What would help the Temple Be A Better Place? Suggestions please...

Bradly wrote: In all honesty and in no disrespect I believe that in a temple or church like setting that you shouldn't have leaders that believe in other religions. Such as catholic, mormon, or so on. I believe that only the truly devoted to the force should be of any status here.

So what do you mean by "status", then? If all it stands for is the purity of the holder's faith, then what makes it desirable or admirable? Why would anyone look up to someone who has "status" or want to have any themselves? And if "status" is a measure of spiritual or philosophical maturity, then what would you propose to restrict access to it for those with broader religious sensibilities? If "status" reflects how the community at large respects or values a user's input, what way do you see to control its accumulation without commanding how individual users feel about someone's contributions?

You did of course say that you are talking about positions of authority and leadership. The question, I find, applies here all the same, though. If leadership is a matter of respect among the general congregation, how would one enforce that it be restricted to those who are ideologically pure? If it is a matter of spiritual maturity, why would only the strongly devoted show signs of that? And if leadership should be granted based directly on purity of faith, then what makes it interesting or important to follow that leader?

All questions I haven't prepared for. Honestly i will get back tonthat.. but yes those who lack devotion of the force should not be teaching what its like to believe in the force. And or worship the force. When they in fact dont. They can teach the meaning and what they believe the force is. But that is only opinion. Anyone can be apart of the force and say yes I belive.in the force.. but the truth is devotion and belief go hand in hand. I'm not... as well versed in literature as most. So I'm not the best to explain. Nor am I one to lead.. give me time and I shall have answeres. Last time
It took me 2 years just to answer a question that in depth. Patience my brothers and sisters.. and though I say these things. I still love and care and trust all of you. And yes I will listen to all ideas and beliefs in the force..

I'm sorry I will be more in depth later.

May the force guide you.

If we look here:

https://www.templeofthejediorder.org/ordermembership

These are the criteria. Admittedly, we take potential members at their word when they meet them.

A belief in the Force is a criteria

How does one worship the Force?

(Before anyone else responds to Bradly, please take extra time to think carefully about your words and what you want to come from them)

It's okay Bradly. Maybe you're not familiar here with how Jediism (at least the flavor of TOTJO's Jediism) works. Jediism does not include worship of the Force or of anything. It is literally based around inclusive and syncratic philosophy and it is held up as such. This means that it is meant to compliment any other beliefs one holds outside of Jediism OR to be used as a standalone belief.

Of course, if you yourself wish to approach Jediism as you describe, you have the right to do that for yourself. However, Jediism around these parts, does not encourage any idea of casting one's own personal rules of their faith unto everyone/anyone else.

With that said, thank you for sharing your views here with us!

Bradly wrote: All questions I haven't prepared for.

Roz's query was rather open-ended. All she is asking is what thoughts if any led you to believe/feel as you do. Sounds straightforward enough to me, no need to write an entire thesis paper about it.

[Those who lack devotion of the force] can teach the meaning and what they believe the force is. But that is only opinion.

So is the teaching of fully committed devotees. The Code, in my opinion, makes no encouragement to devote oneself to the Force, let alone to worship it. Sure, maybe someone who doesn't worship it is not quite the right person to teach worshipping it but... Would that actually leave out an otherwise vital Jediist teaching?

... devotion and belief go hand in hand.

Do they?

give me time and I shall have answeres. Last time it took me 2 years just to answer a question that in depth. Patience my brothers and sisters.

... I will be more in depth later.

Oh, alright. Take your time. Maybe some of us will remember what we went on about in however many months it takes this time.

The Temple would be better If we stopped catering to babies. Threads get locked and people get banned because some of the people here feel that they have to protect the children who dont know how to choose their own levels of participation. Do you not know how to see people being mean to one another without feeling that you have to choose a battle position of your own? Do you not know how to disagree with somebody without it turning into a war? Do you not know how to say to yourself “this is not good for me and I need tl just walk away for a minute”?

Well fck, if you want to call yourself a Jedi then maybe you should learn how to do these things. Maybe it is more useful to let some of this play out and allow people the opportunity to learn from it than to just shut it down in order to protect us all from our own selves and our own feelings? And If a conversation happens to branch off into a new direction, maybe thats OK, too? The only IRL conversations that I have had which have stayed “on topic” were work conversations, where there were very specific goals and parameters and we had to stay within them in order to achieve what we had to achieve - natural discussions tend to evolve and grow and move off into new and unexpected territory. Thats just the nature of conversation. And hey, maybe it takes years YEARS for people to grow up and learn how to be cool - MAYBE thats OK, too. Maybe we should be allowed to be flawed.

I really dislike the new layout of the Temple: this “Outer Rim” and etc - I respect the intent behind it but it makes everything much MUCH more difficult to navigate, at least for me on my device. Its really a pain in the ass tbh.The only benefit that I ever saw to it was the possibility that MAYBE we could have a space that WASNT so goddam safe. A space where we could just go ahead and be real with each other. The explanation that I seem to remember was that there is now a SAFE SPACE in the Temple and there is also the “Outer Rim”. My understanding was obviously incorrect. Even the “Outer Rim” is still all “safe space”. We’re still heavily moderated and babied. I dont really think that it is good for people who arent babies to be babied. Babies should be babied. The rest of us need to grow tf up.

Jedi Masters - lol. Sure. Have to silence and censor people because you cannot communicate well enough to navigate either them nor even the rest of us through silly arguments on the internet - but you're a Jedi Master.
LOL.
OK.

Dude. You and the others were having a flame war. Adults are held responsible for their actions in this society. Sometimes that means a thread gets locked. If you did something similar in the real world, it could be seen as disturbing the peace and you end up with community service. If you can really learn how to be cool, and understand that it's ok to be flawed, maybe you don't have to make a big stink about it. Locked threads happen. Move on.

Dude. I was not having a flame war. Most weren't. One person was provoking (as has been their habit ever since they joined and after their new and enlightened return), both before the warnings and entirely unchanged by any of them afterwards. One briefly lost their temper before. Both OB and I were staying out of the alleged flame war afterwards, too. OB didn't even make a post, and I made two trying to get things back on track before also deciding to stay out of the discussion that was being derailed in the same manner once more.

Mommy Temple was supposed to teach us a lesson about adulthood, was it? Supposed by whom? And what lesson was that, then, anyway?

And what lesson for that matter are you trying to offer, exactly? Adults aren't spanked by daddy society for unruliness of each other, are they? Adults are maybe held responsible for their own children and children in their class, sometimes, but not for entirely strange ones, either, or are they? And adults are also given a fair trial where they get to express and defend their view of the situation, are they not? Yet here we are, promised a place where we can take off our masks, then punished for the grotesque grimaces others reveal in so doing, and the way you see things it's not even fair to voice a healthy dissatisfaction with that?

This is a suggestion thread, please take these discussions to PM if you want to have them.

The person who goes by the name of “forceuser” is a liar. He is pretending to be something which he is not. How do i know this? Well obviously I cannot REALLY know, especially without having ever met him. Which is why I offered to come and meet up with him. An offer which he refused. One of the lies that he has told is that he says he was a sheriff’s deputy. I happen to have a lot of first hand experience with law enforcement officers, particularly with sheriff’s deputies. I just cannot imagine any of the deputies who I have known backing down from an invitation to meet, personally, with someone who doubts that they are who they say they are. I know better. Maybe you dont but I do: I called him out for the liar that he is and my posts were deleted. So I stopped posting in the topic after that. I can understand why you might consider that a flame war but it wasnt. Not for my part.

I imagine this post will also be deleted. As i said, TOTJO caters to babies and to bllshtters. forceuser - since you refuse to meet with me how about we do the next best thing? Have a Skype conversation with someone who I name. There is a particular person whose judgment i trust and respect. If you speak to him for a while and he comes back and says that he believes that you were a soldier and a sheriff’s deputy and most especially, if he says that he believes that you are basically an honset person, i will publicly apologize to you. I will bow my head and admit to the entire community that I was being a jerk and that I mistreated you. Im pretty sure that I know what the answer is going to be but by all means, prove me wrong.

This kind of thing should be sent to a knight, not posted here. You are right, I will lock this thread if this continues.

I have said everything that I wish to say. I hope that my words will be allowed to stay so that the community will know my position but I wont come back and cause drama, either way.

With respect to all parties OB1's posts are relevant here in the sense that I believe the "Outer Rim" was broken off from the Temple Forum in order to allow a zone with less regulations, where anyone going there would be responsible for their own safety; where the consequences of what you say can come in the form of how another poster responds.

The "Outer Rim" in Star Wars is akin to the wild west. While it doesn't mean no sheriffs should exist there, it does mean that moderators shouldn't be sensitive. I go to the Outer Rim because I want to have adult conversations with other adults. And yes, I like debating. And when a good thread is locked I feel unduly punished by it as well because I didn't get a chance to participate. I think everyone deserves the opportunity to be heard on an issue or topic without trying reboot it.

So my suggestion is.... moderators should not only have rules of engagement but also understand that debate tactics can also include red herrings and ad hominem attacks and these are things that we have to learn how to handle if we're going to go out there and fight for a better world. How can we do this effectively if we aren't even allowed to spar with each other in the safety of our own website?

If a poster feels attacked and that the conversation has crossed a line they should PM the person they have a problem and try to work it out. Only after they've done that and made a good attempt at amends, should they be allowed to contact a mod who should then have a conversation with both parties, make a ruling, and only lock the thread if the parties cannot abide by the ruling. But the mods should have to say who was in the wrong and specifically what was wrong in what they said. Otherwise, no one can really learn from it and it will simply frustrate people until no one wants to start new and interesting threads. And that's not what you want. So I'm asking you please, for the greater good, please stop locking threads in the Outer Rim.

Thank you for considering this humble request.

We can organize charities, it would be cool to help attract honorable attention in the communities we serve.
As far as the website goes, it would be cool if I can find more pictures that can go successfully in my album

I like your idea about the charities. I'm not sure what to do about the albums, but believe me. This is known and I hope it get fixed

Thanks good luck with the Picture issue.
Please feel free to let me know if the charity gets off the ground. The Pacific Northwest is nicknamed the “Churchless Belt”, so there is an opportunity to fill in the spiritual vacuum in my neighborhood.

One of the things I find in ministry is the need. There is a need for much in this world but who will fill it? Then I remember it was my idea in the first place. There are many people in thei very Temple who do this very thing in the real world, SERVE THEIR LOCAL COMMUNITY. There is much to be desired on this area of our life. The local life.

That’s really cool. Other than that I got no beef.
Awesome cause