The light of islam (ugh everyone is a critic)

I think that is the whole point. The comments I was making were what I was taught and not what I believe. The Star Wars analogy was very interesting. I even use a more literal analogy with that one about physical sight and blindness. Sight is a great thing until it is allowed to rule the other senses.

As far as the concept of religion being discussed here, no I am not someone who believes the the Earth was created in a week. The moral of Joseph's story was indeed along the lines of what you said. The moral of Job's story was patience and strength. Job lost everything and didn't curse God, at least for the most part. He finally did at the end and was chastised for it. I think the point of that story was enduring to the end. Many people have achieved this realization. When you lose everything, it can be built up again because all the stuff lost was just material. It's the spiritual things that are irreplaceable.

Well analogies are only useful insofar as they make sense, but it sounds like your talking about the act of passing judgement on something?

I am talking about looking at all aspects. Doesn't matter what the subject is. football, religion, death penalties, beer, whatever.

I think its fair to say a forum with religious subforums should be able to accomodate discussion about individual aspects of religions? Surely we dont need a disclaimer after every post indicating that religions are dangerous for your health, seek medical advice before reading!

I agree with you. However, this particular thread is "what is Islam exactly". If you want to be exact, you have to look at the good as well as the bad. Otherwise the thread should be "the good things about Islam".

Leena wrote: I think that is the whole point. The comments I was making were what I was taught and not what I believe. The Star Wars analogy was very interesting. I even use a more literal analogy with that one about physical sight and blindness. Sight is a great thing until it is allowed to rule the other senses.

As far as the concept of religion being discussed here, no I am not someone who believes the the Earth was created in a week. The moral of Joseph's story was indeed along the lines of what you said. The moral of Job's story was patience and strength. Job lost everything and didn't curse God, at least for the most part. He finally did at the end and was chastised for it. I think the point of that story was enduring to the end. Many people have achieved this realization. When you lose everything, it can be built up again because all the stuff lost was just material. It's the spiritual things that are irreplaceable.

I said Job didn't I? I meant Joseph :pinch: . Job is a great example as well lol.
And yes I thought over that analogy for a hour at work today even lol (waking up at 4am then visiting this site to check messages and mindlessly working will let your mind wander.) The point I was trying to make is that true wisdom is only learned by looking beyond the words. It was a way to discuss that preachers don't really see things beyond the literal and call themselves wise and also a comment to the whole "picking and choosing thing" and how things should not be picked but read deeper beyond to ask "why did they say this in the bible and why that" most of the "don't be gay" and "kill and pillage" stuff comes from the time it was produced and that was the mind set and culture of the time. To follow that is like reading of rome and dressing up as a centuarian riding a horse. lol these sort of comments are also just to inject some new ideas into the topic more so to help people think (mainly the guests who come by and others who would benefit from it.)

ren wrote: I agree with you. However, this particular thread is "what is Islam exactly". If you want to be exact, you have to look at the good as well as the bad. Otherwise the thread should be "the good things about Islam".

Good point, this is going to be a long thread if the OP keeps to the title :side:

Adder wrote:

ren wrote: I agree with you. However, this particular thread is "what is Islam exactly". If you want to be exact, you have to look at the good as well as the bad. Otherwise the thread should be "the good things about Islam".

Good point, this is going to be a long thread if the OP keeps to the title :side:

There you go.

You know you guys spend way too much time reading titles rather than what is actually in it :pinch:

So are we talking about the light of Islam or about the fact that everyone's a critic? LOL. JK. For the record, titles are important and help the reader stay on topic. They let me know where off topic might be. Of course, seeing what's in this thread suggests that many topics are being discussed and therefore changing it to The Light of Islam would change the direction of the discussion completely.

So what I find great about Islam is that the prayers are absolutely beautiful. I love to sing the surahs of the Qur'an and to hear them sung. I love that there is no mediator to talk directly to God. I love the camaraderie of the community. Everyone is treated like family from the beginning. There's always someone willing to help teach you something. That's where a lot of the light of Islam is in my opinion.

Just one point of feedback. Several times you have said something to the effect of "You guys believe..." For example, many people here wouldn't take the Bible, Torah, or Qur'an literally. I'm sure there are several who do, but I don't know that except that I've seen some of the Christian topics. Looking at some of the topics of discussion that have come up, I know for sure that each person has a differing point of view. We may agree on some, even many things, yet I have yet to meet two people who agree on all things.

Regarding the earlier question about the idea of Hell.. the descriptions used are the closest metaphors that the authors could achieve for what it really is, a separation from God or Allah (or whichever god or gods you choose). The idea is that even though the Diety loves you, the pain caused by the separation from said Deity would cause total grief and anguish as if being burned by fire.

As to the comments about the correlation between the Old and New Testaments: a counter question. Why do the stories HAVE to be true? Would the story being made up diminish any of the value gained from the moral of it? I tend to see the whole of religious text as parables, a set of stories to give us a guide to live by so to speak.

Aren't we tolerant of others religions here? No one is forcing their beliefs on anyone else, we still like the Atheists. Religion has NEVER been the reason for any evil done on this earth. Greed has. Humans have. Powerful men want to be even more powerful men. Every war fought in history can be boiled down to greed, even if it was advertised as something else.

I'll stand by John Lennon. Pretty smart guy for a hippie. Imagine there's no countries, it isn't hard to do. Nothing to kill or die for... And no religion too.

I don't get how you could like Islam and the Quran, but not Muhammad, considering that he wrote the Quran and that it was based off of his teachings and revelations he received from God. Just a little bit from your original post that I don't quite get. Also if he did write anything later in life that contradict the Quran (which I don't understand since the Quran wasn't formally created until about 20 years after the death of Muhammad) he would be contradicting his own writings? Please explain this all.

Coryduran wrote: I don't get how you could like Islam and the Quran, but not Muhammad, considering that he wrote the Quran and that it was based off of his teachings and revelations he received from God. Just a little bit from your original post that I don't quite get. Also if he did write anything later in life that contradict the Quran (which I don't understand since the Quran wasn't formally created until about 20 years after the death of Muhammad) he would be contradicting his own writings? Please explain this all.

Simple he was a hypocrit he had writings afterwards. Now unless you studied Islam as a devotee and looked at what Muhammad did after he became a imam you would instantly understand. Now until you read the Quran and studied Muhammad's life you would understand I will not add fuel to the attacks against Islam tho because Muhammad is simply a slave of god and I can not like him all day long for it only says to respect Muhammad as a profit and love and obey only god. If I say any negative things I as a Muslim see others as non Muslims will ignorantly add it as fuel that they won't truly understand what Islam is and only looks for reasons to hate. So my reasoning is only my reasoning and will be confessed to only those who study and understand Islam as a true devotee