Multiverse?

This is a shout conversation...Start at the bottom, and work your way up...

Jestor : Ok, Maynoth... It seems this got off topic from where I left... Even if there are multiple universes, multiple versions of me, they are not me, they are them... Because they have lived a life of at least one different choice, therefore, it is not me... x

(Large chunk removed as it has no bearing on what I want to talk about...)

lane : ill save them for you jestor x
Jestor : see, now I have to leave, so I will prolly miss most of the further comments... oh well... x
maynoth : there are no seperate realities x
maynoth : right now each moment you are alive you navigate via your thoughts and choices x
lane : well its sort of like that futurama episode where the proffessor makes that box. x
maynoth : or rather you can x
maynoth : yes. x
Jestor : That sorta sounds counter to your stanc on 'proof'... Cna you prove this to me? x
lane : in this one plain or in other plains of reality? x
maynoth : there an infinite number of beings who are identical to you, and believe themselves to be you x
maynoth : Also there isn't just one you x
lane : well.. to answer the question of what are we we are mortal beings who are living on this earth searching for their purpose. x
maynoth : sure they do x
Jestor : I'll give you past has occured... But all possible futures have potential to exist, but do not yet... x
lane : wow.. thats deep maynoth.. it makes me think.. x
maynoth : For instance both past and future have already occured, and not just one past or future, all possible pasts and all possible futures for all possible observers x
maynoth : time and space, and we do not exist like we think they do x
maynoth : You'd be surprised x
Jestor : I am 'Here", the time is "Now", Iam 'Me"... x
maynoth : And where we are right now x
maynoth : To answer your question you need to first answer what we are. x
Jestor : kinda deep for the shout, lol... That could be why no one has really answered... x
Wescli Warde : What do you believe? x
lane : hey i have a question it may be stupid but its a valid question i have.. where do we go after death? x

a quick snippet from dr. stephen hawking , arguably the smartest man on earth, with a link to his book , 'the grand design'.

tl,dr- he is doubtful.

Well, have my doubts too...

But, what they hey, it is mental exercise, and possible, maynoth may convince me Im wrong...

But, It wont be an easy discussion... lol...

you may notice i have refrained from actually stating my opinion on the topic, altho i have one. that is entirely on purpose.

this kind of thing is so far above my paygrade, i may as well be conversing about grammatical structure in the original tao te ching. and im not entirely sure even what language that was first written in.

best left to the experts, here.

ninja edit: tho i do enjoy listening to and reading drs hawking and n.d. tyson.

Desolous wrote: a quick snippet from dr. stephen hawking , arguably the smartest man on earth, with a link to his book , 'the grand design'.

tl,dr- he is doubtful.

Hawking: I regard [the many worlds interpretation] as self-evidently correct.

Ferris: Yet some don't find it evident to themselves.

Hawking: Yeah, well, there are some people who spend an awful lot of time talking about the interpretation of quantum mechanics.

The Whole Shebang: A State of the Universe Report
By Timothy Ferris page 345

Craig Callendar, a philosophy professor at the University of California, San Diego:

'According to Hawking, enough is known about M-theory to see that God is not needed to answer these questions. Instead, string theory points to the existence of a multiverse, and this multiverse coupled with anthropic reasoning will suffice. Personally, I am doubtful.'

misattributed the quote, thanks for catching that.

So drawing from your Shout post, you are saying "in order to take me to the heights, to show me the world is not flat"

I have to deeply meditate on this...

Right?

But, I have...

Even in deep meditation, you are not providing proof...

To go that route, I have yet to move beyond the thought I exist...

For, once I try to move beyond that thought, I find I begin to doubt my senses, so even reality isn't real...

All those other multiverses are nothing but highly detailed dreams...

http://www.physics.wustl.edu/~alford/many_worlds_FAQ.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Many-worlds_interpretation

About 60% of the leading cosmologists and physicists subscribe to the many worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics.

Stephen Hawking, and David Deutsch are two of the most prominent subscribers to it.

Highly detailed dreams you say? Do you have proof your experience of this moment right now isn't itself a highly detailed dream?


If you can't trust what you yourself see and experience first hand, what exactly CAN you trust?

Jestor wrote: So drawing from your Shout post, you are saying "in order to take me to the heights, to show me the world is not flat"

I have to deeply meditate on this...

Right?

But, I have...

Even in deep meditation, you are not providing proof...

To go that route, I have yet to move beyond the thought I exist...

For, once I try to move beyond that thought, I find I begin to doubt my senses, so even reality isn't real...

All those other multiverses are nothing but highly detailed dreams...

The Many Worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics has been around since 1954 or so and many physicists hold to it as the best interpretation - even some who wish it was not. I recently read an article where they believe there might be a way to test the theory. I'll find it and post.

Br. John wrote: The Many Worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics has been around since 1954 or so and many physicists hold to it as the best interpretation - even some who wish it was not. I recently read an article where they believe there might be a way to test the theory. I'll find it and post.

http://www.nature.com/news/quantum-theorem-shakes-foundations-1.9392



November 17 2011

Quantum theorem shakes foundations

The wavefunction is a real physical object after all, say researchers.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg19526223.700-parallel-universes-make-quantum-sense.html


September 21 2007

David Deutsch at the University of Oxford and colleagues have shown that key equations of quantum mechanics arise from the mathematics of parallel universes. "This work will go down as one of the most important developments in the history of science," says Andy Albrecht, a physicist at the University of California at Davis.

.............

"We've cleared up the obscurities and come up with a pretty clear verdict that Everett works," says Saunders, who is presenting the work with Wallace at the Many Worlds at 50 conference at the Perimeter Institute for Theoretical Physics in Waterloo, Canada, this week. "It's a dramatic turnaround and it means that people now have to discuss Everett seriously."

Albrecht agrees that the work will shake up physicists' worlds. "Many
people are uncomfortable about the probabilities at the heart of quantum mechanics and attempt to get rid of quantum mechanics because of it,"

This is all well and good, but I am personally not very interested in theory for theory's sake. What are the practical applications of these discoveries? Are we talking visiting differentrealities, perhaps even merging them? What are future implications?

Desolous wrote: This is all well and good, but I am personally not very interested in theory for theory's sake. What are the practical applications of these discoveries? Are we talking visiting differentrealities, perhaps even merging them? What are future implications?

You assume that these realities are disconnected, when you make a choice you are navigating them.

Imagine all the possible breakfasts you could potentially have tomorrow morning, there is a reality just as real as this moment now to account for each and every one of them.

All occupied by minds just as real as you believe yourself to be, all sharing your name and SSN and life history up to that point.

As your mind moves through what you perceive as time you are presented with choices and you navigate them in this manner.

All possible outcomes to all events have already occurred, you are just choosing which one you want to view.

Sort of like a choose your own adventure story book, but instead of limited choices you have unlimited choices.

The future implications are that we discover a way to communicate between realities, so that all possible solutions to a problem can be tested, and the best solution to the problem selected.

Imagine having an astronomical number of realities all working on different solutions to the same problem and the one that has the best solution going BINGO! and sharing the answer with the rest.

That's the promise of quantum computing, lockhead martin has been validating a 512 qubit quantum computer by d-wave systems and it's performance will continue to increase exponentially as higher qubit versions are released.

maynoth wrote: Highly detailed dreams you say? Do you have proof your experience of this moment right now isn't itself a highly detailed dream?


If you can't trust what you yourself see and experience first hand, what exactly CAN you trust?

Still searching for that answer...

As far as I know, this moment is a dream..

And when i die, I will "wake up" in my real world...

But, to function in this state in which I currently exist, to move, operate, interact, in this "Now", I must gloss over the doubt, and interact...

Interesting, so you have experienced these other verses? Just observed?

Do you, or these scientists have tangible proof?

So, to take me high in the sky to show me earths curvature can be done (I have done it), I would ask for proof that they exist...

Wait a minute... Do you have "faith" they do? Maybe just a little "belief"...

Just jackin' with you... :lol:

I do not have the time to check those links yet, hopefully tonight...

I still say the possibility exist, but I see no proof, Mr Scientific...

Perhaps I need to understand Quantum stuff?

Well I don't, so, pretend im a six year old...

(No, really, pretend im 6... I've ask around for a quatum physics for really, really dumb people, but the crayon keeps smearing...

Yeah, my phone is at least 600 qubit.

Jestor wrote: Interesting, so you have experienced these other verses?

What you experience as the ability to make decisions and choose is you navigating between multiple realities.

Let's talk about what I've experienced via pm so it doesn't get used as ammunition against me in the future

Jestor wrote: but I see no proof

J: I don't believe mountains far away exist as I can't see them with my naked eye.

M: Here is a tool a telescope look through it and tell me what you see.

J: That would take too much time and effort! I want to see proof now! Bottle up this proof and deliver it to me so that I might see it myself.

maynoth wrote:

Jestor wrote: but I see no proof

J: I don't believe mountains far away exist as I can't see them with my naked eye.

M: Here is a tool a telescope look through it and tell me what you see.

J: That would take too much time and effort! I want to see proof now! Bottle up this proof and deliver it to me so that I might see it myself.

HEY!

Im not that lazy!! I would pick up telescope... (If there was a cookie attached...)

Well, I understand your point...

They said they world was flat, some still say it...

Until the last guy who believes it dies, or is convinced, the theory is alive...

Same here...

You may be on the forfront of neigong, and this here multiverse stuff, but, until its proof, you will be the minority...

DOesnt make you wrong...

Here let me fix that post right before mine... Show you how I read it...

maynoth wrote: That's the promise of

are released.

ZZZZzzzzz.... Snort, huh? wut?...

(just teasing)

Jestor wrote: until its proof

"My whole gig is telling people to look for themselves, to simply see what’s right in front of them."
-Jed McKenna


"The most important thing is that it’s self-verifiable and completely available to reason. Anyone who wants to understand can understand. It doesn’t require interpreters or intermediaries. It’s just sitting there, right out in the open, for anyone who cares to look. No one has to rely on me or anyone else."
-Jed McKenna