Do you believe in levels of consciousness?

I think we can see that consciousness is "awareness" of something, right? so thank you Ohmu for trying to help! its appreciated. haters can sit in a puddle of pudding!

I will tell you of my definitions that are similar to yours

I am not sure about an evil consciousness, I think that is just the dark side of the force that I describe as the absence of life.

Worldly consciousness I call physical consciousness - It is awareness of the physical world - height, thickness, and wideness and time.

waking consciousness I call astral consciousness - it is awareness of astral plane where astral or energy bodies are and some believe demons and angels and such

subconsciousness i call causal consciousness - and it is awareness of mental energy and being able to talk to spirit guides and model being energies

super I call neutral - its where akasic records reside so it is awareness of of future, past, present events, emotions and connections

christ I call spiritual - it is the plane of ascended masters like jesus and buddha and people like that so it is awareness and communication with with great powers and influences

cosmic I call Divine - This is the plane of creation where the force takes of itself and shatters it to millions of pieces to be sprinkled down through the layers to create reality. I guess this is best seen as awareness of our connection to everyhting.

And then above that is The Force itself, the creator.

Fyxe wrote: I think we can see that consciousness is "awareness" of something, right? so thank you Ohmu for trying to help! its appreciated. haters can sit in a puddle of pudding!

I will tell you of my definitions that are similar to yours

I am not sure about an evil consciousness, I think that is just the dark side of the force that I describe as the absence of life.

Worldly consciousness I call physical consciousness - It is awareness of the physical world - height, thickness, and wideness and time.

waking consciousness I call astral consciousness - it is awareness of astral plane where astral or energy bodies are and some believe demons and angels and such

subconsciousness i call causal consciousness - and it is awareness of mental energy and being able to talk to spirit guides and model being energies

super I call neutral - its where akasic records reside so it is awareness of of future, past, present events, emotions and connections

christ I call spiritual - it is the plane of ascended masters like jesus and buddha and people like that so it is awareness and communication with with great powers and influences

cosmic I call Divine - This is the plane of creation where the force takes of itself and shatters it to millions of pieces to be sprinkled down through the layers to create reality. I guess this is best seen as awareness of our connection to everyhting.

And then above that is The Force itself, the creator.

Thank you for this. Though i figured these sorts of things were what you had in mind, spelling it out makes a lot of difference. The thread is titled “Do you believe in levels of consciousness?” and based on these examples youve given, i can say unequivocally no, they sound like fantasy mumbo jumbo that people believe in because they want them to be real. Ive read about these sorts of things in books back when i was into new age authors but the time i spent with that crowd, meeting people and going to talks by people like Stuart Wilde and Deepak Chopra and Wayne Dyer and a few others whose names i dont recall, offhand, the more i realized that it was space cadet bullsht. People paying for fantasies and people willing to feed fantasies to the people willing to pay for them. For every scrap of real insight, there was a pound of fluffy nonsense.
Now, i have had my share of experiences you might call “psychic” and “mystical” and i am completely open to possibilities that defy conventionally proven facts about reality and consciousness. But im not able to play along with people who just keep building more and more elaborate fantasies out of what they wish were true.

So again, my answer to your question is: no, but good luck to you.

Fyxe wrote: haters can sit in a puddle of pudding!
This is particularly bad but keep it chill. I can see your frustration Fyxe, but I ask to read deeply what others have said, there is a wide variety of thought here. There are many different people with different tones of writing, they also have different specialties in life where they have that knowledge comes into play in a discussion. This foster good discussion, and I have seen comments like this blow up before. Note: this is not a warning or anything, just me saying, this could be a much better discussion without insult.

I will tell you of my definitions that are similar to yours

I am not sure about an evil consciousness, I think that is just the dark side of the force that I describe as the absence of life.

Worldly consciousness I call physical consciousness - It is awareness of the physical world - height, thickness, and wideness and time.

waking consciousness I call astral consciousness - it is awareness of astral plane where astral or energy bodies are and some believe demons and angels and such

subconsciousness i call causal consciousness - and it is awareness of mental energy and being able to talk to spirit guides and model being energies

super I call neutral - its where akasic records reside so it is awareness of of future, past, present events, emotions and connections

christ I call spiritual - it is the plane of ascended masters like jesus and buddha and people like that so it is awareness and communication with with great powers and influences

cosmic I call Divine - This is the plane of creation where the force takes of itself and shatters it to millions of pieces to be sprinkled down through the layers to create reality. I guess this is best seen as awareness of our connection to everything.

And then above that is The Force itself, the creator.

So, in context of the discussion I have to ask. Why subdivide consciousness in to so many levels?
From my point of view, it seems like naval gazing at something that we in the end cannot be conscious of even if we wanted to. To me in a way the literal "live" consciousness and the experience of living in a moment is the Force. Why break that apart and make it more complex?

Now do attempt we apply that to the grand scale and why? Or do we see the Force as able to be applied and understood within the actual moment in which you are currently partaking in on a micro scale? When you do as little as smile, and it makes another happy you have altered their consciousness have you not? Are a million of these moments of application better than many of failed and few successful attempts to apply the Force in such a macro way?

Just some thoughts on whats been talked about.

Much Love, Respect and Peace,
Kobos

Just some way

My apologies for the double post, there are some specific things i want to elaborate on but i know people are keeping up with what gets posted and i dont want these additional thoughts to be missed. I also see that i have some “thank you” action going on and i dont want anyone who thanked me to then feel conflicted after seeing additional statements which added something they wouldnt want to thank. So here we go:

OP, you list some things here that just dont make any sense to me. Like how the dark side of the force is the absence of life so i dont see how that adds up.

Astral plane: People talk about astral projection and i see it like this: if you cant astrally project to my house and tell me what kind of cereal i am eating, youre probably just having a very vivid dream. Understand, I do believe in dreams as a “state of consciousness”. There is a type of “soul travel” where (for example) shamans enter into the underworld in order to find the solution to a problem. And certain yogis and other mystic types also enter into trance states and have other kinds of visions and immersive experiences. I suspect these that training allows one to enter into what a modern westerner would consider a lucid dream with a predetermined theme. I believe these experoence can definitely produce insight but i dont believe the “soul” really goes anywhere.

Your idea about the subconscious doesnt acknowledge anything that modern research or theory has to say on the topic. Its all ghosts and spirits with you. If i ask you how “spirits” are different from “angels and demons” can you give me an answer that really comes from your own experience of dealing with spirits, angels, and demons, or will you just repeat to me what you read in a book or saw on a video?

Akashic records is another one i think is just blabber. So many people talk about akashic records but none of them can actually predict the future. I mean, yeah, they can make ominous declarations about the blood moon and the three headed lizard, but they cant tell you who the next president will be, or who will win the next super-bowl, or when the next major plane crash will happen. Its not even that i reject all forms of divination its that people who talk of akashic records dont ever show that they can actually access them.

Why is your “spiritual” separate from from your “astral”? Demons and angels arent spiritual beings? Heres another important moment: what does the word “spiritual” mean? Im not asking you to explain it, in asking you to think about it.

The divine state of consciousness where the force shatters itself to millions of pieces to sprinkle down and create reality.

Reminds me of the Eagle’s Emanations from the works of Carlos Castaneda. My question is; is this something youve witnessed personally?

Kobos wrote: Or do we see the Force as able to be applied and understood within the actual moment in which you are currently partaking....? When you do as little as smile, and it makes another happy you have altered their consciousness have you not? Are a million of these moments of application better than many of failed and few successful attempts to apply the Force in such a macro way?

Thank you, thank you, THANK YOU. Smiling in a happy and unselfconscious way is a real power. Its a modest power that maybe no one will make any movies about and definitely not going to give us “ascended master” status, but its a power that really influences the people around us and its one that we can all learn. Great point.

I dont think you alter consciousness by smiling, you only alter perception and maybe mood. I am also not the creator of the universe so I cant answer why so many levels, I didnt make them up. they were there and explored and written down before me.

obi1, if the light side of the force is all connected life, does it not seem like the dark side of the force would be the absense of life? There can be no love without life and so lack of love is darkness.

Astral projection - ahh I see this is a trick question! you were not even eating any cereal. in fact you are quite a mild drinker of milk. No demons and angels are not spirit beings, they are astral if they exist at all. I dont believe in demons or angels because I dont believe God exists. if anyone has encountered them (I havent) they are just tricksters. this is also why a soul does not exist that can leave the body. no such thing. instead what I think happens is we extend ourselves and our perception outwards to others. we are all connected at the force level so why would we not be able to do this? I am one piece of a consciousness, why would I not be able to interact with other pieces? spirits are just more of those pieces. like I said, demons or angels are just pretending to be something they are not.

I have never mentioned anything about subconscious so I am not sure how you would know anything about my ideas on that? I think we have subconscious. that is that part that can be aware of 200 things and takes care of them without our even knowing. like heart beat, breathing, dangers, stuff like that.

Nostradamus was an amazing reader of the akasic record, he has predicted all sorts of amazing things through time. the problem is that no one else practices his form of reading and so his stuff is not confirmed until after it happens most of the time. there have been others like him but they have never gotten together to compare notes!

I have not witnessed all of this personally, but I have some awareness of a lot of it. like being maybe at a party and listening to all the people talking that is very noise so you cant make out what anyone is saying and then suddenly your mind just sharpens and comes into focus on a single word you hear clearly, your friend across the room calls your name. You hear that as clear as day and then the buzz comes back, but your consciousness is altered for that second and you become aware of your friend trying to get your attention. its like that.

I think these different levels are the source of great powers like the Jedi in the movies have. but achieving awareness of these places we can gain what seem like supernatural powers. however they are just force powers.

Fyxe wrote: I dont think you alter consciousness by smiling, you only alter perception and maybe mood. I am also not the creator of the universe so I cant answer why so many levels, I didnt make them up. they were there and explored and written down before me.

Perception and reality are often not far apart. All perception, reality and mood are stimuli experienced via consciousness. So I repeat the question, it\s that smile not a manipulation of another consciousness (let alone the biological and other effects it has on the self)? So then why take the word of those who have written before you and easily dismiss those whom speak to you now?

Much Love, Respect and Peace,
Kobos

Kobos wrote: Perception and reality are often not far apart.

Spot on Kobos, indeed I'd go a little further than that. Our perception IS our subjective reality, and the only reality we have constant and immediate access to. It's only by comparing/sharing our perception of reality with others where we can find similarities and therefore begin the discussion of whether or not there is any kind of objective reality.

Kobos wrote: So then why take the word of those who have written before you and easily dismiss those whom speak to you now?

Another excellent question. Based on historical and personal experience, I would surmise that it is because these particular writers have only served to reinforce that which the OP already held to be true.

Dismiss?? who have I dismissed?
I asked about belief, didnt I? I just wanted to know what people believe?

I supose a smile can be interpeted as a change in consciousness but not all the time. its not guranteed. so like if Im in a pissy mood and someone smiles at me it might mean they are acting hoity instead of friendly. it didnt change my perception of being pissy then.

But it might also be that IM just walking down the street and a hot person smiles at me and suddenly Im aware that they are attracted or like me. well thats a change. but once again, that same thing could happen and I woujld never notice. so its not a perfect idea.

as for taking words, I did not take words, I had experiences, then I read stuff and it matched what I experiences so its a good bet that others experience what I did so I accept their telling. IM just asking thaqt same thing her. have others seen stuff or have some reason to think this stuff is real. how is that dismissing?

That is fair I would say I miss read the intent of some of your comments, perhaps the word dismiss was of poor choice on my part. I do believe I see a little dismissal of opinion based on a perceived notion of what others should believe. There is no such thing as a perfect idea nor is there an absolute outcome to any one action. I only use the smile as an example because it is an easily understandable action.

Just thoughts man take them for what they are.

I tend to agree Brick but it is a case where we can all be open minded. The writers Fyxe have brought up are not poor sources but are often read without context.

Much Love, Respect and Peace,
Kobos

Fyxe wrote: I dont think you alter consciousness by smiling, you only alter perception and maybe mood.

Can you explain the difference between perception and consciousness? I dont mean one single perception as in, “i spy with my little eye, a pencil” but the ability to perceive at all and the act of perception. How is that different from consciousness?

obi1, if the light side of the force is all connected life, does it not seem like the dark side of the force would be the absense of life?

My personal opinion is that “darkness” in the case of the Force is a metaphor for human evil - lets say “evil” and agree that we all understand what i mean. I believe the word “evil” is valid but i know others dont - its tangental atm, let me make it everyone, please.

Astral projection - ahh I see this is a trick question! you were not even eating any cereal. in fact you are quite a mild drinker of milk.

This was a little bit funny. But the point remains; ive encountered dozens of people (hundreds if you count online) who believe in astral projection but not one who could tell me what kind of shirt i was wearing.

instead what I think happens is we extend ourselves and our perception outwards to others. we are all connected at the force level so why would we not be able to do this? I am one piece of a consciousness, why would I not be able to interact with other pieces?

I think there may be something to this. Im just not convinced in astral travel.

spirits are just more of those pieces. like I said, demons or angels are just pretending to be something they are not.

This is an example of a claim without foundation. You already said you havent encountered and and don't think they exist but if they DO exist they are “pretending to be something they are not”
Where did you get that bit of information?

I have never mentioned anything about subconscious so I am not sure how you would know anything about my ideas on that?

In this post, right here you said:

subconsciousness i call causal consciousness - and it is awareness of mental energy and being able to talk to spirit guides and model being energies

I think we have subconscious. that is that part that can be aware of 200 things and takes care of them without our even knowing. like heart beat, breathing, dangers, stuff like that.

So this is a good place to begin building you ideas on solid ground. There definitely seems to be some level of consciousness that operates below our typical, waking awareness. This is something you can find convincing evidence of and while its not as exciting as the hope for magic powers, it is at least real.

Nostradamus was an amazing reader of the akasic record, he has predicted all sorts of amazing things through time. the problem is that no one else practices his form of reading and so his stuff is not confirmed until after it happens most of the time. there have been others like him but they have never gotten together to compare notes!

Nostradamus was one of those people i mentioned who made ominous declarations about blood moons ad three headed lizards. Have you ever actually read any of his prophecies; theyre gibberish. When a person speaks in symbols and metaphors you can apply their words to all kind of things, heres an example: a young dove faces the morning sun.... a great trembling is felt and when the snow has finally melted, there will be peace. I just made that up but if I cared to make up a whole book full of that nonsense and the book managed to survive for 500 years, thered be a hundred real life events that my followers would claim i predicted.

I think these different levels are the source of great powers like the Jedi in the movies have.

The powers of the Jedi are just as made up as the powers of Superman and the Incredible Hulk.

but achieving awareness of these places we can gain what seem like supernatural powers. however they are just force powers.

This is really what it comes down to. A wish for great powers. I wont ask you to stop hoping for these powers. I still hope for some of them myself. I do hope you learn to be a bit more skeptical about the claims you encounter. Probably me trying to “convince” you will only make you dig in deeper, though.
Anyway, if there are any powers to be obtained, my guess is that its the amount of work you put into the cultivation of trance states and visualization abilities and skill at lucid dreaming and other such practices that will develop them.

Yes the difference between perception and consciousness is consciousness is awareness of the smile taking place. perception is how that smile is interpreted, either as friendly or hoity or whatever.

so you said you wanted to make what you thought evil was clear... but then you never did?

The real question here is, were you actually eating cerial or not? If you werent I got that right.

on the demons and angels thing, its just my opinion. I never said absolutely its this way or that way but I believe its this way, that angels and demons dont exist. I base that on the believe (Ihave not others) that god is not existing because if he did the universe woujld be utter nonsense.

I never said anyhting about astral travel either. I dont think there are souls like that travel arojund, I think we are all really just one and if I concentrate I can tell what my toe is doing even though most of the time I have no idea what its doing unless I focus on it or it hurts. so if my friend gets hurt I may feel that without me trying because its forced on me and I will know they were in a car crash or something like that before anyone ever tells me. This is a Force Power!

I did not mean subconscious like yhou mean, I was using the term that ohmu used in his post. then later on I said what I think it is, just body function stuff.

I think poetry is the closest thing we can get to an actual language that might begin to tell about the force. So if you wrfite seemingly gibberish and it comes true who are you to say it was not from the Force? Maybe you are a prophet and dont even know it? Have you ever tried it? maybe the force is speaking to you through your subconscious and you are just not realizing it. have you ever considered that your free will might not be so free?

maybe the force uses you for great powers and you dont even see it because your mind is stuck to much in common things for you to see what is really going on?

Fyxe wrote: if the light side of the force is all connected life, does it not seem like the dark side of the force would be the absense of life? There can be no love without life and so lack of love is darkness.

No. First of all, no clue where you get the idea that the light side "is all connected life" (what ever that means), but even if it were so, it does not follow that the dark side is therefore non-life or death even. It is perfectly possible for both to be life or for life to be both. When ever you step out into the sun, you cannot help but cast a shadow. And the more light sources you surround yourself with the more shadows you'll be casting just as well. In some sense one could even argue that you are much more connected to your shadow than you are the light source, as the shadow would usually "touch" you by your feet and follow your every move, while the sun couldn't care less how much you try to escape your shadow or not. To stick with the metaphor, you can elect to face, even embrace the dakness of your own night side or the shadow that won't ever leave you. You can also follow the light like flowers do and bloom softly in its warmth (though please, do not look into the sun directly, you won't be doing anyone any favours with that). Or you can face any other direction inbetween, accepting as all must, that you couldn't cast a shadow if the light didn't fill the space around you, and that you couldn't interact with any light without obscuring it for what ever else it otherwise might reach.

You are writing circles around yourself Gisteron. You say that shadow touches but light does not? and then you say light is all around us, even touching us more than the shadow that only touches at our feet. with photonic rays and such I think. so the light actually embraces us in love and the darkness is wanting to kill what it touches. things cant grow without the light. things in shadow that cant get to the light die. darkness is death, light is love. seems pretty obvious to me~

Fyxe wrote: Yes the difference between perception and consciousness is consciousness is awareness of the smile taking place. perception is how that smile is interpreted, either as friendly or hoity or whatever.

I actually really like this and where it can go. So I have to further ask, if perception is interpreting the smile is it something you are doing consciously (with thought) or something that is reactionary?

Much Love,
Kobos

Fyxe wrote: You are writing circles around yourself Gisteron. You say that shadow touches but light does not?

No, I do not say that. I will say, though, I'm looking forward to the day when I won't be condescended to from someone who by the looks of it is entirely unable to read.

and then you say light is all around us, even touching us more than the shadow that only touches at our feet.

Nope, didn't say that either. I was very metaphorically mentioning the shadow "touching" us at all, and I said nothing of the sort about light.

with photonic rays and such I think.

Oh, now you have my attention. Come on, let's have a thread about your ideas of how physics work, haha! :silly:

so the light actually embraces us in love and the darkness is wanting to kill what it touches. things cant grow without the light. things in shadow that cant get to the light die. darkness is death, light is love. seems pretty obvious to me~

Since you love the fiction so much, here is an unordered list of most common killing devices in it:

• Laser pistol/blaster
• Laser cannon
• Laser turret
• Laser sword
• Laser rifle
• Mounted laser gun

Remind me again how darkness is the thing that wants or is even fit to kill what ever it touches, please.

That being said, I'm not arguing the opposite. My point is that no "photonic ray" as you put it can actually ever "embrace you" from all sides anyway. Only half of you is illuminated by any one source and the other one is not and to run from the shadow as if you can ever get rid of it or as if it was evil or wanted anyone any harm is as futile as it is childish. To paint the Force in this one-dimensional, superficial, narrow, borderline cartoonish black-and-white colours as you do also sharply contrasts with the lecturing tone you adopt to then present the painting with. Spend some time maybe studying the philosophies you think you already have nothing left to learn about. Heck, even just listen to what people say, lest you clumsily lie about it before the page turns again...

Does a flying plane have a shadow touching it Gisteron? Does a plane flying above the clouds and in the sun ever find itself in a place where the suns photonic rays are not touching it? so it seems you can get away from darkness but never away from the lightness of the universe. anything in the dark will die. space is death and the sun is life. I shall talk physics with you any day! its quite simple really.

kobos, I think that is the very trick. I think if we dont take the time to be aware our perceptions will be not always right and we end up in bad places and believing things not true. but if we take the time, slow down a bit, and enjoy the moments and reaaaaaally think about what we just experienced we can see a clear picture of what happened. Dont you think?

Fyxe wrote: Kobos, I think that is the very trick. I think if we dont take the time to be aware our perceptions will be not always right and we end up in bad places and believing things not true. but if we take the time, slow down a bit, and enjoy the moments and reaaaaaally think about what we just experienced we can see a clear picture of what happened. Dont you think?

I actually do. I think that indeed the work of being conscious of our perceptions is in fact another level of consciousnesses. However, it is not something that really exists separably from consciousness it's all the same. Also, I personally believe it is not as black and white as slow down, enjoy the moment. What other aspects are there to each moment to be conscious of? Are these different levels of consciousness?

Much Love,
Kobos

Fyxe wrote: Does a flying plane have a shadow touching it Gisteron?

"Touching" in that same very vague and borderline metaphoric sense, yes.

Does a plane flying above the clouds and in the sun ever find itself in a place where the suns photonic rays are not touching it?

If by "in the sun" you mean at daytime, then no.

so it seems you can get away from darkness but never away from the lightness of the universe.

I guess then the sun never sets where you live. Possibly because your earth is transparent or something, what do I know... Fair enough.

anything in the dark will die.

As will anything in the light.

space is death and the sun is life.

That's interesting, considering how we find life all over the earth, a place suspended by enormous amounts of space, while the sun is a barren fiery ball so hot that hardly any compound manages to form on or inside it, whereas they are quite happy to appear on random asteroids zooming through the deadly void.

Again, you are arguing as if I'm disagreeing with you, when all I point out is how completely one-sided your outlook is that fails to treat anything with fairness.

I shall talk physics with you any day! its quite simple really.

I'm quite looking forward to it already.

I think if we dont take the time to be aware our perceptions will be not always right and we end up in bad places and believing things not true.

Oh, like magical powers and parallel worlds? Goodness, that would be awful wouldn't it... Oh, wait.

but if we take the time, slow down a bit, and enjoy the moments and reaaaaaally think about what we just experienced we can see a clear picture of what happened. Dont you think?

Nope. No amount of sitting in an arm chair having a deep think is going to get you any kind of dependable picture of anything that actually happened. If anything, one'd be more likely to rewrite one's own memory that way.

I would say different levels of perception kobos. Because we are aware of the action no matter what, but how we perceive it is more accurate. Higher conscious would be to like become aware of something we we not aware of before.

Actually gisteron my world is flat and the sun rotates around the disk, sun never sets, just gets far far away. I'm glad you said you agreed with me! What a relief, I had misunderstood your comments it seems. I truly thought you were trying to be sarcastic or something like that!