Changes to the Membership Application....

Just a clarification. A seven day waiting period to cut down on the number of impulse-applications. We want the ones that apply to want it bad enough to wait a week before applying for membership. In the mean time, thy may operate as guests without any other hindrance.

No issues with that at all. If we find that i causes an unforseen problem, I'm sure we can change it back.

My question: This is a done deal, right? Discussed in Council and being implimented?

Cool. Fine by me.

just responding to the church convo - ive been to a fair number of churches in the southern U.S. and some of them are very strict about the criteria for influence that seamboat mentioned i.e.salvation baptism and membership

with the larger churches especially youll usually see a definite criteria which establishes who's who, so to speak

ive also been to churches that were pretty much run by a single pastor (and the pastors family usually)

in those cases the biggest criteria for membership and influence is often simple participation and commitment

being somewhat intelligent is a pretty big plus and obviously the pastor is not going to be too interested in your opinion if you invite him to join your "human sacrafice to ba'al" facebook group he will probably not be especially open to your suggestions about the direction the church should take as an entity

but the gist is that of you are there to help the church in its functions, and you really are serious about being an activeember, and you stick around and demonstrate long term reliability, you will be considered a part of the church family and even tbough the pastor will have ultimate say in final decisions, your input will be considered fairy

again, this is in the smaller churches, ive been a part of a few and ive always liked them

so called "mega churches"are different

but i admit that i would not set foot in one unless the Force itself directly lead me there, as i feel the level of anonymity, the well estabkished heirarchy, the sprt of "entertainment factor" of performance style sermons, and the large amounts of money involved are, cumulatively, overwhelmingly corruptive influences on spirituality

because of this view,my personal experience with them is pretty low, my understanding of how they work has come more from talking to others and from social media

Jestor wrote:

I think it's a cultural difference.. I went to a few churches as a kid/teenager (one baptist, three Church of England), and there was never any restriction on those who weren't 'members'.

Can I ask you to what you mean then?

YOu cannot celebrate the Eucharist, nor be confirmed/baptized...

Other than a ceremony, where a non-,member would of course be welcome as a guest, or a feast, where a non-member might be invited by someone, seldom do non-members attend any of the ceremonies, unless it concerns family...

I am seriously trying to come up with something...

I'm thinking churches work differently over here...

I was christened at a church I think my parents went to maybe twice...

The two churches that I went to predominantly as a teenager (both Church of England), everyone (excluding little kids who would go for their own 'meeting') participated in communion.. The only difference between those who were confirmed and those who weren't was that those who were confirmed (who were about 6 in number in a congregation of 50 or more) drank from a goblet, everyone else had these weird little glasses, but everyone had the same wine. I've been to a few churches for other occasions where all people there were invited to participate in communion.

I never got confirmed myself because I became a Satanist before the time I would probably have considered confirmation.

I accompanied someone recently to church (a church they had never been to before) about being christened, having never been so and wanting to change that. The reverend told them that the only precondition was a meeting with them, and a sincere faith in God. No 'membership' or continuous participation in church required.

Jestor wrote:

Aqua wrote: How can it change again, if it is the application is an ever changing document

Because 'permeance' is a matter of perspective...

You have never seen it change, therefore a change to you is something out of the norm... For me, I have changed it 3-4 times...

I change my socks every day, becasue they become wore out... I change my vehicles evry 10-15 years, becasue they get wore out...

'Nothing is permanent except change"..

so many ways to read your posts

So many ways to read everything.... :lol:...

How do I say.. it should be out of the norm for me. To say that this is new for me is well said indeed. I find it interesting, I do not see the big picture because I am quite new to the temple, you do have seen, you know what it is different, master Jestor,

The only difference between me and you at this specific subject is that I am not affected by the past. Gives me an small edge to see maybe different things more fresh than you do, It gives me also a inscrutable problems to form a well thought opinion on this and even unawareness about the full effects of this change. Gives you a edge.
I like to talk about those kinds of things, because of the complete different opinions.

,,Nothing is permanent, except change'' - - > So according to it, change is permanent?
So according to it, change is permanent? - - > ,,Permanent change will not change.''
,,Permanent change will not change.'' - - > So the change itself will be the same?
I wonder.. if the concept of change, does not change..
Then it would it mean that change has a limitation? Why not beside it own concept?

Cabur Senaar wrote: My question: This is a done deal, right? Discussed in Council and being implimented?

Yes...

This is just talking about it, so that others are aware, and able to answer questions, instead of "ask Jestor", more folks know the 'whys' or 'why nots' and such...

If the thread slows by the months end, I will revive it again, as I shut off applications for a few days to make changes...

Aqua wrote: ,,Nothing is permanent, except change'' - - > So according to it, change is permanent?
So according to it, change is permanent? - - > ,,Permanent change will not change.''
,,Permanent change will not change.'' - - > So the change itself will be the same?
I wonder.. if the concept of change, does not change..
Then it would it mean that change has a limitation? Why not beside it own concept?

Are you unfamiliar with that expression?

Everything changes, evloves, more on, forward... Everything (that I can come up with... But, I would welcome a challenge to it, lol)... It is a matter of standing back far enough to see it...

"Change" changes too... Slower, faster, not too much, big leaps...

But, it constantly moves...

And constantly...

The only difference between me and you at this specific subject is that I am not affected by the past. Gives me an small edge to see maybe different things more fresh than you do, It gives me also a inscrutable problems to form a well thought opinion on this and even unawareness about the full effects of this change. Gives you a edge.
I like to talk about those kinds of things, because of the complete different opinions.

You are really not affected by the future in this either, lol...

Only those who fill out an application, and those who process it will be...

~

There clearly is a massive cultural difference. In the UK, even though schools try fairly hard to indoctrinate children into their religion of choice, people simply aren't religious, and don't know where the church building is or whether it is still being used for religious purposes or not. I could deny god's existence at the entrance and still be welcomed inside.

ren wrote: I could deny god's existence at the entrance and still be welcomed inside.

This is probably a discussion for another place, but perhaps churches accepting everyone (even those that don't believe), is better than shutting them out.

Edan wrote: This is probably a discussion for another place, but perhaps churches accepting everyone (even those that don't believe), is better than shutting them out.

None of the churches here "shut people out." Everyone's welcome to the help they need. But membership is different, and must be applied for carefully.

The thing about membership in a church (especially in the US) is that it basically makes you a shareholder in a non-profit.

My apologies, there probably were better words than 'shutting them out'... that wasn't quite what I meant.