Abortion Debate Between Matt Dillahunty and Clinton Wilcox

  • Storge
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02 Apr 2014 04:22 #143303 by Storge
I'v never been known as a minstrel of words. So yeah I ain't delicate. However, name calling won't win me over very quickly. I doubt anyone ever said "wow, they called me stupid, so that must mean my point of view is entirely irrelevant. I'm so glad I was demeaned today, yippee!"

Obviously I don't know everything, no one does. What I have noticed in my short time in this life is that people who dislike something in others usually exhibit that trait quite often in themselves. I dislike pushy loudmouths, so it stands to reason that I am the pushiest loudmouth of most. Be careful what you despise in others.

Also, like racism, sexism, religion and bigotry, the solution to these problems will never be solved if only the eloquent and so called sinless are allowed to speak. They are only delicate because we fear so much to touch them; therefore the thought is that they are our ugly underbelly and should remain hidden. Nothing gets solved, however, by sweeping things under the carpet.

If my taxes and health insurance money are going to be used to fund it, then they had also better change the pre op education and the post op care for these women. Because the one thing a lot of pro-choicers and pro-lifers have in common is that they wouldn't choose abortion, and that
sends the message to the woman that does as "you chose wrong, because I would never do it." That scenario sounds like the ripening conditions of PTSD.

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  • Luthien
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02 Apr 2014 05:55 #143309 by Luthien
I'd have to agree that not very many would want to choose an abortion because they never thought they would have to choose. Many make mistakes and are forced to make that decision, anyway. I wasn't born with a uterus, but I wouldn't want to take away someone's right to bodily autonomy simply because they were born with one. Who am I to make any decisions for another person and their bodily functions? You bring up a good point about tax and health insurance money. Because of the healtcare act, we're ultimately paying for something we may not agree with. This can also be said about social security, medicaid, and any welfare program in general. The topic of abortion is not only delicate, but also multi-faceted; so many sides to the issue that covering just one part of it still leaves a ton of other issues related to it out in the open.

I just want to say that I should've searched this topic in the forum so that I didn't bring it up again if it's already been discussed. Regardless, the responses so far have been interesting as well. When I said that it was thought provoking, I meant that it brought up points that I hadn't thought of before. If I had more time, I'd have a longer response.

Thank you for responding, though. It's been an issue that I've been thinking a lot about, lately, and having another perspective helps.

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02 Apr 2014 07:30 - 02 Apr 2014 07:31 #143314 by Brenna

Storge wrote: I'v never been known as a minstrel of words. So yeah I ain't delicate. However, name calling won't win me over very quickly. I doubt anyone ever said "wow, they called me stupid, so that must mean my point of view is entirely irrelevant. I'm so glad I was demeaned today, yippee!"

Obviously I don't know everything, no one does. What I have noticed in my short time in this life is that people who dislike something in others usually exhibit that trait quite often in themselves. I dislike pushy loudmouths, so it stands to reason that I am the pushiest loudmouth of most. Be careful what you despise in others.

Also, like racism, sexism, religion and bigotry, the solution to these problems will never be solved if only the eloquent and so called sinless are allowed to speak. They are only delicate because we fear so much to touch them; therefore the thought is that they are our ugly underbelly and should remain hidden. Nothing gets solved, however, by sweeping things under the carpet.

If my taxes and health insurance money are going to be used to fund it, then they had also better change the pre op education and the post op care for these women. Because the one thing a lot of pro-choicers and pro-lifers have in common is that they wouldn't choose abortion, and that
sends the message to the woman that does as "you chose wrong, because I would never do it." That scenario sounds like the ripening conditions of PTSD.


As unmoved by the sarcasm as I am, your point at the end is a good one, and valid.

The reality is that no one "wants" an abortion. It's generally something they feel they have no other option on. Making abortion illegal does one thing, increases the rates of women resorting to dangerous and desperate methods of abortion. Better quality Pre and post care and education is extremely important. If you dig through the massive amount of research on this issue, two things stand out starkly. Education is essential, and the majority of women seeking abortions are also already mothers, usually with multiple children. And often facing economical issues.

The reality of this issue is a lot more complicated than "women should just take responsibility for it" or "just have it and then give it away" lets or even get into the stats on the number of children already in foster care or awaiting adoption.

And I never said that any other woman doing it is wrong, only that I would not chose it. I work with an organization that supports familys that have children with congenital heart defects. I've watched women abort and women carry on and deal with the reality of having the child anyway. And there are women in both camps who regret whatever decision they made. The experiences I have had working with both sides makes me unwilling to do it myself. But I would never advise anyone one way or another. Nor judge them for it.


Delicate and sinless? I'm going to assume that you're not talking about me.



Walking, stumbling on these shadowfeet

Part of the seduction of most religions is the idea that if you just say the right things and believe really hard, your salvation will be at hand.

With Jediism. No one is coming to save you. You have to get off your ass and do it yourself - Me
Last edit: 02 Apr 2014 07:31 by Brenna.
The following user(s) said Thank You: Luthien

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02 Apr 2014 08:59 #143318 by Brenna
Ive been thinking quite a bit about this, the reality is that my stance of "I wouldnt do it" is not so much a commentary on those who do, as it is a result of my own bias. Im educated, white and from an affluent background. Im fortunate enough to be in a position where if I did fall pregnant unexpectedly I have both the means and the support systems to keep a child regardless of the circumstances. I am extremely lucky, I would not have to make the tough decisions that many do.

If I were not in that position, I dont know how my opinion might be different.



Walking, stumbling on these shadowfeet

Part of the seduction of most religions is the idea that if you just say the right things and believe really hard, your salvation will be at hand.

With Jediism. No one is coming to save you. You have to get off your ass and do it yourself - Me

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