Jedi Philosophy

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09 Apr 2020 19:50 #350950 by Carlos.Martinez3
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic Jedi Philosophy

TrentonR wrote: Why is it that if the Jedi believe in justice but they also say that killers and rapists shouldn’t be killed? You guys really need to reassess your philosophy before I consider joining the order. May the force be with you all and God bless America and the Jedi Order.



Welcome to the Temple.
Thank you for the question as well.
In this world you will always be rules, lines, sides and ideas that conflict or even better , work. Some parallel some don’t. With codes and Koans and Maxims out there all from different places and people and cultures and ways- it’s up to US - the WE- to each person - the how - to do it. How we see the day - that’s up and given to each of us. Each Modern day Jeddist can pick and choose the “HOW” of our own choices - RARELY some one else’s.
One of the best but most difficult things for me to understand was- how can I make my choices and ideas when it seems like some days in my circle- I’m the only one and actually - do and live with them. I’m a very” home-ey “ type of person by choice. Can I function when no one else can or everybody else can - can I still learn when I find others don’t or do better than me? Do the things I notice now- keep or hold me?
Big questions
Real questions for real people
Welcome to the Temple again. You ARE a breath of fresh air.
May the Force continue to be with you.

Pastor of Temple of the Jedi Order
pastor@templeofthejediorder.org
Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova

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09 Apr 2020 20:25 #350953 by
Replied by on topic Jedi Philosophy
I have no problem with it. There are traumas that people do to others such as rape, throwing acid on peoples faces, etc that should not be excused. And what about the victims justice? The victim must live in hell or end it themselves while their attacker lives a happy life...just goes on their merry way. I don’t think so. People are to concerned over the rights of the perpetrator and not the victim.

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09 Apr 2020 20:43 #350955 by rugadd
Replied by rugadd on topic Jedi Philosophy
So George Stinny's story didn't bother you at all?

rugadd
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10 Apr 2020 01:55 - 10 Apr 2020 02:06 #350972 by Alethea Thompson
Replied by Alethea Thompson on topic Jedi Philosophy
*scratching head*

"God Bless America"

That's a common CHRISTIAN phrase. I'm sorry if I find some sort of irony of someone who appears to be Christian saying the day before Good Friday- and just before the weekend of Christ's Resurrection celebration, that he believes rapists and killers should be killed.

Yes, yes, I am fully aware that Christ did not come to change the law (Matthew 5:17). However, there are many other factors to be considered. There were allowances afforded to even murderers- if they could get to a sanctuary city, for example. Or if they repented. Even in the story of Christ saving a young adulterous woman from being stoned, we see that it is not our place to condemn- but instead, Christ directed to forgive when someone asks for forgiveness. And if one does not, God shall not forgive them their own trespasses (Matthew 6:15).

While Capital Punishment may seem like it is the solid punishment, it isn't actually informed by Christian values- for if it were anyone who repented of their sins before they reached their final day, they would be spared the death penalty and even released from prison. Instead, it is based on a blind justice system that is, by its very nature, untrusting of the sincerity of a criminal.

Where, in its theory, I have no problems with Capital Punishment because not all value systems are created equal within a melting pot and it would satisfy most problems; the truth is that it is not executed in practice the way it should be done in theory. But as a Christian, I find that Capital Punishment lacks the same value system God imposes within the OT and Christ teaches into the NT.

So I hope that you'll excuse my laughter, TrentonR, that you would come in with a Christian phrase and in the same post say that you cannot support a group that would allow Rapists and Murders to live- just mere hours from the time that we are called to remember Christ's sacrifice upon the Cross, and mere days before his Resurrection which served as proof that he was indeed the Messiah.

Gather at the River,
Setanaoko Oceana
Last edit: 10 Apr 2020 02:06 by Alethea Thompson.
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10 Apr 2020 02:31 #350974 by JamesSand
Replied by JamesSand on topic Jedi Philosophy
No idea if the OP will ever return or went through the whole sign up process just to troll, anyway-

I'll break it down, for the OP, and any other passers by...

Why is it that if the Jedi believe in justice but they also say that killers and rapists shouldn’t be killed?

Justice and your moral outrage are not the same thing :)


You guys really need to reassess your philosophy before I consider joining the order.

I don't know about the other Jedi in the world, but I don't need to do jack :) and unless I missed a memo, neither Jedi, nor TotJO are going out of their way to recruit - in short, Jog on :)

May the force be with you all and God bless America and the Jedi Order.

assalamu alaykum.
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10 Apr 2020 13:59 #350983 by
Replied by on topic Jedi Philosophy

Alethea Thompson wrote: *scratching head*

"God Bless America"

That's a common CHRISTIAN phrase. I'm sorry if I find some sort of irony of someone who appears to be Christian saying the day before Good Friday- and just before the weekend of Christ's Resurrection celebration, that he believes rapists and killers should be killed.

Yes, yes, I am fully aware that Christ did not come to change the law (Matthew 5:17). However, there are many other factors to be considered. There were allowances afforded to even murderers- if they could get to a sanctuary city, for example. Or if they repented. Even in the story of Christ saving a young adulterous woman from being stoned, we see that it is not our place to condemn- but instead, Christ directed to forgive when someone asks for forgiveness. And if one does not, God shall not forgive them their own trespasses (Matthew 6:15).

While Capital Punishment may seem like it is the solid punishment, it isn't actually informed by Christian values- for if it were anyone who repented of their sins before they reached their final day, they would be spared the death penalty and even released from prison. Instead, it is based on a blind justice system that is, by its very nature, untrusting of the sincerity of a criminal.

Where, in its theory, I have no problems with Capital Punishment because not all value systems are created equal within a melting pot and it would satisfy most problems; the truth is that it is not executed in practice the way it should be done in theory. But as a Christian, I find that Capital Punishment lacks the same value system God imposes within the OT and Christ teaches into the NT.

So I hope that you'll excuse my laughter, TrentonR, that you would come in with a Christian phrase and in the same post say that you cannot support a group that would allow Rapists and Murders to live- just mere hours from the time that we are called to remember Christ's sacrifice upon the Cross, and mere days before his Resurrection which served as proof that he was indeed the Messiah.


I’m not Christian. I believe people must be held responsible for their actions. Religion must never be factored into making laws. If that were the case people to do whatever they wanted to others because their “sin” was “paid for” by Jesus. I don’t believe in any Religion. And I certainly don’t want that to diminish justice I could get.

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10 Apr 2020 14:19 #350984 by
Replied by on topic Jedi Philosophy

JamesSand wrote: No idea if the OP will ever return or went through the whole sign up process just to troll, anyway-

I'll break it down, for the OP, and any other passers by...

Why is it that if the Jedi believe in justice but they also say that killers and rapists shouldn’t be killed?

Justice and your moral outrage are not the same thing :)


You guys really need to reassess your philosophy before I consider joining the order.

I don't know about the other Jedi in the world, but I don't need to do jack :) and unless I missed a memo, neither Jedi, nor TotJO are going out of their way to recruit - in short, Jog on :)

May the force be with you all and God bless America and the Jedi Order.

assalamu alaykum.


So, you believe justice and “your moral outrage are not the same thing”? You know nothing about that person. What if s/she was raped? Or a loved one was murdered? Do you get to decide what justice is for a rapist or murderer? What if a sexual assault ruined the life of the victim? Would a slap on the wrist and a “poor you” to the victim be justice because ‘you’ happen think it’s just “moral outrage”?

I had an attempted sexually assault when I was 18 by a person who was my best friend for years. He wanted to get me pregnant to “lock me in” before I went to college. This happened over 20 years ago and my feelings about it have not changed. I would rather die than be forced to have a kid. Luckily I had a broken plastic fork that I was prepared to defend myself with lethal force. Luckily, he broke off the attempted assault when I fought. So don’t you dare tell me that what I see as justice is just “moral outrage”. Abusers would love to live in a world where the damage of victims is belittled and they get a slap on the wrist no matter the hell the victims endure. This attitude of protecting rapists and murders is a deliberate slap in the face to victims.

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10 Apr 2020 14:34 #350985 by
Replied by on topic Jedi Philosophy

rugadd wrote: So George Stinny's story didn't bother you at all?


#1 I don’t take anything seriously from Wikipedia

#2 The fact that most rape victims don’t get justice doesn’t bother you? Or the people whose loved one was murdered? The person who killed them gets to keep on drawing breath and living happily with the knowledge the society so more fit to protect them then the victim. That’s ok and desirable to you?

It reminds me of how In high school the bullies don’t get in trouble for assaulting people but if the victim retaliates they are the ones who get in trouble. That sends a clear message to the bullies doesn’t it?

It still amazes me how so many “Jedi” are more concerned with protecting violent offenders than victims.

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10 Apr 2020 14:34 #350986 by Carlos.Martinez3
Replied by Carlos.Martinez3 on topic Jedi Philosophy
We can get this topic full but not this one - hmm
https://www.templeofthejediorder.org/forum/world-events/123720-what-s-that-sound#350857



Can we function while others function as well.
Who says - where doses It say “we as a modern day Jedi Must all be the same.
I wish some days we could just preach that and others understood, rather than argue all day.

Application and moral are for people. Jedi character is one of the hardest things for me and others to create and immulate. Why is that ? Because it’s usually up to that ONE person.

We are just people. The special part in us is that we choose to be different. That’s all. How is up to us.
My hope is we ALL figure how to act, react and create more than tear down but build.

OUR chosen philosophy is what you have chosen. Think about that. Our side is what you eventually choose so....
yea some times - we look human. . . But there’s more !!!!
Keep your eyes open and your hearts as well - or not.
May the Force continue to be with y’all where y’all seek it and where ya don’t .

Pastor of Temple of the Jedi Order
pastor@templeofthejediorder.org
Build, not tear down.
Nosce te ipsum / Cerca trova

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10 Apr 2020 14:36 #350987 by Kohadre
Replied by Kohadre on topic Jedi Philosophy

Claiomh Solais wrote:

Alethea Thompson wrote: *scratching head*

"God Bless America"

That's a common CHRISTIAN phrase. I'm sorry if I find some sort of irony of someone who appears to be Christian saying the day before Good Friday- and just before the weekend of Christ's Resurrection celebration, that he believes rapists and killers should be killed.

Yes, yes, I am fully aware that Christ did not come to change the law (Matthew 5:17). However, there are many other factors to be considered. There were allowances afforded to even murderers- if they could get to a sanctuary city, for example. Or if they repented. Even in the story of Christ saving a young adulterous woman from being stoned, we see that it is not our place to condemn- but instead, Christ directed to forgive when someone asks for forgiveness. And if one does not, God shall not forgive them their own trespasses (Matthew 6:15).

While Capital Punishment may seem like it is the solid punishment, it isn't actually informed by Christian values- for if it were anyone who repented of their sins before they reached their final day, they would be spared the death penalty and even released from prison. Instead, it is based on a blind justice system that is, by its very nature, untrusting of the sincerity of a criminal.

Where, in its theory, I have no problems with Capital Punishment because not all value systems are created equal within a melting pot and it would satisfy most problems; the truth is that it is not executed in practice the way it should be done in theory. But as a Christian, I find that Capital Punishment lacks the same value system God imposes within the OT and Christ teaches into the NT.

So I hope that you'll excuse my laughter, TrentonR, that you would come in with a Christian phrase and in the same post say that you cannot support a group that would allow Rapists and Murders to live- just mere hours from the time that we are called to remember Christ's sacrifice upon the Cross, and mere days before his Resurrection which served as proof that he was indeed the Messiah.


I’m not Christian. I believe people must be held responsible for their actions. Religion must never be factored into making laws. If that were the case people to do whatever they wanted to others because their “sin” was “paid for” by Jesus. I don’t believe in any Religion. And I certainly don’t want that to diminish justice I could get.


Theism =/= Religion. I had a former hunters-ed instructor who while openly Athiest, would often say how he "had religion" through a foundation of hunting / outdoor safety protocols. Religion is in practice a deeply held set of ideals, beliefs, and practices which create a foundation for daily activity.

I am not Christian either, but can still appreciate the irony of the post originally quoted based on my understanding of Christian teachings.

To also build off James mention at the end of his post; I have found thus far that Christians (seem to) have a mindset of God being in service to them, whereas Muslims (seem to) have a mindset of being in service to God. I have encountered many Christians, and many Muslims as well; while I do not share either of their beliefs, I would rather interact with Muslims on any given occasion.

Much of our legal system, and societal structure in the U.S is built off a corrupted Christian ideology. The bill of rights, declaration of independence, and other pivotal documents were composed through influence of that ideology.

Due to that corruption, we have had to amend those documents multiple times in our nations history (thus far), for things such as abolishing slavery; granting women the right to vote - which had been advocated for and requested since colonial times, illegalizing alcohol, legalizing alcohol, right to a speedy & public trial, etc.

There are already an embarrassing and sobering number of individuals who have after execution, been found not guilty of the crimes charged as a result of additional evidence. There are even more who have served lifetimes in prison as a result of corrupted trials and hidden evidence.

We need to take more consideration in the application of justice, not less.

So long and thanks for all the fish
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