Taking the steps of a Jedi...

I somehow knew this day would come with all the multiple changes that what I started with as Charter Member, and will aslways be a Charter Member, through everything in the past 5+ years, I never thought the treatment of a friend would be just tossed out so borderlined...

MTFBWYA

Br. John wrote:

Congregations are for local physical groups like Zanthan Storm has going on in Minnesota. For instance Mark Anjuu is a full Wicca Hight Priest and was the head of the Pagan Rite and now he's just the same except he is the head of the Pagan Special Studies Forum and a Bishop of Jediism, Pagan Specialist.

The Order is no more or less Christian friendly than its ever been.

Considering we all have a particular view of The Force we'd all have to have our own site if we followed through with that.

You feel off balance because you've not been here day in day out for some time and so much has happened.

The Living Force Of Creation has always been for the individual to define. If you believe it's God / Jesus / Holy Spirit that's up to you and anyone who feels that.

What we've accomplished is that new members do not feel pressured to have to choose a Rite or feel left out if they don't feel drawn to a particular one. Anyone training to become clergy still decides what, if any, special certifications s/he wants. A Jedi Christian minister will be qualified to do a proper Christian Baptism among other things for example.

I've not ceased being a Zen Master just because we have no Buddhist Rite and my views have not changed.

I feel like you are reading way more into this than there actually is.

Until you've been back in active participation for awhile I'd not make any quick decisions.

MTFBWY

This is what I always hope for this place was nothing but commomn ground, no pressure, even thought, and respect for each other, but I see still quick to jump...

This is what I always hope for this place was nothing but commomn ground, no pressure, even thought and respect for each other, but I see still quick to jump...

The rites have become 'specialist study groups' so whilst they are not a 'core' part of totjo - they are still a part of the order - no more or less important than ever before. It is upto each n ever member of this order to decide for themselves how they practise their own jediism.

What we have felt in the last 12-18months is that many newcomers seem to have a fixation on the rites - what we are trying to do is t focus on the core of Jediism here - then once a person is knighted - give them the freedom to explore the rites for themselves without it becoming a part of formal training, this is also related to TDO where too members (foer the most part) must have passed totjo core training before joining tdo.

I hope this clears up this particular point.

I dont see how this really affects your point of this thread as many here still ascribe to a 'specialist study group' (aka rite) - rest assured that the discussion of the rites was long and well considered from all sides and no one is forced to drop their rites etc - its business as usual - just a small renaming for the sake of newer members and to enable some focus on the core jediism.

About a year ago - i was afk for about 2moths and i still feel like im catching up from that - so i cant imagine how different totjo must feel/seem to Master NJP after all this time - let alone without all the other issues she has dealt with.

Off the cuff remarks from those who are ill-informed on this matter are not welcome or necessary and WILL be 'moderated' accordingly.

So - lets get back on topic can we please? - respectfully....

MTFBWY - A / SYW

Member of a rite, does that make me more or less a Jedi than juest \"Jedi\"?

No and that's why after a very long and careful consideration The Council decided to not emphasize Rites but to change the existing forums to special study areas. For such a long time there's been almost zero participation in Rites except for a person to declare one once in a while.


Does Pain mean you're not good enough or you fail to be a Jedi?

If it does then I'm not a Jedi. After the months of 24/7 care of my GrandMother it took me over a year to begin to feel back in balance and I had severe post traumatic stress syndrome. I've lived in the same house as MaMaw for 42 years so her absence is a void to say the least.

I never thought the treatment of a friend would be just tossed out so borderlined...

Sweet Baby Jesus! I hope this does not mean me. I've done a lot of rotten things in my day but I not casting you aside lightly or otherwise. I'm only trying to catch you up with what's been going on and some minor changes. We spent months debating the up's and down's and it was a careful and thoughtful decision.

If we took the Rites to their logical conclusion we'd need to have dozens of them to be fair. Jewish (Orthodox, Reform and Jew's For Jesus), Christian (and at least Catholic and Protestant), Islamic (at least two of those), Buddhist (and at least five of those for the major schools of thought) and so on.

Master Patty there were a post or two here that were certainly out of turn. I am telling you that no policy has changed and I believe you are reading way too much into this.

I value you very much. So will everyone when they get a chance to know you. I do understand why you were away for awhile. For the first five months after MaMaw died I woke op every morning and cried. I'd just stand there and scream. I felt as if the grief would kill me and I hoped it would.

I don't know what to say or do that will convince you that I have been and am your friend and this is disturbing.

Tell me what to do.

Peace.

John

No John it does not mean you, not the council, all have been there for me when I was apart and not a part of the council. I took steps to study the forums, teachings, etc., as suggested to when I was back to see where the Temple is now at and it's new direction...

I had hoped that in doing so that my post that asked for openess would have been given a chance to see what I was going to present before this \"misunderstanding\" happened instead of asuming the topics would be old items and not the possiblility of an outlook in the new direction....

But Honored as I am to just be, I will withdrawls my items and take the sidelines as a honored Master...

This is a case of a thread going wildly off topic due to a post of only a few words that had no business being there. Once the \"There are no Rites\" bomb was dropped well meaning people including myself felt compelled to explain and reassure you that all is well and about what had been going on and why.

I see that several of us felt that it was way out of place to say that to you like that and we were all caught up in an agony of propriety.

Then there's the problem of distortion that happens when people are foruming to each other instead of talking to each other.

I thought you were musing on some topics you were going to post and had put some ideas up for us to consider pending that and it went right over my head that you were actually asking some good questions now and things just worked out wrong.

That sort of thing has happened before and it will happen again.

Why not start a fresh topic and post the questions in a

1.
2.
3.

form and give the members a chance to answer them and see what happens?

Neaj Pa Bol wrote:

Uhmmm... Change, a good thing... Maybe after all this LOA I don't fit in any longer...

and

NeajPa Bol wrote:
Br. John I'm going to take you up on a congregation for TOTJO, one for TOTJO for those that think like myself or similar to and expand teachings that corrulates with TOTJO's as we had talked about once. I have a site beginning so I will fill all in once it is set up... I feel ilike I will be less of an outsider this way!

I too am sorry, I thought you felt that the changes that have taken place made you feel as if you did not belong Siste Neaj Pa Bol...

I do not know you well enough to read between the lines... reading the posts, in order, with the meanings commonly associated to them, it appears that way to me...

So please, as I said, I really enjoy good discussions, when people are respectfull to one another... As Br. John suggested... let's let this thread go, and begin anew....

Yeah, sorry about that. I didn't expect the thread to go wild like this. It's just that the two first posts mentioned the rites, and since I'm the guy who had to remove the rites and inactive council members from the website frontpage (Very funky page when you look at the code ), I thought I should mention it. there's no point in letting people go on about things that no longer exist.

Then again, there was no big announcement as far as I can tell about getting rid of the rites and having special interest groups instead. maybe doing so would have avoided any confusion for current/returning/new members.

Having looked back, it seems that you are right and there was no big public statement about the renaming of the Rites. The possibility had been raised and there were no substantial objections so it seemed natural to go ahead with it. I would like to offer apologies for anyone who has been confused by these changes.

It is true that for a long time there has been no significant activity in any of the Rites' forums, but their existence as such was leading to confusion with many members feeling that they had to choose one in order to remain at the Temple.

Hopefully it is now clear that we accept Jedi of all faiths and paths and provide the forums (in the form of the renamed Special Interest Groups) for those who wish to study or practice such ways as a part of their Jediism (as well as those wishing to know more about other perspectives). I personally still regard myself as a Pagan Jedi and am grateful to have such resources available so I hope that others feel the same way.

Anyway, I have no wish to prolong this sidestepping of the topic - I merely wanted to apologise for any oversights.