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Irrational Fear - What do you think?
11 May 2016 10:37 - 11 May 2016 10:45 #240793
by x57z12
Irrational Fear - What do you think? was created by x57z12
Irrational fear
Imagine if you will, a man being terrified of plants. He just knows they are out there to get him
just like that venus flytrap did to that cute little fly when he was five. Consequently he strives to
end all plants within a two mile radius of his residence. He knows plants are needed for life and is
fine with them existing but not anywhere near him. Go be a plant somewhere else.
Now we might tell him he is wrong. I won’t quote scientific data here but I am pretty sure the outcome
is easy to anticipate.
We might explain to him that, in order to be predatory dangerous to him, a plant would have to grow
at least a foot a second which is something of a physical impossible thing for a plant. We might explain
that, with all the freak radiation accidents in the world, there has yet to mutate a super plant capable
of hunting down humanity. We might explain that this venus flytrap at no point of his life as a human
was a threat to him seeing as he just always was too big to be eaten by it.
I honestly doubt this would deter him or free him from his fear.
So we could escalate to emotionality and tell him to suck it up, cause there are other people around
and in order for them to feel balanced those people need to see the occasional piece of breathing green
inside their concrete jungle and that he should deal with this personal problem by himself without impairing
those around him.
That is rather likely to only lead to misery.
So far the only way I have seen to be effective is guiding him to the experience that this perceived threat
is not real. I saw a documentary of psychologists helping people deal with arachnophobia by slowly
approaching increasingly threatening exemplars of the species with them. From a small spider up to a
full grown tarantula. As redundant as it seems to point it out: They were led to become accustomed to
spiders, not to become spiders.
Imagine if you will, a man being terrified of plants. He just knows they are out there to get him
just like that venus flytrap did to that cute little fly when he was five. Consequently he strives to
end all plants within a two mile radius of his residence. He knows plants are needed for life and is
fine with them existing but not anywhere near him. Go be a plant somewhere else.
Now we might tell him he is wrong. I won’t quote scientific data here but I am pretty sure the outcome
is easy to anticipate.
We might explain to him that, in order to be predatory dangerous to him, a plant would have to grow
at least a foot a second which is something of a physical impossible thing for a plant. We might explain
that, with all the freak radiation accidents in the world, there has yet to mutate a super plant capable
of hunting down humanity. We might explain that this venus flytrap at no point of his life as a human
was a threat to him seeing as he just always was too big to be eaten by it.
I honestly doubt this would deter him or free him from his fear.
So we could escalate to emotionality and tell him to suck it up, cause there are other people around
and in order for them to feel balanced those people need to see the occasional piece of breathing green
inside their concrete jungle and that he should deal with this personal problem by himself without impairing
those around him.
That is rather likely to only lead to misery.
So far the only way I have seen to be effective is guiding him to the experience that this perceived threat
is not real. I saw a documentary of psychologists helping people deal with arachnophobia by slowly
approaching increasingly threatening exemplars of the species with them. From a small spider up to a
full grown tarantula. As redundant as it seems to point it out: They were led to become accustomed to
spiders, not to become spiders.
Last edit: 11 May 2016 10:45 by x57z12. Reason: Formating.
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11 May 2016 16:16 #240845
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Replied by on topic Irrational Fear - What do you think?
As you suggest, it is generally unhelpful to point out that an irrational fear is irrational. Perceptions matter a great deal. Perceptions of social support, for example, are a powerful and reliable predictor of physical health outcomes, even though they are subjective.
As you mentioned, exposure therapy is one possible treatment. Cognitive behavioral therapy is another empirically-supported treatment; it involves helping a person change the way they think about the fear.
As you mentioned, exposure therapy is one possible treatment. Cognitive behavioral therapy is another empirically-supported treatment; it involves helping a person change the way they think about the fear.
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11 May 2016 16:49 #240849
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Replied by on topic Irrational Fear - What do you think?
Irrational fear is often the result of a psychological block. The mind has built a wall and no amount of rational argument will convince the mind to break down that wall. Facts and statistics will simply bounce off the wall.
The fear of sharks is a great example of this. Despite a mountain of evidence to the contrary, many people have built a psychological wall about sharks that will only allow them to see sharks as dangerous predators who will attack and kill them. You cannot argue facts with someone afraid of sharks.
The only way to defeat a psychological block is to find a way around the wall. This is achieved by forcing the mind to think about the subject in a way they have never thought of it before. The mind literally needs to have the epiphany and think "I've never thought of that before!"
The tricky part is finding the catalyst to trigger that epiphany. It has to be an unconventional example.
The fear of sharks is a great example of this. Despite a mountain of evidence to the contrary, many people have built a psychological wall about sharks that will only allow them to see sharks as dangerous predators who will attack and kill them. You cannot argue facts with someone afraid of sharks.
The only way to defeat a psychological block is to find a way around the wall. This is achieved by forcing the mind to think about the subject in a way they have never thought of it before. The mind literally needs to have the epiphany and think "I've never thought of that before!"
The tricky part is finding the catalyst to trigger that epiphany. It has to be an unconventional example.
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12 May 2016 15:40 #240934
by x57z12
Replied by x57z12 on topic Irrational Fear - What do you think?
I have a rather comfortable lack of fundamentalists in my life which is why I lack the insight
if this could be applicable to them too. More to the point: If it could be applicable to
homophobia, transphobia etc.
if this could be applicable to them too. More to the point: If it could be applicable to
homophobia, transphobia etc.
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- Leah Starspectre
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12 May 2016 16:02 #240940
by Leah Starspectre
More often than not, it's a fear that's based in an unwillingness to open one's mind to change (just as it was with segregation back in the day)
People who hate on LGBT groups are doing so because they've been taught that that kind of lifestyle is wrong/sinful/unnatural/etc. And that their lifestyle is the ONLY correct one. Anything different is bad/wrong/evil. They cling to their views because it's a world view that's comfortable and known because they, and everyone around them, have been taught it all their lives. It's a part of their truth.
Unfortunately, especially in the sphere of religion-based discrimination, it's a truth that's rooted in another time/place, and they haven't been able to reconcile it with modern society appropriately. It's fear of the unknown. If their holy book says that homosexuality is wrong, and they have been taught that this book is the direct work of their god, who is infallible, then what happens if homosexuality is suddenly ok? What is they are themselves gay? That would suddenly throw doubt on their supposed-to-be infallible faith. The faith that has been their source of comfort and purpose for their whole lives (and the lives of their ancestors)
It's a fear of having the spiritual rug pulled out from under you, and having no soft place to land.
I truly pity those who struggle with this. They are caught between a faith that says one thing and a society that says the opposite, but they lack the capacity or courage to examine any of it from a higher perspective.
Replied by Leah Starspectre on topic Irrational Fear - What do you think?
x57z12 wrote: I have a rather comfortable lack of fundamentalists in my life which is why I lack the insight
if this could be applicable to them too. More to the point: If it could be applicable to
homophobia, transphobia etc.
More often than not, it's a fear that's based in an unwillingness to open one's mind to change (just as it was with segregation back in the day)
People who hate on LGBT groups are doing so because they've been taught that that kind of lifestyle is wrong/sinful/unnatural/etc. And that their lifestyle is the ONLY correct one. Anything different is bad/wrong/evil. They cling to their views because it's a world view that's comfortable and known because they, and everyone around them, have been taught it all their lives. It's a part of their truth.
Unfortunately, especially in the sphere of religion-based discrimination, it's a truth that's rooted in another time/place, and they haven't been able to reconcile it with modern society appropriately. It's fear of the unknown. If their holy book says that homosexuality is wrong, and they have been taught that this book is the direct work of their god, who is infallible, then what happens if homosexuality is suddenly ok? What is they are themselves gay? That would suddenly throw doubt on their supposed-to-be infallible faith. The faith that has been their source of comfort and purpose for their whole lives (and the lives of their ancestors)
It's a fear of having the spiritual rug pulled out from under you, and having no soft place to land.
I truly pity those who struggle with this. They are caught between a faith that says one thing and a society that says the opposite, but they lack the capacity or courage to examine any of it from a higher perspective.
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12 May 2016 19:41 - 12 May 2016 19:44 #240964
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Replied by on topic Irrational Fear - What do you think?
Homophobia is a good example of a psychological block. The mind has created a wall about homosexuality that no amount of reason, logic or facts will break down. This wall could be the result of indoctrination early in life or a simple misunderstanding of what being homosexual actually means. Either way, the person with this block will experience fear in the presence of someone who they discover is homosexual.
There is no factual evidence to support the idea that someone who is gay poses any threat to anyone else. They are no more or less likely to display any specific behaviors found in all other human beings. Homosexuality is not Hypersexuality. It is no easier to identify a homosexual person than it is to identify a heterosexual or bisexual person. Most often we would never know a person's sexuality unless they chose to share it with us. Homophobia is clearly an irrational fear.
So , to get around this psychological wall that has been built, the person needs to see homosexuality in way they have never considered it.
A crude example could be this. Imagine a crowd of 500 people all dressed alike. One of these people has $1,000 in their pocket. There are no outward signs or indications as to who has the money. If you can pick the person out of the crowd, you get to keep the money. In this scenario, you have a 1/500 chance of guessing correctly with no additional information to help you.
Now, consider this same group of people, but half of them are wearing a red shirt that designates them as someone who may be carrying the money. Anyone without a red shirt is definitely not carrying the money. They are giving you an indicator that has improved your odds to 1/250 chance of guessing who has the money. Your search just became a lot easier. We would all agree that this is a good thing.
Rather than searching for the money, imagine you are searching for a romantic partner instead. Usually our search is most like the first scenario. We have very little information about potential partners other than a few limited visual cues. We spend hours or days or months trying to learn about another person in order to determine if they will be right for us. But what if everyone who was your same sexual orientation was wearing a red shirt? Now you have an additional indicator to increase your odds of finding a desirable partner. Your search became easier. This is a good thing.
When a person identifies as heterosexual or homosexual or bisexual or transsexual, they are just wearing the right colored shirt to indicate this to the rest of us so that our searches for romantic partners will be easier. By identifying, we are all doing each other a big favor in the search for romantic partners. Why would you fear someone who is making your search for love easier?
There is no factual evidence to support the idea that someone who is gay poses any threat to anyone else. They are no more or less likely to display any specific behaviors found in all other human beings. Homosexuality is not Hypersexuality. It is no easier to identify a homosexual person than it is to identify a heterosexual or bisexual person. Most often we would never know a person's sexuality unless they chose to share it with us. Homophobia is clearly an irrational fear.
So , to get around this psychological wall that has been built, the person needs to see homosexuality in way they have never considered it.
A crude example could be this. Imagine a crowd of 500 people all dressed alike. One of these people has $1,000 in their pocket. There are no outward signs or indications as to who has the money. If you can pick the person out of the crowd, you get to keep the money. In this scenario, you have a 1/500 chance of guessing correctly with no additional information to help you.
Now, consider this same group of people, but half of them are wearing a red shirt that designates them as someone who may be carrying the money. Anyone without a red shirt is definitely not carrying the money. They are giving you an indicator that has improved your odds to 1/250 chance of guessing who has the money. Your search just became a lot easier. We would all agree that this is a good thing.
Rather than searching for the money, imagine you are searching for a romantic partner instead. Usually our search is most like the first scenario. We have very little information about potential partners other than a few limited visual cues. We spend hours or days or months trying to learn about another person in order to determine if they will be right for us. But what if everyone who was your same sexual orientation was wearing a red shirt? Now you have an additional indicator to increase your odds of finding a desirable partner. Your search became easier. This is a good thing.
When a person identifies as heterosexual or homosexual or bisexual or transsexual, they are just wearing the right colored shirt to indicate this to the rest of us so that our searches for romantic partners will be easier. By identifying, we are all doing each other a big favor in the search for romantic partners. Why would you fear someone who is making your search for love easier?
Last edit: 12 May 2016 19:44 by .
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