Discussing ideas, not people

Well this topic should prove good resource for why things end up on people if anyone is bored enough to go through it... so maybe it is on topic

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote:

Williamkaede wrote: Trying to use 9/11 as a point and then doing nothing with it, here ? Actually I'm seeing a pattern here between you and Adder. And Arisaig - that's a whole goddamn thread in itself.

What was I supposed to do with it in your opinion? I used it to make a point and that point was made. That sometimes logical discussion can’t be had in the face of radicalism. Once again adder was the aggressor here. He came after me in the next post and put extreme words in my mouth. I replied quite reasonably to him in the next post and we went on to discuss the subject a bit. After these last few exchanged with Adder I have stopped responding to him in fact because of his tendency to jump to conclusions as in this case. It’s just not worth it to me to be engaged in things like this.

Well to me it looks like you got angry that you were denied Knighthood a couple of years ago and you've been poking members ever since while complaining about the Council and Temple over all. Then Zenchi stood up and told you off because he'd been through similar things when he was newer here and got pulled up for it, and didn't like what you were doing. Then ren jumped in on your side because he has a prior existing beef with Zenchi, and so Zenchi's Apprentice (now Knight) stood up for Zenchi being ganged up and bullied on by both you and Councillor ren. You yourself have been banned a few times from memory but that was done by Council so I wasn't really following it. So you've been given lots of chances to fit into the Temple, but seem to have troubles doing so. So I tried to not ignore you recently, and answer your questions and reply with you as honestly and fairly as I could on several topics which are important to me, but found you've just been getting worse with the course of probing turning to insulting depending on who gets frustrated first, them or you. And then when challenged about the insults you tend to cry conspiracy and put on the victim outfit. Much like you did when you were denied Knighthood. And now, it' so long running and complicated that anyone who tries to get a handle on it without the full story tends to side on the Jedi'esk position of turning the other cheek.

I personally have no beef with Kyrin, just with breaches of rules as I see them and only because I've been tasked as Mod for half a decade and more recently as Security Officer. People lie all the time on forums, and this one is no exception, even up to the highest levels. So, and otherwise, I'd just advise people to report it to the appropriate people and not engage troublemakers., but remember sometimes action takes time. The more evidence can be provided of wrongdoings the better.

But at the end of the day its in effect ren website, and what ends up happening is what he wants (if he is bothered to take a position). So if the participation rules no longer reflect the wants of ren and the Council, then I'd hope Council would change the rules and stop wasting everyone's time.

Adder wrote: Well this topic should prove good resource for why things end up on people if anyone is bored enough to go through it... so maybe it is on topic

Kyrin Wyldstar wrote:

Williamkaede wrote: Trying to use 9/11 as a point and then doing nothing with it, here ? Actually I'm seeing a pattern here between you and Adder. And Arisaig - that's a whole goddamn thread in itself.

What was I supposed to do with it in your opinion? I used it to make a point and that point was made. That sometimes logical discussion can’t be had in the face of radicalism. Once again adder was the aggressor here. He came after me in the next post and put extreme words in my mouth. I replied quite reasonably to him in the next post and we went on to discuss the subject a bit. After these last few exchanged with Adder I have stopped responding to him in fact because of his tendency to jump to conclusions as in this case. It’s just not worth it to me to be engaged in things like this.

Well to me it looks like you got angry that you were denied Knighthood a couple of years ago and you've been poking members ever since while complaining about the Council and Temple over all. Then Zenchi stood up and told you off because he'd been through similar things when he was newer here and got pulled up for it, and didn't like what you were doing. Then ren jumped in on your side because he has a prior existing beef with Zenchi, and so Zenchi's Apprentice (now Knight) stood up for Zenchi being ganged up and bullied on by both you and Councillor ren. You yourself have been banned a few times from memory but that was done by Council so I wasn't really following it. So you've been given lots of chances to fit into the Temple, but seem to have troubles doing so. So I tried to not ignore you recently, and answer your questions and reply with you as honestly and fairly as I could on several topics which are important to me, but found you've just been getting worse with the course of probing turning to insulting depending on who gets frustrated first, them or you. And then when challenged about the insults you tend to cry conspiracy and put on the victim outfit. Much like you did when you were denied Knighthood. And now, it' so long running and complicated that anyone who tries to get a handle on it without the full story tends to side on the Jedi'esk position of turning the other cheek.

I personally have no beef with Kyrin, just with breaches of rules as I see them and only because I've been tasked as Mod for half a decade and more recently as Security Officer. People lie all the time on forums, and this one is no exception, even up to the highest levels. So, and otherwise, I'd just advise people to report it to the appropriate people and not engage troublemakers., but remember sometimes action takes time. The more evidence can be provided of wrongdoings the better.

But at the end of the day its in effect ren website, and what ends up happening is what he wants (if he is bothered to take a position). So if the participation rules no longer reflect the wants of ren and the Council, then I'd hope Council would change the rules and stop wasting everyone's time.

Why do you believe it's "rens website"

Tellahane wrote:

Adder wrote: Well this topic should prove good resource for why things end up on people if anyone is bored enough to go through it... so maybe it is on topic

Why do you believe it's "rens website"

Just because I've seen when things come down to the line that is which way it always falls, usually in the face of logic, and he was the only one with full admin access for a very long time. Why is he still even an admin, I thought he was removed....
Many Bothans died to bring us this information.

Adder wrote:

Tellahane wrote:

Adder wrote: Well this topic should prove good resource for why things end up on people if anyone is bored enough to go through it... so maybe it is on topic

Why do you believe it's "rens website"

Just because I've seen when things come down to the line that is which way it always falls, usually in the face of logic, and he was the only one with full admin access for a very long time. Why is he still even an admin, I thought he was removed....
Many Bothans died to bring us this information.

Good question to ask him I just work here...

First there have always been multiple superadmins, all with the ability to make backups.
Second I have always respected council decisions.
Third I was not removed. Other things are keeping me busy and I have failed to perform my duties for some time.
Fourth Kyrin can confirm I have asked her to stay away from Zenchi and Ari.
Fifth It is the way you, Adder, unfairly treat kyrin and perform your mod duties that causes me to support her, because she is no less deserving of fairness than anyone else.
Sixth I think kyrin makes valuable contributions and like many others wish the delivery were dramatically different.
Seventh you are completely out of line, get back in it.

My delivery is something I work incredibly hard on. I'm hoping to further that through a B-Div program. Senan and i were working that as well, unfortunately all things have their season and so new avenues must be found.

Is this the way of the temple? Is the past so important? Has the temple been so horrible devided over some little rift raft? Let's not attack one another. This is a church after all is it not.

ren wrote: First there have always been multiple superadmins, all with the ability to make backups.

Who? Not what I've led to believe. Unless you mean Br John who has admitted more then once he has no IT knowledge and you'd know that does not count. There was Proteus as your assistant for awhile but you told me you didn't give him full access. And it wasn't until recently that Tellahane was able to wrestle a copy from you.

ren wrote: Second I have always respected council decisions.

Well I've seen you bully Mark Anjuu and Wescli Werdast in Council and when it came to you or them Br John always sided with you, seemingly because only you had the keys to the site!

ren wrote: Third I was not removed. Other things are keeping me busy and I have failed to perform my duties for some time.

I was talking about Kyrin being banned, not you. Since you bought it up you did chose to leave for quite awhile, at your own admission, but retained full control and access etc. But its not what I said so has little relevance.

ren wrote: Fourth Kyrin can confirm I have asked her to stay away from Zenchi and Ari.

And?

ren wrote: Fifth It is the way you, Adder, unfairly treat kyrin and perform your mod duties that causes me to support her, because she is no less deserving of fairness than anyone else.

Which mod duties are those ren? Because I was just going through the thread about Kyrin and I had pretty much stayed out of it entirely until about 2 months ago. And then all I did once was a lock a thread from getting out of hand. You seem to be grasping and reaching a bit buddy... prove it or lose it. A lot of people are sick of your BS more then anyone elses.... if your going to join in and escalate things at least put some meat on the bone.

ren wrote: Sixth I think kyrin makes valuable contributions and like many others wish the delivery were dramatically different.

I agree. I've 'thanked' her posts a few times. Relevance??

ren wrote: Seventh you are completely out of line, get back in it.

So its ok for Kyrin and you to throw muck at people but not people to throw it back at youz. Typical. Feel free to clarify otherwise I'll ignore you entirely. I don't mind losing 'Security Officer' or moderation roles one iota if that is what your suggesting, but it was raised that there was an issue between Kyrin and I, and Kyrin had her say so I think its fair I get to point my version also. Unless your referring to my comments about you, so feel free to clarify.

Who? Not what I've led to believe. Unless you mean Br John who has admitted more then once he has no IT knowledge and you'd know that does not count. There was Proteus as your assistant for awhile but you told me you didn't give him full access. And it wasn't until recently that Tellahane was able to wrestle a copy from you.

I'm an outsider looking in. A member of this church. There is others like me who are reading. We do have clergy and council. This is not the place nor the time to bring the past up. From my understanding Twllahane now has a copy. So why bring this up?

Well I've seen you bully Mark Anjuu and Wescli Werdast in Council and when it came to you or them Br John always sided with you, seemingly because only you had the keys to the site!

I Feel bad if this is the case. There is Clergy to talk to about these matters. The council does have a lot of control on what goes on. They are a team and one Council member does not have total control thus is why we have a council. We must have faith in them.

I was talking about Kyrin being banned, not you. Since you bought it up you did chose to leave for quite awhile, at your own admission, but retained full control and access etc. But its not what I said so has little relevance.

Never the less this is not the place for this. I'm not taking sides because I dont know what happened I just really want to make it known that this is not the place nor the time for fighting other Jedi.



And?

Which mod duties are those ren? Because I was just going through the thread about Kyrin and I had pretty much stayed out of it entirely until about 2 months ago. And then all I did once was a lock a thread from getting out of hand. You seem to be grasping and reaching a bit buddy... prove it or lose it. A lot of people are sick of your BS more then anyone elses.... if your going to join in and escalate things at least put some meat on the bone.

You take part blame in escalating things... Be mindful. Remember that nows not the time. A more diplomatic approach will help your cause a lot more.

I agree. I've 'thanked' her posts a few times. Relevance??

is the word relevance needed? I'm sure you have thanked her. There is no need to add anything more to that.

So its ok for Kyrin and you to throw muck at people but not people to throw it back at youz. Typical. Feel free to clarify otherwise I'll ignore you entirely. I don't mind losing 'Security Officer' or moderation roles one iota if that is what your suggesting, but it was raised that there was an issue between Kyrin and I, and Kyrin had her say so I think its fair I get to point my version also. Unless your referring to my comments about you, so feel free to clarify.

It would be a great loss to lose you mainly if the accusations you say are true. I really hope people can over look your comments and some things can get worked out more diplomatically.

Please don't take what i say as taking sides. I just know this is the wrong way to go about doing this.

May the force be with you.

This thread has gotten wildly out of wing. Can we bring it around?