Pupil referral unit

I have been meaning to discuss this but it keeps slipping out of my mind. Anyway, across the road from my house (and I mean quite literally across the road, opposite my front door, not a few minutes away) there is a Pupil Referral Unit. I'm sure you can guess what this is but if not it's pretty simple and I would imagine they have them in most countries. It's a school for kids who have been permanently excluded from mainstream education, they are not allowed into any state, secondary schools because they are so badly behaved. The reason I want to discuss this is because I am peeved by how awful they are every time I see them. They show no respect for their teachers, they swear at them, they swear at passers by, they constantly smash the fencing to their own school (in the few years it has been there the fencing has probably been repaired over 20 times, no exaggeration), they damage people's cars - in short, they are not a pleasant bunch. What annoys me is that state education in my borough is atrocious, it was quite recently considered to be the worst in the UK. This school, however, is absolutely superb in terms of facilities. I have looked around it and it has a music room, an excellent dining room, top class science labs and numerous other things that the average secondary school simply wouldn't have. My question is, why is this fair? Why are the kids who have done the absolute worst getting the absolute best, whilst the kids who do want to learn are getting the absolute worst? However, my dilemna is that the majority of the kids at this school have pretty terrible home lives. But does that excuse their atrocious behavior? I can understand if you cannot at all help being a certain way, if you are gay you didn't choose to be gay, if you are black you didn't choose to be black. These kids, however, seem to me as though they can help behaving the way they do, because they choose to do it... anyway I'm ranting, it would be great to hear everyone's thoughts!

I completely understand your frustration, Mace, and I personally would also feel angry and frustrated with those troubled kids who really don't seem to deserve that fine educational facility.

I mean no offense to all of my peers in the UK for what I'm about to say, and I apologize in advance if what I say is offensive. However, I merely intend to criticize the social and government norms, and not necessarily any individual who may read this. Here goes...


I watch a lot of Fox News, and I constantly hear American reporters there constantly criticizing European countries for being too socialist, in a sense that there are too many free-bies that the government provides and the people expect. Because the government is so generous and large in Europe, a lot of the financial aid, that the government constantly provides, is often used improperly/wasted. So, relating to Mace's situation, I feel that the reason why those troubled children get such great facilities (and other, more well behaved children do not) is because of the European government's and society's overly generous (and truthfully wasteful) government spending: believing that how you solve all problems in society is to "throw lots of money at it".


Yes, I consider myself an American conservative, so I do have a certain perspective that possibly has many blind spots. However, I bring up my views, addressing Mace's situation, because I fear that the United States is also heading towards a socialist government and society - similar to Europe's ideals that allow these types of wasteful spending and funding to occur.


Feel free to refute/discuss with me. I never get mad during debates

I won't start on how wastefull america is when it comes to resources...

And on the subject.
Did you try investigating if there was a private investor involved in the facility? I'm not from UK but that seems odd.

And no, I think they shouldn't be given such facility.
I've had my share of first hand expirience with this grade of kids during my participation in scouts camps.
What they need is military-like treatment. High discipline and responicibility for their actions, and modest accomodation.

If they behave like that, and you throw expensive stuff at their faces they are going to behave even worse, because they can. They need to be given little, so that they respect what they have and have to learn that their behaviour is strictly parraler to what they get.

The problem is that misbehaved kids are rewarded and behaved ones are not. what is bad should hurt and what is good should feel good... this is education at its most basic level.

Does anyone remember who the cool kids were at school? Those who finished their science project in time or those who'd sneak out and smoke? (Incidentally I'd bring booze and weed to high school, drive stolen car way under age but did OK in school, though that's besides the point)(I must say however I never disrespected people --except the cops though no-one likes them-- the way kids do nowadays. It seems they just like to take the piss, exert power over us.

When it comes to socialism however, I think you'll find that the least religious and most socialist countries in europe also enjoy the best lifestyle, lowest crime rates and highest life expectancy. As in all things governement, the real problem are the politics... To be specific, the real issue is populism... whoever drops the taxes and gets the country indebted instead becomes the leader (That's how greece ended up where it is now)

Yeah, that's the downside of democracy... what majority demands is not always what it needs.
But still, I'd rather see a government spend money on kids that don't diserve it, rather then, say, 80% of worlds military expenses...

Edit: I just realised I probably made the most idiotic statement of century. Kids don't diserve education? Well that's hell of a way of thinking...

I remember when I was a kid, my parents would threaten me by saying they would send me to a military school. In those days that was a threat you did not want to come true.

It seems to me we need more people to be held accountable for their actions. Most of all the parents of these children.

If the government is to take responsibility, these misfits should be detained like the criminal element they are and housed in barracks and treated to some first class military discipline. Not the new military, but the military of the past where physical and psychological abuse where the norm. If these children do not want to fit into our social order, then train them to fight on the front lines...AND LEAVE THEM THERE!

Mace,
That is an excellent "rant".
There seems to be an attitude of entitlement amounst young people that they feel they can damage their own belongings and those that belong to others with no repercusions. Now thst is not all young people but many, and crosses from rich kids from "good" families, and poor kids from "broken" homes you know the retoric.... Of course they are choosing to behave as they are, it is to their benefit, no one expects anything from them, and they give it in abundance.

There is a military academy such as the one Pakislav mentions one town over from where I live. They start with the basics and earn their right to luxuries(such as they are). It apparently has a 100% success rate with 100% of its studens being accepted to the college or university they apply to. It tesaches the other three Rs- respct, responsibility,reliablity. If taught by parents when they are younglings this type of school is not really necissary.

If money is to be spent on the little savages it should be to tame them, not feed their entitlement issues,and to turn them into good citizens. Education dollars are not spent wisely. It is a political trick, to tell the people you are going to take care of the disadvantaged, and trot out the beautiful school with all of the bells and whistles..the soft minded public eat up that crap.

My parents were threatening to send me to the "DDASS" (where children get abandoned in my country, the national orphanage of sorts), or worse, to boarding school. Though this only worked on me as a small child. Oh and there also was the naked butt spanking in front of everyone thing. Now that was the most terrifying of all.

Both of these are bad things Ren.

Punishment is NOT the right way to TEACH anyone anything.
FEAR is not the right way to teach anyone. Fear only leads to anger, not to wisdom.

The right thing to do, is not to take something away if someone does wrong, but to only give if someone does good.
Todays society is spoiled beyond measure and it does not do a favor to anyone.


Come to think of it, taking inspiration from the fictional young age of Jedi from which they must be trained, maybe we could start a Parenting Advice topic/board somewhere here on the forum? Not necceserly Jedi oriented, but in general.

was reading Phortis's/Kilma's comments and had to chime in here...

I actually did go to a military academy at the ago of 14... class of 99 (by choice, was one of 5% of that cadet corp that was their by choice)

they are not a place that you should expect a child to get better at... the only people who can correct problems are the parents themselves...these schools are a place of limited control. 80 students of a troubled age all in the same barracks, with limited supervision and usually cadet led corp of cadets... you may as well let your kids run free on the streets of a huge city...

the idea of the threat about being sent to one may serve its purpose,least your parents where trying to correct problems...

but in reality, your parents wouldn't be doing you any favors or correcting any attitude/social problems.. Only removing you from real life and taking away natural progression of growing up. And those stats about 100% acceptance in a college, I don't buy for a second...you should ask yourself, where did u get those stats, what college...does the state fund the university?, so the military academy can push then in... there a many ways to make stats look good...

when I joined my school as a freshman, they made it look and sound good, and promising...but things are not always what they seem with a place so independetly run

these are kids and its up to the parents to correct the shortcomings, that is the major failure of modern era..not the kids...the parents