What would help the Temple Be A Better Place? Suggestions please...

steamboat28 wrote: One of the problems, Brenna, is that so much goes on out of our sight that we don't really have a way of giving the examples you seek. For example, I was reading a journal entry recently where someone was denied knighthood without giving them pointers on how to fix whatever problems existed. The idea that "we'll know it when we see it" is bunk when it comes to knighthood, in my opinion, and there should at the very least be a rubric of examples to better prepare the wildly disparate teaching methods for their students.

We're in a position where we know things are happening, but we aren't sure exactly what because that transparency we've asked for doesn't exist. Hence the asking.

Rick D wrote: Everyone says that Krishnamurti is a tough assignment, and maybe it is, but but assignment as spelled out may be part of the problem, and a clearer understanding of what is being asked may make it easier.

steamboat28 wrote: One of the problems, Brenna, is that so much goes on out of our sight that we don't really have a way of giving the examples you seek. For example, I was reading a journal entry recently where someone was denied knighthood without giving them pointers on how to fix whatever problems existed. The idea that "we'll know it when we see it" is bunk when it comes to knighthood, in my opinion, and there should at the very least be a rubric of examples to better prepare the wildly disparate teaching methods for their students.

We're in a position where we know things are happening, but we aren't sure exactly what because that transparency we've asked for doesn't exist. Hence the asking.

Avalonslight wrote: Regarding IP Completion Before Membership:

I'll reiterate what I've said before. We've never required obtaining rank in order to be a member of the Temple and I don't think we should start doing so now. Like someone else said, the only thing that that stands to do is turn away legitimate potential members who just currently don't have the time to finish a rather extensive training program. And further, if this is decided upon, then there are boards which are currently restricted to members only that need to be reopened back up to guests, because that would take away a lot of conversations that generalized members take place in, and would no longer be able to. So no, I don't think this is the best course of action.

Manu wrote:

Avalonslight wrote: Regarding IP Completion Before Membership:

I'll reiterate what I've said before. We've never required obtaining rank in order to be a member of the Temple and I don't think we should start doing so now. Like someone else said, the only thing that that stands to do is turn away legitimate potential members who just currently don't have the time to finish a rather extensive training program. And further, if this is decided upon, then there are boards which are currently restricted to members only that need to be reopened back up to guests, because that would take away a lot of conversations that generalized members take place in, and would no longer be able to. So no, I don't think this is the best course of action.

For the person joining, what meaning does it hold to become an official member if they have not done the IP, which helps understand the basics of what this site is? A flashy "Jedi" title?

For TOTJO as an organization, what meaning does it hold to have virtual strangers pledging to be a Jedi and a member, if the person joining has not gone through the basics to see if they are serious about it. Are we trying to artificially inflate our numbers for some reason?

I agree with opening up the forums to Guests. There is no reason to drive away input from newcomers. Just don't let then commit to membership until they prove they actually want it, and it means something to them.

By the way, I do not consider "Initiate" a rank. It simply states you know what Jediism is about.

A long time ago the Simple Vow was required for membership. I did it back then, but I found it odd that they would request my personal information so soon. In hindsight, it seems odd how overly eager I was to pledge to being a Jedi as well. I know the Simple Vow is gone now, but the principle remains: why pledge to being a member if you haven't done the prep work?

Manu wrote:

Avalonslight wrote: Regarding IP Completion Before Membership:

I'll reiterate what I've said before. We've never required obtaining rank in order to be a member of the Temple and I don't think we should start doing so now. Like someone else said, the only thing that that stands to do is turn away legitimate potential members who just currently don't have the time to finish a rather extensive training program. And further, if this is decided upon, then there are boards which are currently restricted to members only that need to be reopened back up to guests, because that would take away a lot of conversations that generalized members take place in, and would no longer be able to. So no, I don't think this is the best course of action.

For the person joining, what meaning does it hold to become an official member if they have not done the IP, which helps understand the basics of what this site is? A flashy "Jedi" title?

For TOTJO as an organization, what meaning does it hold to have virtual strangers pledging to be a Jedi and a member, if the person joining has not gone through the basics to see if they are serious about it. Are we trying to artificially inflate our numbers for some reason?

I agree with opening up the forums to Guests. There is no reason to drive away input from newcomers. Just don't let then commit to membership until they prove they actually want it, and it means something to them.

By the way, I do not consider "Initiate" a rank. It simply states you know what Jediism is about.

A long time ago the Simple Vow was required for membership. I did it back then, but I found it odd that they would request my personal information so soon. In hindsight, it seems odd how overly eager I was to pledge to being a Jedi as well. I know the Simple Vow is gone now, but the principle remains: why pledge to being a member if you haven't done the prep work?

Edan wrote: As an addendum to what Avalon has said, the people that would be excluded from membership were the IP a requirement would include:

- Anyone who works long hours with no little time to study
- Anyone with learning difficulties who struggles with study
- The kids whose reading level is not advanced enough to do the IP (most kids do not do the IP)
- Anyone for whom English is not a first language and they are not proficient in English...

Etc. etc... these are only examples.

Many established members of this temple took a long time to do the IP, would anyone for whom it takes long keep going if they knew that they may never get there and that they will be penalised for it?

ren wrote: I think a church shouldn't force "bible study" on its members. But in totjo's case the IP isn't "doctrine study" (although maybe it ought to be), so I really do not see why members should have to go through it.

Tellahane wrote:

ren wrote: I think a church shouldn't force "bible study" on its members. But in totjo's case the IP isn't "doctrine study" (although maybe it ought to be), so I really do not see why members should have to go through it.

One could argue that the point of joining and becoming a member of the church is to study said "bible". In addition to being apart of its community of course.