government subsidies

I have no idea what benefits you are referring to Ren…

Benefits = welfare payments ?

@ wes:

i am, but mostly i am just whiling away the time til i can go pick up my son and hit the local waterpark.

i have been poor more often than i have had any sort of money. all the way from childhood to the end of grad school. i am the child of a poor cullman alabama farm boy and a 3rd world immigrant mother. i have travelled a good bit of the world, mostly to third world countries, seen a lot of things by now, and there are few things i know beyond a doubt. but one is that this kind of poor-hating, 'i got mine screw you jack' mentality will be the end of us.

most of us have studied the initiates programme. most of us then probably know that one thing that modern religions share is an adherence to the golden rule.

'do unto others as you would have them do unto you.'

so simple, a child could understand it. and so poorly implemented. and it frustrates me to see this country coming to these dark times due largely to this.

Ah… I think that the benefits referred to were financial subsidies. The reason I say that is the mention of the Lone Star card which if I remember correctly is a state income subsidy.

@ Des…
Even though I am relatively well off now, it was not always so. When I was a child, my room had a dirt floor and the only thing holding the walls of that little dilapidated house together were the roaches! Hahahahahhahha
When I say that I am well off now, it does not mean that I am some kind of millionaire! I get all my bills payed, contribute a little to some charity and have a few dollars left over to invest in my dreams of retiring. I am poor by no means, but it’s not like I never knew what it was like to go hungry either.

I’ve also seen the abuse of the current system first hand. I know someone, personally as in I talk to them on a regular basis, who feels the money he gets from the government is his by some right and that he deserves it. I tried to get them a job at my company where they would make more money than they were getting and have private healthcare, but they didn’t want to “work.”

“Why do that when Uncle Sam will pay me to hang out at home.” - the person previously mentioned.

I snapped at them, “you’re just a lazy bum… get a damn job. Have some pride.”
We’re still friends, but it makes it real hard for me to take them seriously. Not all people are like that though. And maybe I just come from a different era? I am not going to say that the person that wrote that tripe is correct or even justifiable! Mostly it was atrocious! But I also feel that the level of personal accountability and personal responsibility seems to have diminished over the last several decades.

The Lone Star Card (Texas) is for what used to be called Food Stamps. That editorial is at least about ten years old now. I know it was around in 2004. It get's changed up a bit with different authors named then passed around again.

I’ve also seen the abuse of the current system first hand. I know someone, personally as in I talk to them on a regular basis, who feels the money he gets from the government is his by some right and that he deserves it. I tried to get them a job at my company where they would make more money than they were getting and have private healthcare, but they didn’t want to “work.”

“Why do that when Uncle Sam will pay me to hang out at home.” - the person previously mentioned.

That's the problem. Our economy and standard of living is so shitty for minimum and low wage workers that being on welfare actually provides a better lifestyle than working. People taking advantage of welfare is merely a symptom of the welfare system's inefficiencies and our economic environment's unwillingness (inability?) to provide wages that ensure a decent quality of life. Trying to control how people on welfare live doesn't address the root cause of the behavior, which is that employers don't provide a survivable standard of living for unskilled or low-skilled workers.

Tax havens, it doesn't work unless you get the entire world to do it together (as is being done now) because people can still just move profits. You can stop some but it is more complicated than just 'dealing with it' - saying that is like saying 'Just find a job'...

It would be (gasp!) actual capitalism

CEO pay would be capped at some reasonable level, like 100 times the amount of the lowest paid employee

That was in the same paragraph and is a contradiction. I actually think it is a socially responsible thing to do and would probably vote for it I just thought it was funny they were mentioned together

Seriously the best thing the (most especially the US) government could do would be to stop the amount of money involved in politics. That is the most important, and most responsible, thing that I think can be done. Removing the power of big business would do more to change how policy is made and voted upon than anything else in my opinion...

The capitalist system has so far been shown (on a large - country - scale) to be the most effective method of incurring economic development and progress. But to believe that it is perfect and that people wouldn't take advantage is naive and silly as it happens in every form of economic system... what is needed is greater regulatory framework to ensure that everyone plays by the rules and the players can't so easily influence how those rules are made...

Common responsibility is put aside for personal profit...

Wescli Wardest wrote: Interesting… While I don’t think that everyone on a government subsidies plan is there because of some “mistake” they made, I do feel that voting while receiving monetary benefits from the ones you’re voting on to represent you is a conflict of interest. Also, why shouldn’t people have to work for what they receive if they are able to work? I do not think that is an unreasonable request.

How is voting for people that give you benefits any different from voting for someone who promises to lower your taxes in terms of a conflict of interest? Maybe I just didn't get what you mean by 'conflict of interest'

Concur that it is a contradiction, master. But it is the mark of a finely tuned mind that can conceptualize contradictory elements and attempt to synthesize them into a workable solution. Also I was just typing off the cuff for a bit. An actual working paper would be a bit more well researched.

That and consistency is the hobgloblin of small minds. I think the editor of the national enquirer said that, so it must be true.

Akkarin wrote: The capitalist system has so far been shown (on a large - country - scale) to be the most effective method of incurring economic [strike]development and progress[/strike] debt.

Fixed that for ya

As for the original post, I think it's the most moronic statement I've heard for a long time. I know because I used to be a moron and I said things like that. The underlying assumption she makes is that people on welfare can get a job and they choose not to so they should be punished with inadequate food/shelter and have their rights taken away like no voting, no kids, no time, etc. The lowest point was when she suggested these people be used as slaves.

But you know what's really interesting? Many Americans think like this.

That is because the general populace has simplified the problem to a few basic ideas....

Just as comedians do for laughs, the only one who really had a clue, was Carlin...

I see good ideas, and bad ideas, and when I run for president, you can all vote for me, and we can have a special room wing in the White House for us all to fix the US's issues...

First, after I seal the borders for 6 months...

Not from visitors, or stuff like that, necessarily, but, it is like the concentric circles of protection of myself, then expanding outward...

First, I take care of myself, so I can take care of my family, so I can take care of my extended family, so Ican take care of my friends, so I can take care of the friends of my friends, etc...

First, I take care of my country, then I will worry about sending help elsewhere... Spending money, elsewhere, how I look to other countries...

lol...