My belief system

Lenny C wrote: My belief system helps with coping with my mental health issues. Without it I would not be strong enough to be able to live a so called normal life.
I’m not telling anyone to believe I’m what I believe. Everyone has a individual life and beliefs, some are christian, some Muslim and some the force. If it helps in life by what you believe, then you have the right to say this is my belief system that gets me through everyday life.

Yes
As a human beings we are born into things like location and often religion. Two of a few things we don’t have control of at birth over. As we grow and learn we can choose to stay and learn or seek. I thank you again and remind others - we can choose our own faith from where ever and even how ever. I myself, often find strength and peace in people who are no longer here and some “make believe “ characters like Icarus and Hercules Zeus Porthos Peter Pan Frodo Horton the Elephant ... the list goes on and on and on.... you get the point. Sometimes finding what we need from a story told by fire or from a book or from one another is what being human can be... glad to see you here and I hope if you ever feel the need - reach out. My inbox is always open. May the Force be with you

Lenny C wrote: If you do a bit of research the djedi of Egypt where preists who wore cloaks and help guard the pharaoh’s.

You keep asserting this but have yet to provide one reliable source to back this up. What is your source material for this claim? Is it the article that you apparently cut and pasted from the internet?

ZealotX wrote: sorry, but did you not read what I said?

Now if she was dancing with poisonous snakes or something like that then yeah... at that point the belief wouldn't be worth the danger. But being wrong about something you profess to believe in (not to know) isn't criminal or automatically harmful. And if it is more help than harm then it is a net positive.

so my logic doesn't include radical islam which is different from non-radical Islam. BOTH of them include errors, lies, deceits, etc.

...just like Judaism. (How many people did Moses kill?)

The truth is that Muslims would have to kill millions more people just to catch up to the loss of life caused intentionally by Christianity during the Crusades and Inquisitions.

But we accept those who practice Christianity within Jediism. The OP isn't claiming any such harmful narrative. He isn't claiming the Force is talking to him through the ancient Djedi, telling him that the infidels must die. So there's no need to equate the two very different things.

Every religion can claim some kind of history. However, that account of history isn't perfect and cannot be completely proven. Even in SW there is the canon and the non-canon EU. And in the canon and EU there are stories of lost religion and people like Han Solo who doubt the existence of the Force or even the Jedi. So we can talk about the Force, light sabers, whatever we want to, as long as we're not suggesting to people what they have to believe or pass off our own beliefs as truth.

Yes I read what you wrote and I disagree with it. What is harmful? How do you define it? Harmful is obviously flying a plane into a building full of people, but isn't it just as harmful to live in fear of eternal torture, or to live a life of delusion based on faith? How many of those misplaced beliefs turned into something bad? Science says that race is a social construct only, but faith says that we are black and white and Arab and Jewish. Faith says that women are inferior to men and that Christians are infidels. Christians say that Muslims are heretics and both kill each other by the thousands over the centuries to prove their point and their faith in their God. Christians call their bible infallible but that same bible endorses slavery and genocide. Who is to say that one day Christians might decide they need to return to a more pure interpretation of the bible and embrace those concepts. The Muslims have and as a result lost an unquantifiable amount of knowledge. Dont you think its better to get rid of false belief than let it fester in the darkness waiting to damage the psyche or worse yet maim and kill and enslave and let superstition reign over knowledge?

http://www.djedet.com/ladyjedi.php
Some information can be found here.
Some of you seem to be trying to debunk what I believe, but have retaliated by commenting or even asking your belief or faith. This thread was just about a belief system I have ,that helps me day to day. If it is fictional then so be it. But some believe in merlin and King Arthur, some believe in books. Some make there own religions. But saying your wrong to believe in a certain way is wrong. We all have free will and if you believe in something that harms no one then what harm can be from a there faith.
Faith is asking a certain god, power or even chi for help when needed. So believing in something that gives comfort in every day life. Who has the right to mock that persons beliefs.

Lenny C wrote: http://www.djedet.com/ladyjedi.php
Some information can be found here.
Some of you seem to be trying to debunk what I believe, but have retaliated by commenting or even asking your belief or faith. This thread was just about a belief system I have ,that helps me day to day. If it is fictional then so be it. But some believe in merlin and King Arthur, some believe in books. Some make there own religions. But saying your wrong to believe in a certain way is wrong. We all have free will and if you believe in something that harms no one then what harm can be from a there faith.
Faith is asking a certain god, power or even chi for help when needed. So believing in something that gives comfort in every day life. Who has the right to mock that persons beliefs.

yes I have seen that page and it is hardly a reliable source. It is a web hosting site that has a side text and the main entry you cite is actually annotated with an unknown source. Faith is not asking a divine entity for help, it is actually just an unreliable means to discern truth. Using faith we can makeup anything and it is unfalsifiable. I could claim that my God gave me a divine decree through faith to slaughter puppies just as easily as you making the claim about this false history. So given this disparity in belief how can we ever come to a common ground to discuss anything if we cant base our discussions on something more solid than faith and belief? You post this here as a belief system but there is no grounds to discuss it outside of a fantasy context. It does not even have any innate wisdom in which to get our teeth into. Besides that you still have not answered the question as to whether you copied and pasted this from the internet?

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: Yes I read what you wrote and I disagree with it. What is harmful? How do you define it? Harmful is obviously flying a plane into a building full of people, but isn't it just as harmful to live in fear of eternal torture, or to live a life of delusion based on faith? How many of those misplaced beliefs turned into something bad? Science says that race is a social construct only, but faith says that we are black and white and Arab and Jewish. Faith says that women are inferior to men and that Christians are infidels. Christians say that Muslims are heretics and both kill each other by the thousands over the centuries to prove their point. Christians call their bible infallible but that same bible enforces slavery and genocide. Who is to day that one day Christians might decide they need to return to a more pure interpretation of the bible and embrace those concepts. Don't you think its better to get rid of false belief than let it fester in the darkness waiting to damage the psyche or worse yet maim and kill and enslave?

Right, so if flying a plane into a building is harmful the obviously it becomes something worth opposing (in my view). And I used my mother as an example for a reason; to keep my cold hard logic in check as well as to keep a more human face on belief. Please consider "The Matrix" and how difficult it was to wake older minds. Consider that beliefs are kind of like mental programs that people accept. She's an elderly widow. She's part of the Matrix but she's not an agent and she's not about to carry out the next purge. It was her faith that helped her deal with the emotional catastrophic loss of her husband, not science, not strict adherence to the truth. Her faith made her feel better and feelings matter. Additionally, as a program you cannot assume that religion will affect each person the same way. In my experience it absolutely depends on the character of the believer, what they will put into and take out of their faith. It's just like seeing different things in the clouds or getting a different feel for a painting. There is no one way that humans must approach life or get through life's challenges. If there was, someone else would have decided that it was not Jediism.

The key in what you said is "misplaced beliefs", but "turning into something bad" betrays your fear and fear leads to the dark side. Why? Because if we react to fear by attacking that which we're afraid of, then maybe we're actually helping what we fear come to pass or at least manifest in some way. What if Lenny had such a bad experience being "corrected" by Jedi that it soured him on the whole site and all the positive people he could have interacted with? We are all, part of his belief system and we can either be harmful elements and destructive or we can be positive and supportive. What we're really afraid of is people. The ideas that some religions advance are mainly ideas that manipulate people to do something (like fork over 10% of their income). However, all religions are not equal and aren't not all designed to benefit a certain class of "chosen" people.

And come on... we are the "temple of the Jedi Order". Is there anyone that can pretend that our name doesn't come from the fictional realm? So to judge "other fiction" is simply to say that I sanction this fiction over here but not that fiction over there. The only words we're not borrowing from other religions linked to fairy tales and fantasy are the words "of" and "the".

When it comes to slavery and racism, trust me, I hear you. But we can't win by going to war with every religion. You can't simply rid someone of their beliefs through logic. I've tried. At some point thesis and antithesis must become synthesis. If a person is pulling things from history and the SW universe and synthesizing them into something positive then what's the problem? Should no one be inspired by Star Wars because its not a true story? The religions that are dangerous aren't so because they have bad research. They're dangerous because one or more humans claimed to do bad things because God told them to. THAT... is 100% of the problem. Many ancient cultures used gods and goddess to represent elements of nature but they didn't think they were real or that they were telling them to kill each other. I understand where you're coming from but I think you're seeing the problem too broadly.

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote: So given this disparity in belief how can we ever come to a common ground to discuss anything if we cant base our discussions on something more solid than faith and belief? You post this here as a belief system but there is no grounds to discuss it outside of a fantasy context. It does not even have any innate wisdom in which to get our teeth into. Besides that you still have not answered the question as to whether you copied and pasted this from the internet?

I find this so ironic because what brought us all together to this site isn't something we all know to be true and historically accurate but rather the opposite. It was something imagined, made up, something between science fiction and fantasy. And the innate wisdom doesn't necessarily come from the history or backstory of a religion but rather how the teachings represented are applied to life. But I would imagine that his wisdom is drawn from the same source that mine is (Jedi philosophy) which I think is kinda the point of the whole site. In piecing together this history, Lenny is simply adding, for his own benefit, a backstory. That's no different to me than how I think about Anakin, Luke, and Yoda. They don't have to be real to learn from them. And they certain aren't corroborated by a credible source.

Yes I copied and pasted. But I believed in what was written from an early age. So this was the simplest way of saying what I believe in. If you read in introduction forum it has a small biography for myself. Basically i was researching when I was young and was reading greek mythology and that type of books. Including ancient Egypt, but when I was in hospital I was with a lady from Egypt and we where talking about faith. I told here mine when she mentioned djedi. So since then I have researched djedi. But even if all my research is false it is still a belief system.

Kyrin Wyldstar Is there a problem with copying the easiest simplest version I could find and copying it on what I believe. Its like your mindset is hell bent on proving its false ,you mention other religions as false. So do you look at life as real is real and has to be fact or do look at life open minded.

Kyrin sorry for being a bit abrupt with you. Your belief and faith is a personal one. As is mine . but with communication we can agree we both believe in the force as do others on this website. Some people probably have there own version of there force beliefs.

I think the problem with society in modern times that there are so many paths or religions one can choose. So let’s say your Buddhism and your best friend isn’t. Is it your place to enlighten them and communicate what you believe in, or do you start to hate them because they aren’t like yourself, Remember it’s your best friend. Or do you teach and let them decide which path to go down. The force religion has many paths to go down and some are mixed religions some are based on fantasy, but like the best friend would hate or teach them.

Lenny C wrote: I think the problem with society in modern times that there are so many paths or religions one can choose. So let’s say your Buddhism and your best friend isn’t. Is it your place to enlighten them and communicate what you believe in, or do you start to hate them because they aren’t like yourself, Remember it’s your best friend. Or do you teach and let them decide which path to go down. The force religion has many paths to go down and some are mixed religions some are based on fantasy, but like the best friend would hate or teach them.

Very true. I understand his concerns because I share them to some degree when it comes to certain, historically destructive, religions. I think when you say "this is what I believe" maybe he sees that as you saying "this is what's true to me" and then he feels the need to step in and say "that's not true". I think we all have the potential of seeing it that way because it's logical. But logic is sometimes only half the story. It's important, but everything in every story doesn't have to be historically accurate in order to have value to us. Star Wars has more value to me than the bible does and yet the bible is more historically accurate.

The things that are accurate are used by 'corrupt' people in order to control others and to get others to do bad things and use the God of the Hebrews as a justification. And since the biblical God doesn't really exist he never stopped or corrected them. And so a lot of people got trapped in a lie. But that being said, do you get them out? From the outside perspective they may seem trapped to us while inside they feel free and feel like we're trapped by our "unbelief". They feel like they have the all powerful God of the universe on their side. What are we offering? Truth? Ah... but nothing to replace it with. Good and evil can manifest themselves within a single religion. It was fallen Jedi, after all, who gave rise to the Sith. Lest we forget.

So it's easy to try and take something away but if you have nothing to replace it with then you can do more harm to that person than the harm you imagine them in because of their faith. And it's really easy to find points on which we all disagree because we're not the same entity. We have different minds and experiences. The key is that we need to accept each other, differences and all, and only seek to step in if there is evidence of harm being done. And I would suggest that no one was trying to attack you but "test" your faith in an effort to protect you from it. But there's no need. It seems like a positive and empowering thing and I plan to read more of the links you posted.

may the force be with you

ZealotX wrote: Consider that beliefs are kind of like mental programs that people accept… It was her faith that helped her deal with the emotional catastrophic loss of her husband, not science, not strict adherence to the truth. Her faith made her feel better and feelings matter.

Why was it faith she relied on and not the emotional support of friends and family? I’m not saying science deals in emotions, but the human condition does and that’s where service begins. Not in some false belief system but in real human connection! That is the Force to me. The force does not exist “out there”, it’s inside us. I would rather believe we have the power to comfort and make feel better, not some ancient book or arcane belief system. Understanding the natural cycles of life and finding support in other real beings instead of inventing supernatural crap that is ultimately meaningless and serves only to waste our lives by replacing that real human connection we all require.

ZealotX wrote: The key in what you said is "misplaced beliefs", but "turning into something bad" betrays your fear and fear leads to the dark side.

I don’t believe fear leads to the dark side. I believe that superstition and faith lead to detrimentally destructive behaviors.

ZealotX wrote: What if Lenny had such a bad experience being "corrected" by Jedi that it soured him on the whole site and all the positive people he could have interacted with?

This is not my issue. He is responsible for his own thoughts, feelings and actions. I take no responsibility for them. He can choose who to interact with outside of any influence I may offer.

ZealotX wrote: And come on... we are the "temple of the Jedi Order". Is there anyone that can pretend that our name doesn't come from the fictional realm? So to judge "other fiction" is simply to say that I sanction this fiction over here but not that fiction over there.

Actually I sanction neither fictional realm. Star Wars is just a fantasy movie. What I do sanction is the relevant wisdom behind it. I don’t claim Star Wars as a belief system and I don’t think anyone should make up a revisionist spiritual history of our world and then claim that as a belief system. It does an incredible disservice to the real history of our planet and it cheapens those old world spiritualties by corrupting them into something they were never meant to be. Those ancient spiritualties are incredibly rich and full of wisdom. Why not explore them for what they were instead of trying to squeeze them into a fantastical realm of a specific science fiction construct? To treat them so badly seems like escapist ideology not a search for truth.

ZealotX wrote: At some point thesis and antithesis must become synthesis… I understand where you're coming from but I think you're seeing the problem too broadly.

I don’t necessarily agree. Truth is not about compromise. If one position is wrong then that position must relinquish its position in favor of the other. It’s not about compromise in this instance. How we view our world can be about synthesis of course so I agree there. That is a place of cooperation and human experience, but facts are facts and to rewrite history to entertain a fantasy is just wrong. I don’t think this is too broad a spectrum to quantify into a coherent argument. I love a good fantasy as much as the next person. It’s why I was drawn to Star Wars and the exploration of this site. I just don’t want to see people confuse the fantasy with the reality and that happens all too often on this site.

Lenny C wrote: Kyrin Wyldstar Is there a problem with copying the easiest simplest version I could find and copying it on what I believe. Its like your mindset is hell bent on proving its false ,you mention other religions as false. So do you look at life as real is real and has to be fact or do look at life open minded.

No there is no problem with it per say, but be careful to always site references and give credit where credit is due. That was my issue. This place is harsh on plagiarism so if you plan to further training here you must be very aware of that fact. Any quotes or reference to other material must be plainly sighted.

Your comments were not harsh so there is no need to apologize to me either. What I prefer and what I think others prefer for the most part is for you not to just lazily cut and paste some article and say this is what I believe. I want to hear what you believe in your own words. Tell us what you feel not some article. I want to know your experiences and your thoughts and your feelings and beliefs. I don't want to read an article that you find interesting, I want to know what you find interesting or relevant in your path.

Ok what I believe truth. When I was young I was all into magic. I got my first set of runes when I was 17. I became mentally unstable when I was 19 but then started to use rune magic and my belief in the force (starwars) As I progressed through the years doing magic ,I realised what I was doing wasn’t really magic at all , but a way of convincing my mind to believe in what Magic I was writing down. Up until recently, I had a revaluation So instead
of just believing in the force and using magic to turn myself into having medichlorians. I would use my magic to create my own personal force only I could use. After I did that I did some research and found articles on djedi which did similar things to me. Right Now after all I have done with magic, is
more rather a way of convincing myself, like the either real or fantasy djedi did. So that’s why I believe in djedi.

I’m not a teacher and not telling anyone to copy me.
What I did for myself is unleashed the force for myself

I’m not a teacher. But all I have done is opened my eyes and allowed myself to use if you want to call it the force.
The question I think is do you believe or not. It’s a personal journey that probably every Jedi goes through. But where all individuals and no journey is the same . Thanks for being nice about what I believe and will take on board your comments..

This is something that has taken a life form of it's own here in this Temple and has gotten worse over the years.. Kyrin, you have your beliefs, Adder His, ZealotX his, Ros hers, Carlos his, Lenny's his, I have mine as well.

“Because one believes in oneself, one doesn't try to convince others. Because one is content with oneself, one doesn't need others' approval. Because one accepts oneself, the whole world accepts him or her.”
― Lao Tzu

“Maybe each human being lives in a unique world, a private world different from those inhabited and experienced by all other humans... If reality differs from person to person, can we speak of reality singular, or shouldn't we really be talking about plural realities? And if there are plural realities, are some more true (more real) than others? What about the world of a schizophrenic? Maybe it's as real as our world. Maybe we cannot say that we are in touch with reality and he is not, but should instead say, His reality is so different from ours that he can't explain his to us, and we can't explain ours to him. The problem, then, is that if subjective worlds are experienced too differently, there occurs a breakdown in communication... and there is the real illness.”
― Philip K. Dick

“No man has the right to dictate what other men should perceive, create or produce, but all should be encouraged to reveal themselves, their perceptions and emotions, and to build confidence in the creative spirit.”
― Ansel Adams

“We sit silently and watch the world around us. This has taken a lifetime to learn. It seems only the old are able to sit next to one another and not say anything and still feel content. The young, brash and impatient, must always break the silence. It is a waste, for silence is pure. Silence is holy. It draws people together because only those who are comfortable with each other can sit without speaking. This is the great paradox.”
― Nicholas Sparks, The Notebook

Learn to respect one another based on your differences of what you believe. How in this forsaken world is anyone ever truly going to get a long if one can not respect another's beliefs. Whether or not they can research an item as detailed as you Kyrin, having the knowledge base you do, etc. Not everyone has that capacity or ability. (No offense to anyone) Teach Kyrin, stop the banter of the lesser one with knowledge, experience, etc. Yes, help explain but it needs to be at different levels based on each person, not just yours. You could quote every book in the scientific world, Philosophy and so on, you get it, but Joe Blow down the Street is on a lesser understanding of things and doesn't. Just because what you believe is Truth in your life, in someone else's life, their feelings, experiences, spirituality and understanding is at a different level or plane as you. Teaching takes patience as well as accepting not everyone looks at the greater picture in the same way.

Lenny C wrote: Kyrin Wyldstar Is there a problem with copying the easiest simplest version I could find and copying it on what I believe. Its like your mindset is hell bent on proving its false ,you mention other religions as false. So do you look at life as real is real and has to be fact or do look at life open minded.

You did not quote, or attribute, this copyrighted verbatim copy of a magazine article.

Everything about it is wrong. Academically and legally.


My belief in the page 3 girl's bosom does not give me the right to post it on totjo, and my belief in perkiness is not above criticism either.

Neaj Pa Bol wrote: This is something that has taken a life form of it's own here in this Temple and has gotten worse over the years.. Kyrin, you have your beliefs, Adder His, ZealotX his, Ros hers, Carlos his, Lenny's his, I have mine as well.

Learn to respect one another based on your differences of what you believe. How in this forsaken world is anyone ever truly going to get a long if one can not respect another's beliefs. Whether or not they can research an item as detailed as you Kyrin, having the knowledge base you do, etc. Not everyone has that capacity or ability. (No offense to anyone) Teach Kyrin, stop the banter of the lesser one with knowledge, experience, etc. Yes, help explain but it needs to be at different levels based on each person, not just yours. You could quote every book in the scientific world, Philosophy and so on, you get it, but Joe Blow down the Street is on a lesser understanding of things and doesn't. Just because what you believe is Truth in your life, in someone else's life, their feelings, experiences, spirituality and understanding is at a different level or plane as you. Teaching takes patience as well as accepting not everyone looks at the greater picture in the same way.

Not that I will really expect a reply but what has taken on a life of its own here? You never really defined what you are talking about?

I think this conversation has been very respectful and quite productive. My gift is my ability to research. If I do not provide that to the temple then I have not done my due diligence in service. There has been no banter in this conversation that I can see. There have been different positions discussed and quite eloquently I feel. Part of this conversation has been in PM and not available to the public and that furthered many things not seen here. I wish people would not be so quick to judge the content of a conversation from the outside without knowing all the facts. This conversation has been a teaching moment for anyone willing to accept it as such. To call it a disrespectful conversation is a blatant mis-characterization of its content.