Please explain the benefits of Romney's economic plan.

In europe, the arrival of universal healthcare coincides with higher life expectancy and the disappearance of diseases that once were far more terrible than any wars we've ever had. The purpose of having everyone covered is very selfish. When people aren't ill, they can't transmit their diseases to you.

I don't know much about obamacare, but it is my understanding it is far from being what it was supposed to be because congress wouldn't have it?

Forcing companies to support abortion would cause moral conflicts for those companies that do not support it

Since when do companies have morals?

'corporations are people, my friend'- mitt

Desolous wrote: 'corporations are people, my friend'- mitt

*facepalm*....:pinch:

Hello my friend Alethea...

Not attacking, clarifying...

I disagree with the policy that everyone must have coverage

While I dont agree people should be forced to do anything they dont want to... We all experience it all the time...

Such as paying taxes, wearing seat belts, requiring school for all children, mandatory physicals for kids....

Most of the time, our "big brother" has the best of intentions...

The rights of a few will get stepped on for the benefit of the many...

As ren pointed out, that it promotes overall better health... And that is the point...

Obamacare wasnt the first idea of this kind presented in the US...(said for others who might not know, not you)...

Id be willing to pay a little more in taxes as well to help myslef in this area..

I too have government healthcare through my employer... And while it covers me 100%, I pay almost $300 bucks a month for my family...

My employer pays almost $1500 for me (if I remember right), so $500 bucks sounds kinda low... I dont know...

It seems to be working in other countries... Just because we lead in some areas, doesnt mean we lead in all areas of interest... lol, look at our ecomnomy...

This could be regulated by the government as easily as was when the Army required me to pay back $2600 for a bonus

Do you think it would be easier to keep track of the deadbeats, and garnish their wages, and yet everyone else pays high costs...

Or would it be easier to keep track of who has insurance (everyone under national healthcare), and not have to worry about tracking down the deadbeats?

With the poverty level, however, we also need to work on improving the minimum wage as it concerns the raising in cost of living. In terms of hand-outs, we need to reform the welfare system to a system which promotes pursuing ways to better yourself to the point you will not need to be on welfare.

Sure we do... I agree...

And, if we decide this system Obama is purposing sucks, and it never goes through, those on welfare will continue to have free healthcare, and I will continue to pay a large chunk of my income...

And they wont...

I feel you have already excused them with this line...

If the person falls into the poverty levels, I can understand why they would not be able to pay off their debt

Im probably reading your words wrong, but on a screen, its what it looks like...

I disagree with the statement that all companies should be required to provide health insurance which allows for abortions

This is a hot topic...

So, I'll go gently...

A corporation shouldnt have an opinion on your health options... It should provide for what you, as an individual feels is the right treatment option for what is your issue...

THis sounds clinical, calling an abortion an issue... But, I am a man, and while I personally am against it, I should have no right to tell you what to do with your pregnacy... It should be your option, and I will not judge you, not think any different of you (not literally you, of a women is a better way to say what I mean...)

It also gives business more reasons to ship jobs overseas. In another country it would not be required for them to pay (if I recall correctly) $500 per employee which does not have health insurance.

They are doing it anyway...

For the worst of all reasons, personal economics... The bottom dollar for the corporation...

There are bigger holes to close than a national healthcare...

And you are so right, it boils down to education!

Our medical situation does need to improve. Obama wasn't wrong in taking a stab at it, but this wasn't the right answer. And the US doesn't have the money (honestly) to support a good system

Well, I agree this program wont be the "end all" of medical woes, and fix it all right the first time...

But, we need a base platform in place to fix...

We will never have something in place that works 100% from day one... And this is what keeps stalling this from coming to fruition...

Being on the Council here, I have learned that a half-assed law to help correct a problem is better than no law...

We can adjust a half-ass law, make changes, and roll with changing times, adapt, evolve...

If we dont start somewhere, if "we hesitate to negotiate out of fear", then, we will never better our situation, and most will continue to bemoan the status, yet offer no way to fix it for fear of being called wrong, ignorant, stupid, or (republican/democrat... lol)

Im not attacking Alethea...

Not by any means... She offered a pov, and I countered, and I have prolly not thought of all of the possibilities, who could?

But, this is going to be how we grow...

My opinion, anyway....

Wescli? Cookies?

Jestor wrote: While I dont agree people should be forced to do anything they dont want to... We all experience it all the time...

Such as paying taxes, wearing seat belts, requiring school for all children, mandatory physicals for kids....

Most of the time, our "big brother" has the best of intentions...

The rights of a few will get stepped on for the benefit of the many...

As ren pointed out, that it promotes overall better health... And that is the point...

Obamacare wasnt the first idea of this kind presented in the US...(said for others who might not know, not you)...

Id be willing to pay a little more in taxes as well to help myslef in this area..

I too have government healthcare through my employer... And while it covers me 100%, I pay almost $300 bucks a month for my family...

My employer pays almost $1500 for me (if I remember right), so $500 bucks sounds kinda low... I dont know...

Edit:

My employer pays half for my family, and I think I acutally pay 250, twice a month, now that I think a little harder on it...

Jestor wrote:

Desolous wrote: 'corporations are people, my friend'- mitt

*facepalm*....:pinch:

Hello my friend Alethea...

Not attacking, clarifying...[/color]

jestor, im confused. the corporations are people, my friend quote is a direct, video verified quote of mitt romneys. i used it in reference to ren's post above that asked since when did corporations have morals. its kind of ironic, as they dont, but actual real live people (mostly) do, hence the quote.

next, im desolous.

Who did what with a rubber chicken? And where did all the glitter go? :ohmy:

This CAN'T be good! :pinch:

hahahahahhahahahahahhaha :laugh: :silly: :woohoo:

Yea, I was more just amazed that he called a corporation a person...

Its made of people, it affects people, but it is not a person...

An entity, yes, but not a living breathing entity....

Not comparable to a person, anyway...in my opinion...

On the topic of conservative fiscal beliefs:

The idea is that if you lower taxes (not just on the rich, but on everyone), people will have more money for buying products, which will help the economy. I am not sure where I stand fiscally (although I am definitely more right leaning), this is how my parents have explained it to me. If you don't put as much money into the government, people will put more money into the economy. Also, the conservative idea is that the federal government has too much power. That does not mean that state governments shouldn't tax whatever they want to tax. It just means that those issues should be decided by each state individually, not by the federal government.

On the topic of Obamacare:

The conservative issue here is again the federal government. That does not mean that each state should not offer state sponsored health insurance. It just means that, again, it should be a state by state issue. Each state should decide their own healthcare system, no matter how they decide to do it. The other issue with health insurance is the "one size fits all" policies. If health insurance were more like car insurance, it could be cheaper and more available to more people, meaning the government would not have to pay as much anyway. People could just pay for things they actually needed in their policy (because not everyone needs to be covered for everything). They would then have more money to put back into the economy.

I want Obamacare because it would potentially pay for my sex reassignment surgery. However, I would much prefer personalized plans for everyone that were offered state by state. That just isn't offered though, so Obamacare is my ext best option right now. However, if I did not have to pay so much for health insurance that covers things I don't need covered, I would have the money to pay for my own sex reassignment surgery without insurance, and I would not have to worry about how I was going to be able to pay for it.

The problem with a lot of government programs is that people are paying for things they do not want or need, which then makes it more difficult for them to spend money on other things that would help the economy. Another problem is that when people are overtaxed and forced to pay for government programs, they no longer have enough money for donating. When people are forced to finance people who cannot afford certain things, you are taking away the thought that they might choose to do this on their own. My parents donate what they can, and my dad's company is constantly giving money to organizations, but they cannot donate as much as they would like to because they are forced to pay for other things that may or may not be benefitting someone who actually needs help.

Again, these are mostly ideas I have heard from my parents. I am still not really sure what my own beliefs are, but this should provide more of the conservative voice that was requested on this thread.

with regards to healthcare...when i had a good paying job, i had great healthcare...everything was covered....i paid nearly $100 out of each paycheck ($about 350-400 a month) i don't know how much my employer paid...however when i was laid off i could no longer afford to keep my coverage...that was followed by a series of low paying jobs (all under the bush administration) that had no benefits....now i'm completely unemployed, and despite all the taxes i paid in, all the social security, medicare etc that i paid in i still don't have any health care coverage...it's not because i'm a deadbeat and don't want to pay...it's that i can't pay...recently i had to have a pilonidal cyst lanced...the last time i had to have this process done it cost nearly $5000...i haven't seen the bill yet for this one, but my kidney stone bill was $10000...ridiculous that american healthcare is so absurdely expensive...and because i'm a (relatively)healthy white male i don't even qualify for any federal healthcare...

with regards to romney's (the anagram being r money,r =our) financial plan...he's only concerned with making certain the rich stay rich at any expense...he specialized in drowning companies in debt and walking away making a fortune off of it...trickle down economics (which is basically what he was going to do) failed under both bush's...clinton had to fix it after bush sr....obama has to fix it after bush junior...it's all thanks to reagan allowing big business and the super rich to have power in politics...special interest groups are just that special interest...they don't care about others, just themselves...i'm glad romney lost, he was caught in one too many lies and mistruths....he has proven time and again he can't be trusted, the silver spoons will never understand what it really means to not have...

To be honest, I don't understand why people need insurance for abortions.

I mean, people don't abort that frequently do they? I don't know much about private healthcare, but an abortion can't be that costly can it?

I'm a supporter of abortion because I wouldn't exist without it, but I'm not sure paying insurance just to have "free" abortions makes a lot of sense.

In regards to healthcare insurance, I rather like the setup in my country. Healthcare providers are private, the national insurance covers all the basic things (including medicine, UK doesnt do that), then people can purchase private additional insurance for their specific needs.

A great comparison of state vs private is the UK: the NHS is a state-of-the-art communist system where all practitioners are employees of the state and the whole thing is financed through tax. Opposite to this you have the car insurance system: You're forced to pay for it, have plenty of "choice" (though frankly it's probably just like the choice in newspapers: all owned by the same guy) but are so expensive that if you cause an accident, it'd be cheaper for you to buy the victim a new car.