Did The (Movie) Jedi Deserve It?

I always considered that the age issue was purely to help attune their abilities. Children learn a lot faster than adults, not only with \"how to act properly,\" but with practical things, such as... you know... using the Force.

I do agree that the Council got too complacent. They believed that the Sith were gone, and therefore there was no need to worry. And yes, even Master Yoda mentioned that even the \"older, more experienced Jedi\" were growing a bit arrogant... and yes, they did a few things that may have had good intentions behind them, but nevertheless caused their own downfall... I wouldn't defend all the things they did, but I will still argue that they tried their best given the tense situation throughout Eps. I-III.

I think the Council still wanted Obi-Wan to train Anakin so they could keep him under watch, in case he did fulfill the prophecy. They left him in the are of Obi-Wan because they probably felt Anakin would feel more comfortable under Qui-Gon's old apprentice.

As for Yoda's argument that Luke was too old... he seemed to be grasping for excuses at that point. He was probably worried Luke would fall to the Dark Side too.

Ultimately, though, he helped his father bring balance to the Force, and IMO, the New Jedi Order is probably a bit better than the Old, having done away with most of the strict rules.

From Luke, though, I'm worried about how well they might fight...

Arrogance, a growing problem among the Jedi

I agree with Kana, it would have been better to take students in with potential even though they might not be \"perfect\", then leave them to their own devices. Who's to say that they might not accomplish incredible things, such as in Luke's case?

Still this person did bring up some points that might benefit us.

The age issue is there for allot of reasons.

-What a Jedi learns takes a life time to master.Some even take 800 years!
-Also if your raised to think in one way your hole life than it will be harder to turn your attention to some other way of thinking(dark side)
-lastly the attachment issue is a card that Sith play all to well so if your brought up without friends and family than thats one less thing to worry about when your against a Sith.

And as for the slaves well lets look at our planet.In the middle east there are wars that have been going on for a large portion of human history.WHY!? because you cant beat people that are willing to die for what they believe in.Same with the tatooine a planet of nothing but people with not much to lose but there lives.Jedi dont like to kill.Do you think that the people on tatooine will just let the slaves go?NO! there will be more deaths than saved lives.Your dealing with smugglers thieves and murderous.The Jedi would have to kill every one but the slaves to accomplish that.I my self would not want to kill 1000 to save 10.Even if they did bad things.No one has the right to take some ones life.

I think Daniel got everything I missed...

I forgot to mention the slavery issue, but... yes, you can't just go to a planet, declare \"THESE PEOPLE ARE NOW FREE!\" and expect the people of Tatooine to all cheer in joy. The slaves are, for many, important.

For instance, I'm sure things got a little rough for Watto after releasing Anakin. Judging by his unwillingness to give him up, at least, it seems that way...

And... yes, if the children are taken at an early way, they will be less attached to things such as, say... their mothers... and therefore will not be as succeptible to, say... the loss of said mothers... by the hands of Tusken Raiders....

A large portion of Jedi teachings seem mostly to ensure that the Jedi don't fall to the Dark Side. It's not about control of others, it's about control of oneself, correct?

100% correct!

This person said that they did not guard against the Sith but the only one to be taken by the Sith was the one not trained properly.Anakin!
He was to old and so he fell to the dark side.His fall was their down fall.So if they didn't take him in I'm sure the Sith would have lost then and there

In my point of view the only thing the Jedi ever did \"bad\" was attempt to rid them selfs of the gray Jedi or \"The Potentium\".Youll be shocked to know that it was Yoda who led that campaign! yeah I know right YODA!?

In any other scenario i can give a list of reasons for what they did.

Its all about the balance. The Force created away to balance the scales between the light jedi and the dark jedi.

Anakin was the chosen one of the prophecy said to bring balance to the force. As far as I can tell the jedi brought about their own destruction by misinterpretting the prophecy. They beleived Anakin was going to help them eliminate the Sith threat there by bringing peace in the galaxy but not balance in the Force. Once Anakin joined the Dark Side, the attack launched on the jedi academy & order 66 eliminated all but a handful of the jedi. And thus balance was achieved.

Prophecies are open to interpretation as evidenced by the jedi's false interpretation of the prophecy concerning Anakin, but in the end the will of the Force will be done. So my personal answer to the question no the jedi did not deserve it, but yes they brought it on themselves.


off topic: does anyone know exactly who master syphodius(sp?) was?

well not really.
Anakin ,in a sense, did bring balance to the force.He brought Luke and Leia in to existence.The are the balance.

and yeah i know all about Sifo-Dyas.Heres a little thing most dont know.Sifo-Dyas was going to be the name of Darth Sidious.It was a spelling error but they liked it so they kept the name any way.

Sifo-Dyas was a Jedi Knight and a friend of Dooku.When Sidious turned Dooku to the dark side after telling him his plan to take over.Sifo went to Kamino to make the clone army to defend the Jedi.Dooku found out about this and clones and killed Sifo as a last test to show that he was now a sith.Dooku kept his body frozen until he had to use it to turn General Grievous in to a cyborg.He also gave Grievous his blue light saber.

HELLO!! in all this thinking we are forgetting some things first it wasnt just by bringing Luke and Leia into existence anakin brought balance did no body watch the end of Return of the Jedi did he not destroy the emperor (sidious) and himself in the process not to mention turn back to the light in doing so destroying the sith and balancing the force. and also anakin wasnt the only jedi to turn and while yes im sure some of it had to do with NOT starting at an early age that isnt the whole story what about Count Dooku aka Darth Tyranus he changed to the dark side from being a Jedi right?...yeah sure did. and in the expanded universe with the New Jedi Order Luke took on many older jedi and trained them and they became powerful and great Jedi so age has little to nothing to do about it. It was purely Anakins lust for power, his unwillingness to let go, and his arrogance that lead to his downfall. And the downfall of the Jedi was do to their arrogance as well their whole \"This is the way it is this is how it is to be done\" attitude and their assurance that the sith were extinct and that they had such a handle on things that they let their worst enemy come to power right under their noses. Did they deserve it? maybe. Were they the cause of it? not entirely but yes i would say mostly jst because they are great Jedi masters doesnt mean their way is best and that they are immune to folly.

Regarding Yoda - I think he is a perfect example that no matter how long you spend learning and teaching, you can still make mistakes.

It was only until his exile on Dagobah, I think, that he fully learned the greater aspects of being a Jedi. Particularly since Qui-Gon, who Yoda certainly must have trained as a Youngling, was now his own Master.

It just goes to show, the dynamics can change, and not even the wisest of the wise will truly be infallible.

(You heard me, Catholics. :laugh:)