What makes a man

Ok the other day my wife and I went out to dinner, there she told me of a talk she had with her girl friends. This hit me as odd what she was about to say next. She says to me her friend thinks I m gay and I m not a real man like hers. Back stoy time my wife's friend will will call her Tess and her boyfriend and one of my friends we will call him bill, have been going out for little over a yr now they meet when bill was still with his wife at the time but left her to be with Tess , I won't get into it on her but bill left for things that should not have been. Now Tess thinks he should not talk or have anything to do with his ex wife but one thing with that is they have a kid so I told her she has to get over it and she don't like me much for that, but she also don't like the fact my wife and her other friends pick on Tess for me and bill are good friends we do a lot and spend a lot of time hanging out so they call it a bromance and Tess gets mad and me and bill play it up when he is around. this bugs me that she would call me gay or say that I m not a real man and say it to my wife, what is she baseing this on I was told a real man stays with his family no matter what, and will do any thing he can for his family and I was like a dad to bill I taught him how to box, toss a football and other things, so help do I talk to bill about or let it go

well...its your heart that determines what sort of person you are. there are no such thing as real men or women. we are all different. and there is nothing wrong with being gay.

Well...for starters, they need to wake up and see that being gay doesn't make someone not a real man. Not that that's the issue, as you aren't gay...but I don't think that people should throw around those sorts of comments.

Anyway...so what makes a real man? I think there was a thread about this before, a while ago. I remember writing that there's no difference between what makes a man and what makes a woman...there's no 'criteria' as such, there's just being the best person that you can be.

For instance, you are a father. And you have described how you try to be a good one. So already, that is an essential part of what makes you a man.

It hurts when people make comments that belittle us, or attempt to lessen our worth. Particularly if they are making those comments to someone close to us (i.e. your wife). But you just have to trust that those who are your friends will take no notice and will see through what they are saying, and as for those who are saying these things...well do you really want to give of your time and energy to worrying about them?

In answer to the question. Only my humble belife ofcourse: Eru, The One who in arda called illuatar makes a man. He also makes beasts aswell... also foxes... and a few others

I would worry less about their vanity and more about being the best person you can be

If as long you can say to yourself "I've done well by myself" then you have nothing to worry about and even less to worry about what someone else thinks of your actions

Be the best person you can be, don't worry about what other people say a 'real man' is. Whatever that term even means...

Jackofalltrades wrote: In answer to the question. Only my humble belife ofcourse: Eru, The One who in arda called illuatar makes a man. He also makes beasts aswell... also foxes... and a few others

Et Earello Endorenna utulien. Sinome maruvan ar Hildynyar tenn Ambar-metta

You are all right and I know this V I think I like your post the best. I know I'm not gay and there is nothing wrong with it if I was but your right in saying it hurts when some one try to belittle you and I think that is what was bugging me the most about it. I work hard to give my family the best I can at all cost, and I would give my life to the ppl I call friends and family so that's what hurt. I knew if I put it up on here I would be able to see things in a better light and be able to clear my mind of things that made me question who and what I was. And you are all right as long as you live a long full life and let the force be your guide you can do no wrong. Thank you all for your insight MTFBWY.

"Would he walk on the water?/ Would he run through fire?/ Would stand before you/ When it's down to the wire?/ Would he give his life up/ To be all he can?/ Is that/ Is that/ Is that/ How you measure a man?" - "Measure of a Man", Clay Aiken.

'Oh!' Kakeru quickly printed off a few pages, then rushed over and grabbed three of his coworkers, 'Lock!' James was too surprised to react as Kakeru hauled him off the couch, 'Aki!' Akitaro, being used to Kakeru's pranks, came willingly, 'Kawaii!' Tsuneo Kawai first bristled at the blatant mispronunciation of his name, then screamed and tried to run away before Kakeru tackled him and dragged him towards the other two.

'Mendo... what's this?' James gestured to the paper Kakeru had printed.

'It's the script to a scene from Princess Princess!' Kakeru explained, bouncing with all the enthusiasm of a true otaku nerd. All three of the captives groaned, 'C'MON! You guys are the only ones who could read this! Do it! Do it, do it, do it!' They sighed, but read.

'Mikoto: Kouno, are you really willing to be fooled by all of this?' Tsuneo recited, actually capturing the purely feminine-phobia sentiment of the original character.

'Tohru: Well, you get all these rewards and you just have to dress up like a girl and smile... that's not half bad.' James muttered, also matching the personality of someone who could care less about gender roles.

'Mikoto: But, don't you have any PRIDE as a MAN?' Tsuneo's voice climbed in hysterical pitch.

'Tohru: I don't.' James paused for the comedic effect, and Tsuneo did shoot him a very pained look, as though to accuse him of treachery against the self-respecting, heteronormative male gender, 'For a student who has to tighten his belt and cannot afford to let opportunities pass, pride is nothing.'

'Mikoto: Listen -- they make you wear frilly clothes, and shave unnecessary hair, and put on make-up and girly shoes... are you really willing to go through all of that?'

'Shihoudani: It's that attitude that only makes guys want to tease you more, Mikoto.' Akitaro read, totally immersed in the role as it was pretty appropriately where he'd been based.

'What's wrong with that? I still have my pride to think about!' Tsuneo wasn't even reading from the script -- this was obviously a discussion the two had had before.

'Shihoudani: That's even more unmanly if you think about it.' Akitaro, on the other hand, kept in character very well, 'If there is a job you must do, and there is no choice but to accept the circumstances, to do your best to accomplish the task without complaining and without fight is what a real man does. Isn't that so?'

'And that's all you printed up. Mendo, what was the point of this?' James asked, throwing down his half of the script. Kakeru, eyes still bugged with fanboy stars, pouted.

'To point out that manliness isn't defined by the absence of feminine traits!' He shouted, 'I mean, we're all cross-dressers, which we do for our job, and most of us enjoy it! A lot of the other guy characters the Author's written have a lot of feminine traits to them -- like that guy from Star Wars with the three eyes... uh... whats-his-face... HE is this giant conglomeration of a Frankenstein creature, Quasimodo the hunchback, and Sylvester Stallone, and his hobbies are baking, cooking, knitting, cross-stitch, and volunteering at daycare centers!'

'I guess now would be a bad time to point out that the Author is a very radical feminist who specializes in writing Boy's Love romances...' James pointed out, 'Of course all of her male characters -- even the straight ones -- are gonna be in touch with their femmie sides.'

'Well, for the argument about homosexuality making a man less manly...' All four heads turned to see Haid, resident expert on love and sexuality, 'There is an argument that loving relationships with other men makes one MORE of a man -- granted, it's a little misogynistic, since the basis is that women cannot be men's equals, or that sharing one's love and life with one makes one weaker -- but the theory is that having another man as one's lover only proves that you are a real man, to share your life energy with another man, and it cycles back and the both of you are strengthened.'

All four characters blinked at her, especially as three of them had had at least one lover of their own sex.

'I've never heard THAT one before.' James muttered, almost in awe.

'I made it up.' Haid explained, causing everyone's expression to comedically change, '...Based on my conjectures from Aristotle and several Eastern philosophies about love. So, all things being considered, even being gay would not determine the degree of one's manhood, or, if it did, one could make the argument it would only STRENGTHEN one's manliness.'

'Guys, could you keep it down?' Bellowed Shinshi, from where he was sitting with a fanfiction incarnate of Ken and watching something on youtube, 'God, you guys are so GA- Oh my God! That griffin b!**h made FlutterShy CRY! SHE MUST PAY!' Ken shot him a glance.

'...You know that old saying about people who live in glass houses?' He asked, and when Shinshi glared, 'Just sayin'.'

'Okay, so the moral of the story is 'Screw gender roles, just be yourself'...' Tsuneo grouched, '...What does this have to do with this guy's original question?'

The other characters leaned over and looked at the screen.

'...Sometimes, people are just jerks.' Kakeru shrugged, 'I wouldn't let it bother me -- like, I don't have a wife, so maybe talk to her, assure her of your fidelity and that you love her and whatever... but letting someone's comments about being a lesser man or gay or whatever get to you just proves them... uh... I don't wanna say right but...'

'It would validate her attack.' Agreed Haid, much more eloquently, 'It would send the message 'This hurts me, so if you want to hurt me in the future, this is fair game, so it is an inherently correct argument.' Even if you don't believe that, that's what the attacking party will get out of one taking offense to an insult.'

James, meanwhile looked back up at the reply. How had it shifted from a discussion about gender roles, real manliness, and anti-feminine sentiment to just a simple 'People are just jerks' argument? Maybe it was the Author's ADD, or maybe she shouldn't have had that second martini...

To answer the question: What makes a man are the right genitals. (To avoid elaboration on the subject, because of hemaphrodites etc. etc. etc.)

And to say something about the story. It seems to me that it's a case of a common, hatefull and condenscending, b***h. Not to be judgmental, but that's the impression your story gives.

So the course of action I would advice would be to bring it up to her, preferably in front of others. She'll either behave like a real b***h or reconcile, either way problem solved.

And no, don't let such belitteling comments get to you. She's just jealus about her guys ex-wife and a jealus woman is an illogical and dangerous woman. (Same goes for a jealous guy)


And to bring everyone on a different track. What makes a 'man' is a very wrong question. There is no 'real' man. There's another perfectly valid question thought. It's "What makes a good human". And I think we should concentrate on answering that.

I think the gender roles are leftovers from a culture which had men responsible for the women's behaviour, because in those days it reflected on the man she was with. She was simply seen as an available maidan, taken wife, or a lady in her twilight years. Its bizarre to think how recent women were basically treated like property. The terms should have no meaning to actual gender anymore, but might be fairly (though dangerously!) used to represent those equivalent behaviors from history I guess.

The gender bender in this scenario could be that by calling you gay, the 'friend' is saying your behaviour is making the wife look bad to that 'friend' by reversing the roles, thus calling you gay as some sort of insult implying your effeminate! Hows that for confusing, or alternatively its just an attempt to insult you by saying you have some homosexual actions by being around your male friend so much. I'd just ignore it all, but remain cogniscant of any messages your wife is actually sending you about her feelings or thoughts.... not her 'friend', I wouldnt care in the slightest what the wife's 'friend' thinks.

Personally though, I probably would always try to avoid ever making an inference, or implying to my wife that anyone could replace her - even as a joke. Even if it was just for the reason that I wouldnt want her to start having the same thoughts about replacing me LOL, for fun or otherwise.

I don't mean to make light of your situation, and hope it works out well!!!!

This "not a real man" thing is a form of bullying. Tell her real women shut up and do as they are told, spend time in the kitchen and iron your shirts, etc... see how she feels about it. What kind of "friend" is that anyway?