How is rank about academics and not just a popularity contest?

It's used between John and Ren

No it is not.

Lumella wrote: How intruiging indeed ,

So , Br John and Ren are Jabba the Hut
Rosalyn knew about it because she discussed it with Tellahane , Carlos is in denying of everthing probably because he is the Pastor and loves where he is , desperately trying to get this on topic..

Br John is the founder, ren is a veteran councillor who once used Jabba's "The art of the deal" as an avatar to commemorate the democratic choices of the american people, Rosalyn is the former pastor and councillor, Carlos is current pastor and councillor, and tellahane, member of a clique that enjoys making things up, accusing others of one thing or another, and recently ragequit a second time after Carlos (pastor) unlocked a thread.

Maybe Tellahane can explain how his rank is not just a popularity contest.

ren wrote:

Lumella wrote: How intruiging indeed ,

So , Br John and Ren are Jabba the Hut
Rosalyn knew about it because she discussed it with Tellahane , Carlos is in denying of everthing probably because he is the Pastor and loves where he is , desperately trying to get this on topic..

Br John I the founder, ren is a veteran councillor who once used Jabba's "The art of the deal" as an avatar to commemorate the democratic choices of the american people, Rosalyn is the former pastor and councillor, Carlos is current pastor and councillor, and tellahane, member of a clique that enjoys making things up, accusing others of one thing or another, and recently ragequit a second time after Carlos (pastor) unlocked a thread.

Maybe Tellahane can explain how his rank is not just a popularity contest.

Thank you for your explanation , it all seems a little mentally unstable to me , i have read a few topics where the mental instability of leaders and members seems to get the better of them.

Its very clear to me that Kyrin is not the problem, and i kinda glad she is not being silenced , the one thing a open learning enviroment should be is inviting to discuss even the hardest things in life.

Its very clear to me that Kyrin is not the problem, and i kinda glad she is not being silenced , the one thing a open learning enviroment should be is inviting to discuss even the hardest things in life.

Believe me the clique in question has tried every trick in the book to silence Kyrin, who is no angel either btw :lol:

I could not agree more with you regarding tough discussions.

i have read a few topics where the mental instability of leaders and members seems to get the better of them.

totjo has had to deal with expert manipulators who for many years have tried to destabilize totjo. There also appear to be some institutional factors leading to obsession then disillusionment with knightism. We are exploring dramatic solutions.

Its a wonder what people let themselves get distracted by.

Every time you get sistracted by thingsbyou lose out on a growth opportunity

ren wrote:

Its very clear to me that Kyrin is not the problem, and i kinda glad she is not being silenced , the one thing a open learning enviroment should be is inviting to discuss even the hardest things in life.

Believe me the clique in question has tried every trick in the book to silence Kyrin, who is no angel either btw :lol:

I could not agree more with you regarding tough discussions.

i have read a few topics where the mental instability of leaders and members seems to get the better of them.

totjo has had to deal with expert manipulators who for many years have tried to destabilize totjo. There also appear to be some institutional factors leading to obsession then disillusionment with knightism. We are exploring dramatic solutions.

Have you considered getting rid of all ranks and just be Jedi, could you have a system where integrity and good behaviour are deemed normal ? I can imagine its very discouraging to fight manipulation , especially when its within the organisation. And people want transparancy , which i think is overrated really because if someone is a Tyrand they dont care that we know what he is up to. Cliques are not a good thing in any organisation , and yet every organisation has some. I think this is deeply rooted in the need for people to be understood , another very overrated concept , i dont care if you understand me really , i just do my best to be a better person than i was yesterday.

This need to be understood leads to Cliques , pms are send , talks behind peoples backs start , suddenly people stop talking to anyone that endangers their cocoon. After a while they start fighting eachother and another Jedi back stabbing website drama is born. A shame really because there are some neat Jedi codes to prevent that from happening.

I hope that whatever dramatic solution props up will make the Jedi here somewhat less self aware and more "other" aware in the sense of them offering solutions to everyday sorrow and grief and that they may be a light and a baken

Rosalyn J wrote: Its a wonder what people let themselves get distracted by.

Every time you get sistracted by thingsbyou lose out on a growth opportunity

I hope you are just being Silly here because most of lives lessons are sprung out of distraction , your effort to somehow make people feel unvalid because they cannot focus is demeaning and does not show the humility that i would expect.

Although i understand the need for focus in a task at hand , in a discussion a distraction often brings to light an underlying problem , and that problem then needs more light shed on it.

You hit the nail on the head.

Lumella wrote:

Rosalyn J wrote: Its a wonder what people let themselves get distracted by.

Every time you get sistracted by thingsbyou lose out on a growth opportunity

I hope you are just being Silly here because most of lives lessons are sprung out of distraction , your effort to somehow make people feel unvalid because they cannot focus is demeaning and does not show the humility that i would expect.

Although i understand the need for focus in a task at hand , in a discussion a distraction often brings to light an underlying problem , and that problem then needs more light shed on it.

I've heard that too. Since I saw my name pop up in this discussion unbidden, I thought I'd give my assessment.

By the by, this thread is all about invalidation. Don't get mad at me if I add a bit of invalidation to an invalidation soup.

Come on

Rosalyn J wrote: By the by, this thread is all about invalidation. Don't get mad at me if I add a bit of invalidation to an invalidation soup.

Come on

You know You are going to have to expand on that right? :laugh:

ren wrote:

Rosalyn J wrote: By the by, this thread is all about invalidation. Don't get mad at me if I add a bit of invalidation to an invalidation soup.

Come on

You know You are going to have to expand on that right? :laugh:

Yes and while you are at it , please explain to me how your comment has a possible solution in it , because now you just look offended because your name popped up in a thread ...

Anyway , rank should be about academic knowlegde aquired and behaviour becoming of that rank , but as we all know it is not. The reason it seems a popularity contest is because some people are just more popular than others and get noticed sooner , some have been taking getting noticed to a higher art , and neglegted to fill in the obvious blancs where behaviour outside their instiutions is concerned ..its a long hard way Jedi , and no one ever said it would be easy ..May the Force be with you all

I'm not offended

Well that escalated quickly :whistle:

I think there's something to be said for people who have come to understand human beings, on a level where they are not bothered by what is actually regarded as typical human behavior (ie. pretty much everything that has taken place in this thread and elsewhere around the temple). I've met some of these people. What I've observed is that, due to the fact that they don't take themselves and their own opinions so seriously, they are able to work within these kinds of communities and make a difference, be an inspiration, help people out on tremendous levels, and yet, moderate their involvement to a healthy frequency. They seem to be able to differentiate the vocal minority from "the whole temple", and put their priorities and responsibilities where worrying about someone else being a proper leader doesn't, nor shouldn't concern them. They have what seems to be a healthy ego, in that, they do still have an ego and it can be poked on, but they've learned how to not let it take the wheel (at least where it really matters not to).

Consider this though... They very rarely ever post here. However, they do not rage quit. They take breaks. I think they focus on their lessons, their apprentices, their office tasks, etc. When they do post, its usually pretty strait forward and tends to not include personal jabs, remarks, or just general personal involvement in threads with drama going on. Usually, just some basic facts that are on-topic, and then they move on. Ever notice that?

I might say, they've come to the realisation that whatever the temple is doing, is simply what humans do, and that, you're not going to change that. In fact, the harder one tries to change that, the more it doubles down. This is why crusading for truth, or justice, etc, tends to rile things up all the more. Seems to be quicksand you're dealing with in the end. What tends to work for them, I think, is learning the very tricky skill of working with the community in forgiveness of its human flaws - meaning, not trying to grind against it when people are being people, because doing so is what generates that all the more. But I think it really does take a light-hearted sense of self to do so.

I think anyone who has shown this kind of behavior are the one's who have come to understand the point of degree scheme the most, and have learned how to get the most out of it. It looks like its just a bunch of academia, but if you actually talk to them personally, you'll realise, it had very little to do with academics in the first place.

ren wrote:

Lumella wrote: How intruiging indeed ,

So , Br John and Ren are Jabba the Hut
Rosalyn knew about it because she discussed it with Tellahane , Carlos is in denying of everthing probably because he is the Pastor and loves where he is , desperately trying to get this on topic..

Br John is the founder, ren is a veteran councillor who once used Jabba's "The art of the deal" as an avatar to commemorate the democratic choices of the american people, Rosalyn is the former pastor and councillor, Carlos is current pastor and councillor, and tellahane, member of a clique that enjoys making things up, accusing others of one thing or another, and recently ragequit a second time after Carlos (pastor) unlocked a thread.

Maybe Tellahane can explain how his rank is not just a popularity contest.

Well you got some of that right.

My second "Rage Quit" as you call it was nothing about carlos unlocking a thread I locked, and everything to do about the new "goal" of the temple which was to purposefully keep hostile guests around for the sake of causing hostility and conflict so that knights and other ranking members could be "seen" defending its membership as a PR stunt. The moment that became a thing was the moment I left the administrative position. Not one part of that plan follows the teachings here and I do not support it or the administrative decision to do it, and I will not serve a temple that intentionally allows hostility of its members for the sake of "looking good".

"Jabba The Slut"'s account was banned by me during my tenure as "Assistant Site Admin" when several reports came in about inappropriate content and posting etc. The account's IP didn't match anyone so just like most bans of that type, never thought of again. Then sometime a year later, while I was the actual server admin, the account suddenly became un-banned and started posting in a very specific heated thread, just out of nowhere. IP address was different then before but again no matches, so I did some digging. Turns out joomla has a log for all administrative access stored in a php file not a log file, guess what I found ren? The account was unbanned by john(with not council votes no posts no pardons no nothing), and shortly after that logged into by an IP address reversing to a location affiliated with john, and posts popped up. The account was re-banned I screenshoted all of the evidence, and as ros was john's closest ear at the time I approached her to talk to john about it, and it ceased again...

Now just a few days after I'm no longer admin, ren has taken back over, the account re-surfaces again just after above agenda is put into place? come on it's not coincidence...so yeah I'll call out the obvious BS...

As far as knight rank being a popularity contest, you still have to complete the academics before you can even be considered for the rank, now who gets voted in or not, is definitely a popularity contest, but since the vote moved from council to knighthood being a much bigger pool of people, its less so.

I am famous as one who bases my experience of life on the concept of evidence. So maybe what tella says is true but without evidence I dont know. However I do have this question. Jabba is an obvious troll handle here only to make rude comments and attack others. So why have the security team not dealt with this entity? Why is jabba not banned by now? The reasons could be many but those reasons could include the fact that it's a protected troll handle of someone in power. Circumstantial evidence but still evidence in favor of the accusation.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: I am famous as one who bases my experience of life on the concept of evidence. So maybe what tella says is true but without evidence I dont know. However I do have this question. Jabba is an obvious troll handle here only to make rude comments and attack others. So why have the security team not dealt with this entity? Why is jabba not banned by now? The reasons could be many but those reasons could include the fact that it's a protected troll handle of someone in power. Circumstantial evidence but still evidence in favor of the accusation.

The only reason I haven't posted all the screenshots of info is 2 parts, one it has address information in it which would be inappropriate for the public space, and two no matter what "screenshots" I put up someone will claim photoshop or question authenticity or other crap as a standard defense.

As I type this I'm on page 5 of the posts in this topic. Jabba has 2 posts, the last of which was early on page 1. One of Jabba's posts was on topic.

Here's a Zen story.

Two traveling monks reached a town where there was a young woman waiting to step out of her sedan chair. The rains had made deep puddles and she couldn’t step across without spoiling her silken robes. She stood there, looking very cross and impatient. She was scolding her attendants. They had nowhere to place the packages they held for her, so they couldn’t help her across the puddle.

The younger monk noticed the woman, said nothing and walked by. The older monk quickly picked her up and put her on his back, transported her across the water, and put her down on the other side. She didn’t thank the older monk, she just shoved him out of the way and departed.

As they continued on their way, the young monk was brooding and preoccupied. After several hours, unable to hold his silence, he spoke out. “That woman back there was very selfish and rude, but you picked her up on your back and carried her! Then she didn’t even thank you!

“I set the woman down hours ago,” the older monk replied. “Why are you still carrying her?”