Sithism

Jonus wrote: I have to agree with ob1shinobi Sith want power and will harm anyone which happens to be in their path to get it.

Are you a Sith?

If not, what makes you an expert?

Just asking..

OB1Shinobi wrote: heres a question - what has been said here at this point today that is an attack or is a negative remark?

Rickie wrote: I'm sorry I think this dark/light jedi/sith stuff is crapolla.

well i think this explains why i value forgiveness
lol - sorry

although i agree with the gist of rickie's comments i do see your point

if anyone needs me ill be over here prying my foot out of my mouth
:leaves

Assuming that just because someone identifies with the Sith philisophy (the real life version, not the fictional movie version because there is a difference) that they are evil is like assuming that every muslim has a bomb strapped to their chest. I'd like to think that the latter is something that we can all agree is wrong to assume.

I'd also like to think that we aren't going to judge a philosophy without learning about it first. Like when a child says that they don't like a particular food when they haven't ever tried it before. They need to try it first, then they can say if they don't like it or not. (BTW I was totally that kid, I missed out on so much good food just because I was stubborn. I want those first fifteen years back to enjoy cottage cheese! :woohoo: )

Zenchi wrote: someone always becomes offended and has to attack it? color]

I'm for one am not offended? I just don't see this as a black/white issue.

As I said, I have been almost two decades on the path.

Most of the reading I would recommend would be from many of my peers, rather than Robert Greene, etc, although I agree with Connor that "Mastery" is a great book.

For much of that time, there was no fiction for Sith.

Sith centric books are a fairly new phenomenon within the mythos.

Hell, we predated what is known as the Sith code by 3 years.

There just wasnt a lot to draw from fictionally, even the movies, 4,5,6, etc did not focus on the Sith as an Order, and only in the screenplay were they referred to as "Sith". However, there were no real exploration into any working methodology.

Much of the earliest writings and explorations are indeed heavily cliche, but we could not carry a cliche, because life, does not fit into a cliche universe.

So we adapted, and for many years did so with what we could, building, adding, etc.

Then the fiction caught up, but by that time, we had created a fairly strong base on our own.

You dont have to like it, which is a given, but really, there is a lot more to this path than anyone other than those that were in it and building on it can see and probably appreciate.

When people bring up Sith, I do not even consider a fictional archetype.

What comes to mind are people I have known, worked with, bonded with, etc over the years.

Miles, Richard,James, Rick, Ben,Crystal,etc.

Some have more colorful screen names, but I know there real ones.

These are the Sith I know.

I know its terribly disappointing for those that want us to when we cannot live up to a fictional archetype, but neither have I seen any Jedi do so either.

What makes these conversations irritating is that it has been the same one for almost two decades.

You are this...

Actually, no.

Yes, you are, and if your not this, than you cant be what you say you are.

Whatever....

Wash, rinse, repeat.

Ad nauseam....

Zenchi wrote: Ad nauseam....

I quoted Zenchi, but I dont address it to him, more to the air, and an out loud pondering about it... Where it is written "you" I mean "an indivdual"...



The thing about it is, that is (generally) new people who dont understand, and who you has to defend their views to...

The ones you have already explained it too, have long since quit asking you (as a group) and actually join your frustration....

Even if you never spoke in defense of Sith ways on TOTJO, the Jedi who understand would... Just as we would and do, about Islamists, Pagans, Atheists, or any other philosophical belief/non-belief system...

We that associate with 'Jedi" do too, maybe more so than the Sith, as we have many more role-players... And get more TV, radio, print, time with it....

Like we tell anyone who gets sick of something, 'you dont have to respond'....

I wonder if it is an 'emo-ish/like' "you dont understand me", or, really, the attention is really desired...

No judgement, I really dont care, lol, anyone can call themselves what they wish...

I just find it interesting....

The ones you have already explained it too, have long since quit asking you (as a group) and actually join your frustration....

Actually, one doesnt have to ask to show the same level of not understanding you, or apparently not listening. Also, I have not necessarily had those that have I have explained it too to quit asking.

Sharing frustration, in a way yes, and in a way, no.

Still, its hardly just from new people.

Like we tell anyone who gets sick of something, 'you dont have to respond'....

This is untrue for many things, and have to is not always the reason one does something, even if its something your sick of.

I wonder if it is an 'emo-ish/like' "you dont understand me", or, really, the attention is really desired...

Neither.

Its the simple notion that nothing ever comes of it, there is ultimately no moving forward.

It would be refreshing for the conversation to evolve in some way, but it doesnt, even for those who "quit asking", as just because they do not ask, again, does not mean things have actually moved forward.

Attention is something one gets when they respond, if they intend to be a part of the conversation.

Even if one does not understand, it would be good to have another avenue to talk about.

Any amount of research, that is, just reading posts should destroy any such notions that we, as in Jedi or Sith, fit into any movie cliche.

So then, the question is less one of whether or not there is a misunderstanding, but why, given the evidence, the thought process still exists.

Frustration comes from the fact that there is more than enough to make such a question, even to a newcomer, rather an ignorant one.

Right, there's quite a difference between engaging in a conversation because you're interested, and just wanting to be noticed or heard. Then it's no longer an intelligent conversation or discussion, but an expression for attention. In the words of a popular SNL skit...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BClVT3mPhdI

I don't know much about the modern Sith but I'm pretty sure they're not trying to emulate all aspects of the fictional characters that carried the name.

Should I get the desire to learn more about modern Sith, I'll be sure to ask one.

LTK wrote: I don't know much about the modern Sith but I'm pretty sure they're not trying to emulate all aspects of the fictional characters that carried the name.

It would be cool to be able to throw lightning.

Not even maliciously, it would just make me feel that much cooler, and I imagine, after the government got done experimenting on me, I would be the life of parties.

I would probably become a DJ with an awesome show.

Order of the Sith and Force Academy are the places I'd suggest. ToTJO use to have a Sith affiliate but I have no idea what happened to the archives.

I agree.

Can't say I never met one. I don't usually hear many good things about them per se. Some like many beliefs have their good and bad. Some had been antagonistic to other jedi and some just want to be alone and do their own thing. Can't be certain though.

It's interesting to see this old thread become active again. I didn't see it the first time around.

I'm hearing some of the advocates for Sithism here assert that their philosophy/faith does not mirror that of the Sith of the movies ... that instead it is a path toward self-improvement, and the expansion of control over one's life and environment. Fair enough. But if it's unrelated to the movie-version Sith, why call it Sithism? Why not just - well, self improvement?

Real-world Jedi, while we don't wear robes or aspire to levitate things, still use the Jedi characters of fiction as models defining our values and worldview. We believe in the Force, in the merits of service and sacrifice, and that our choices in response to life situations are bounded by an ethical code. The way the movie-based Jedi conduct themselves and look at life serves as a standard we endeavor to use in choosing our own conduct.

Real-world Sith, it seems, don't do that. It appears to me that they, in explaining their belief system, have to take pains to emphasize that they are not like the movie Sith, that they are neither murderous nor cruel nor power-mad. That is good to hear, but to my ears it makes the label of Sith pretty meaningless. Preferring the Jedi path myself, it strikes me as analogous to my saying I am a bologna sandwich but I really am not made up of flour and pork parts, and do not fit in a lunch box; I just like to call myself that.

I've become too facetious and I apologize, but the metaphor still seems to fit as far as I can tell.

Most Jedi here would really fit the Gray Jedi mold probably better than anything. Some would be similar but different to other Jedi and there were other light side orders as well as gray jedi orders that I think modern Jedi or Jediists would fit well with.

Omhu Cuspor wrote: I've become too facetious and I apologize, but the metaphor still seems to fit as far as I can tell.

The flaw in your argument is that you evaluate the Jedi worldview in shades of grey but for the sith you make it a black and white comparison. As a Sith I take from the Darkness for power just as the Jedi take from the light for peace. To me peace is a lie, balance is a lie. There is only equilibrium with my Passion. In that I take from the mythology of the Sith as examples of that pursuit just as you do with the myth of the Jedi. However how that manifests in real life is different than the absolute myth of the black and white that Star Wars depicts.

Funny but I subscribe to what I call the “ All Myth” which says pretty much all myths for all people. ( Huge label taker off - er for me) Without titles ... would we just be humans making our paths as we go along and adjusting as we live? Would balance be balance if it were found regardless of “where “ or what label we add to it ? If things are a lie and we find them else where ... are they still lies or unattainable if we find them by other means?

As I Sith I do not seek self improvement nor perfection. What I seek is wholeness,... completeness of who I already am. In this pursuit I take in both the lies and the truths and integrate them into one being.

VixensVengeance wrote: ... As a Sith I take from the Darkness for power just as the Jedi take from the light for peace. To me peace is a lie, balance is a lie. There is only equilibrium with my Passion. In that I take from the mythology of the Sith as examples of that pursuit just as you do with the myth of the Jedi. However how that manifests in real life is different than the absolute myth of the black and white that Star Wars depicts.

Thanks for that. While I am disinclined to follow your path, that does help me understand it better. I just wasn't getting it before.