of the IP is made up of old people from what "Once Was." And most of the Doctrines comes from "The Old Guard" days with very little revision or updating to apparent "Present Changes"

If all we cared about was what we did right now....we would have no hero's and guidelines to follow.

I believe it is important and respectful to honor those that have spent time, years, dedication and effort to the path. People like Streen have indeed earned at least that.

Does that mean he or even I get a free pass? No. Nor would I expect it.

But there IS something to be said about the past as there is about the future and especially the present.

im kind of a jerk and even when i choose to belive in the most benevolent interpretation of an event that i can concieve, that doesnt stop my mind from calculating the less pleasant potentials

what the cynical and judgemental part of my mind interprets from this OP is "i want to be called master and i want to take apprentices"

but last month it was "totjo is going to go the way of pedophilia" under the guise of "im just the messenger"

how much time does ittake for someone to learn tact?
lol i suppose i will let you know as soon as i learn some!

i agree with Khaos's point about judging based on the NOW - our past is worth only so much as the lessons we learned from it

OB1Shinobi wrote: i agree with Khaos's point about judging based on the NOW - our past is worth only so much as the lessons we learned from it

Most certianly. Our history and past is no excuse to behave poorly in the present. In fact, it is even more reason/responsibility to behave according to our beliefs and teachings. It's a heavier weight to bare....but not one that should be discarded or un-cared for.

I am certainly not saying the past is reason for free passes. I am simply saying we shouldn't carelessly say it dosn't matter. Because it does. It's apart of our very structure.

Kitsu Tails wrote:

Khaos wrote:
I have no interest in what someone once did.

Except for all the historical, philisophical, religious, and educated leaders of our past as far back as back can go for some that we study not only in the Jedi practices but in every day life and regular schooling practices. History, is part of the human culture.

I see alot of bias in this statment (not just you Khaos but in general) So many here at TOTJO saying "We don't care about what happened" and yet most of the IP is made up of old people from what "Once Was." And most of the Doctrines comes from "The Old Guard" days with very little revision or updating to apparent "Present Changes"

If all we cared about was what we did right now....we would have no hero's and guidelines to follow.

I believe it is important and respectful to honor those that have spent time, years, dedication and effort to the path. People like Streen have indeed earned at least that.

Does that mean he or even I get a free pass? No. Nor would I expect it.

But there IS something to be said about the past as there is about the future and especially the present.

If Eckhart Tolle were to come to this temple and ask to be a Knight right away, even he would be asked to start from the beginning, if it were up to me. This does not mean that his past reputation is useless and irrelevant. We all have value in learning about our own past, and learning from what other have said and done in their past too, as it does have value, however that value does not take priority over the value of what they say and do in the present, as that is the point in time we interact in.

The only thing that matters is now. But, everything in the past certainly helps add up to now. I agree with Pro. I would actually love to watch Tolle go through the IP. haha. Would be amazing!

I view it not like a test, but an opportunity to reveal something about yourself to others (and yourself) by reflecting on particular topics. We have Knights sometimes choose re-do the IP for fun/curiosity to see how their perspectives on the material has changed. The process of using the same material just gives us each an opportunity to have a shared experience. I learn new things every day so how I perceive things is always changing. As such I tend to view the things like ranks as administrative titles (for functional reasons to denote duty or progress through particular programs etc), not awards of accomplishment or some measure of 'Jedi-ness'.

Text environment, lol..

It sucks!

Yes, I don't mean to totally discount the past either, but, sometimes it appears to be waved like a flag... lol..

About as much as it gets discounted... :lol:

It only becomes an issue in posts like these... lol... (anytime the "been here since" gets launched, lol)

We don't walk up to people in our physical world, like "hey, I'm new to this clown school, but, I've got X years in it..."

We walk up, say hi, and be ourselves... lol...