Inherently Flawed..

Magus Steele wrote:

Human nature is the truth of being human.

Does it always have to be so? Can we not out grow, the "Ego"?

Indivdually, yes...

As a group, it will be tougher...

Jestor, Why so hostile? I have giving nothing, but gained a glimpse.

Hm, I could swear I used plenty of smileys...

lol, as I said, you are new...

Once you know our personalities, you will see I am never hostile, seldom serious, and almost always in a great mood, and talkative...

I am here to find out the true nature of those that consider, themselves, Jedi.
AM I a "Jedi"? In a word no, in another Yes. The Name, Jedi, is meaningless.I am of the Force. It guides me, and is with me. I understand.

Shoot, words are worthless, most times, yet this is all we have to communicate with...

Well, good luck with that you seek....

Magus Steele wrote: Br. John,

Think beyond the rules.
Not saying change any you may have.

The rules most think I meant are for the young, of mind, and spirit.
The rules of which I speak, are universal.

Hey des, Im checking out for a while on this thread, just an fyi...:lol:

Magus Steele wrote: Everything is flawed. How we overcome those flaws, or find solutions to fix those flaws, describes volumes about the nature of those who take up the challenges placed before them.

I'm sorry to be yet another person to disagree with you but nothing is INHERENTLY flawed as you so put it. I prove it.

Just go with me on this one. Lets say a monkey is not flawed in any way what so ever. We attach a simple box with a button connected to the pleasure centers of his brain.
Every time he presses the button he gets a jolt of pleasure. As time passes the monkey starts pressing that button more and more ignoring food, sex, or any other want and need he may have had. In the end the monkey just jolts him self to death because of his addiction. To save him you need only take away the box.

His addiction was a flaw that in the end killed him. How ever it was not present before he encountered the box. Would you say the monkey is flawed?

I'm sorry but I also have to refuse the idea that a new born baby(be human or other) could be flawed. :dry:

I'll tell you right now only the people of your culture feel they are inherently flawed. No other culture feels that they were inherently flawed.

Your Monkey, wasnt flawed, even in the end, it was Made to be that way.

Flaws can even be found in a Newborn. It all depends what you see as a flaw. Is the fact that it can not survive without outside help a flaw?

I wanted to add, rereading, are you reading sin, or flaw?

Alright, lets find common ground... Always best to agree on definitions to begin a discussion...

What is a 'flaw'?

The addiction killed him and you dont see that as a flaw? At this point it seems like you just want to argue.

And no that is not a flaw. This is just the way humans work.

Many would consider a sin to be a flaw but no i was talking about "inherent flaws" not flaws. That is to say that something is born flawed or created flawed. Since you replied that "everything is flawed" i could only reply that everything is also perfect.

Perfect is not the exclusion of flaws its the inclusion of everything. Thats why "The All" is perfect, because it includes everything including flaws. How ever that would mean that everything would be inherently perfect and then becomes flawed. As I illustrated in the monkey story.

"There are two ways to slide easily through life: to believe everything or to doubt everything. Both ways save us from thinking."

~Alfred Korzybski~

Do you feel truth is unattainable? or shouldnt be pursued, by these two statements?

I merely placed both statements in to demonstrate how philosophy can be a double edged sword. Pursue, discover… I just hope that I am able to recognize truth when I see it.

Human nature is the truth of being human.
Does it always have to be so?

Let me start with, what do you perceive to be human nature? Personally, I believe we “grow” all of our life. From the time we first start off in the world till we leave it… and who is to say that is the end of the adventure.

Can we not out grow, the "Ego"?

Ego can be nothing more than our own understanding of who we are. When you say, “I go to the store” you recognize yourself and can no longer detach from some sense of ego. Knowing who you are, is one of the things that makes being human so wonderful. And that is also the trick to ego. Many times, people’s egos become distorted from the truth. When you let something that is not truth dictate your reality you leave the realm of what is real… then everything else becomes distorted from that perspective.

Daniel L,
Argue? I find no need to.
I ask, or I may Provoke thought, but I wont argue.

Wescli Wardest,
Human nature to me, would be Daniel's monkey, following blindly, without growth, without thought.
The Force is infinite, humans have a unique opportunity to become as such, but the jury is still out, to weather they will continue to hit the button, or understand, that there are buttons, and doors, and windows, and much more.