Why Not...

This goes along with the question I asked last week - "Why Christianity". This time, it's for those that at least know something about Christianity-

Why didn't you choose to become a Christian? What things do you find in your beliefs that you feel are missing in Christianity. Or is there something in particular that turns you off entirely.

I'm looking for answers that don't include "The Bible has too many contradictions". That one's already on the list and overdone.

Ah thats simple , Yeshua said that if i found out the truth that it would set me free , and it did , but when i shared that bliss with other christians they started making it more difficult for me and started with all these does and donts so i gave up on being a christian and became me again. I have looked at a lot of faiths in the years and now i am a Jedi i know that i dont have to be a christian to uphold Yeshua's teachings ...

I was a Christian for 20+ years of my life. Granted most of that was childhood so I don't know if that counts haha.

I believe in the Abrahamic God, I believe in Jesus. I like many of the Christian teachings. I love the stories. But the title just didn't...fit me. Any more than if I dyed my hair pink. What I do now, I was told doesn't exist/isn't real when I was growing up. My experiences just don't match with how I was taught. The rituals and practices just don't really jive with me. God was so....impersonal. It was like he was this bloodless statue in the sky I was suppose to talk at and believe that He'd fix all my problems. (Experience is a little different now but ya know ) It's not so much that I'm NOT Christian, as I'm MORE shamanic person like thing.... o-O there's gotta be a more efficient way to say that hahahahaha.

"To each fox his hare". There's something for everyone and I'm glad to have found mine

I manifested what I consider a peak experience of it in my early 20's, and so used that as a reference to explore synergies with other paths. I don't think there is much if anything which is un-Christian about my path but its not useful for me at the moment to use its symbols and methods... to develop a closer relationship with the God/Gods/Goddess/Force/self/universe etc.

It's a religion based on fear. I live and breathe courage. I have never found a home in Christianity.

I was a christian for 22 years and was training to become a minister. I'd prayed for 22 years. Nothing. There was literally not a single thing there that couldn't be explained by something else. Almost every christian idea is borrowed from somewhere else, and I hated that the only reason people around me were doing good things was to avoid some eternal punishment. Then I realized what a dickbag the god of the bible was, regardless of whether he was old or new testament. Why would I want to serve anyone like that?

I came to the conclusion, after years of soul-searching, that god had never existed in the first place. Humans will deceive themselves in all kinds of ways just to make it through the day, and other folks could lie to themselves if they wanted, but I was going forward with my eyes open. I would face reality, whatever it was, and deal with what was really there.

I don't get to choose what to believe. I believe anything and everything I can and nothing I cannot. I could of course at my own discretion join the club at any moment, by pretending that I believed what I know I really don't. In fact, were I to live in some kind of Christian theocracy I probably would in public pretend to be part of the flock, if that saved my skin, but whether I am actually convinced of the proposition is not a matter of my so choosing. So far nothing has convinced me, and thus I am not a Christian, because the moment I begin lying to myself is the moment I give up on everything it can stand for.

I was raised catholic. Our church had a rather pessimistic priest, droning on and on about how we are all sinners, how damnation awaits and the only way out is ‘to eat humble pie’ (quotation marks because it is an idiom I’ve never heard before suggested to me by dict.cc).
I resented the idea. I did nothing wrong to deserve anything like this and the whole thing just felt unfair to me. That was me at age 10. Nowadays I still strongly resent the idea of guilt forwarded from previous generations, also I understand the priest was a rather specific kind and quite poorly conveying the idea of salvation through Christ.

Even still I feel the catholic church is not for me first and foremost since I oppose the strict set of rules. I don’t believe a god to be so limited they would bother telling me to visit a stack of bricks in their honor on a specific day – what do they care when I honor them as long as I do?
Also I agree with snowy. Doing something good to avoid punishment or to earn some kind of afterlife bonus feels like hypocrisy to me because both motivations are entirely selfish. That’s what I like specifically about the force: It doesn’t care how I act, that doesn’t even affect my afterlife in any way. Being good is as much as a choice as being a d***. I chose to be nice because I like people around me to be happy and it makes me happy too.

I think most posts will be "why not Christianity anymore?", lol...

The reasons are many and long...

To remain brief, as I can, lol, I was told 'God is the father'...

And, if my real dad acted like the God of the Catholic's, and he did at times, as he was trained in a Catholic seminary, I would rebel against him as well...

No parent acts like that to his children... Not a loving parent, anyway...

There are plenty of examples of his love, but, the example (to just pick one) of him asking for the death of whats-his-names son, or (ok, a second, lol) him cleansing the world with a great flood, are not very 'parent-y' things, and I would have run away from a home like that...

Thus, I did...

I am glad I was exposed to it, as it gave me a foundation for understanding faith, something those (like my wife) do not have, and thus have an unattached feeling to the world much of their lives...

This, 'not a good parent' thing was probably reason number one...

So, I floundered for a few years, calling myself a 'Jedi', as a quasi-joke, but, yet not really... As a teenager, lol... Although I did get confirmed, and first communion...

As I watch the evolution of human thought, for me, my personal observation (looks at Gisteron, lol.. ..) is that we have evolved to this point....

We (humans) used to have many gods, generally in the shape of things we know (animals or humans) or in combinations of things we know (animals AND humans) and as we evolved, we went from the 'god' of every single living thing, to 'gods' over genres (Poseidon, Mars, and Zeus as the all-father), finally to just God (Jesus' dad) and our level is to remove the 'name' and understand that while "right now it is inexpiable and [magic]", it will not always be so... As science will explain it, but then, science will show us the next level of [magic] and we will be lost in wonder, again, lol...

Just as we are striving to remove 'vicious' from the description of (lets say a shark) as they are not really vicious, yet, when we didnt understand them, they were descibed that way... We are striving (I feel, glancing at Gisteron, lol) that we are working toward the removal of human characteristics from non-humans.... (Despite my recent post on the "Killer Wales".... lol)

huh, not as short as I'd hoped, lol... Ah well...

I believe that Jesus was a genuine person and an amazing teacher. He showed others how to be loving and compassionate, even to our enemies. His selfless acts and treatment of all people equally put him ahead of his time. His capacity for forgiveness was admirable. He inspired a movement that became a religion.

I believe the problems began for me when this amazing person was deified. Seeing Jesus as God actually takes away from the man he actually was. It makes it seem as though all of the good ideas he had to offer to humanity came from God speaking through him. Almost as if no mere mortal is allowed to be this good, so he must be God.

All of the miracle hocus pocus does the same. I don't need Jesus to perform magic tricks to convince me that he was wise. It cheapens the message, in my opinion, and I feel like we have outgrown the need to be mesmerized. I prefer to see Jesus as similar to the modern Dalai Lama. No need for tricks, just share the wisdom.

In short, I am not a Christian because I do not believe in salvation through Christ and I do not accept much of the Bible. Instead, I incorporate his teachings into my life and strive to be a good person as he did.

My reason is merely the words by humans that tell me what some omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent creator of mine is thinking. I don't believe that if god exists that an intermediary is necessary. The myths of the bible tell me what the men who wrote the books thought. God is supposed to be omniscient, so, I would infer that god knew everything that was going to happen when it did. He knew that Adam and Eve would betray his command, he knew that Lucifer would rebel, he knew that he would sacrifice himself for his own forgiveness of all of mankind's sins to make way for humans to come back to him. He created us "broken" and commands us to fix ourselves or else face eternal damnation. Yet, he loves us? So much that he would torment us forever over something that could be fixed within the blink of an eye? I think that if such a god exists, I don't wish to know him or have anything to do with him. But, I also think that, if I could believe that god is real, he would be smiling and enjoying the fact that we are becoming more advanced over time and using the faculties he built within our brains to do so. To create something and command one's creations to not use the tools you provided is ... well, I don't have the words for how confounding that is for me.

Jesus, on the other hand, I think, may have been a real person who had a divine cosmic experience. I think he may have used that experience to attempt to bring his fellow human beings together as one and love one another in the sincerest possible way. I don't believe in salvation through any other person, but through my own efforts.

Yeshua said that if i found out the truth that it would set me free , and it did , but when i shared that bliss with other christians they started making it more difficult for me and started with all these does and donts so i gave up on being a christian and became me again.

You shouldn't judge Christianity by the people who supposedly follow it. "Christian" just means "Christ-like". If those people don't understand that there is nothing you have to do, then they don't understand Christ.

It's a religion based on fear.

If that's what you think, then your understanding of the Word is poor (or at least, someone lied to you). Christianity is based in Love. I could get into great detail, but I think that would be more of a personal discussion. PM me if you wish.

He created us "broken" and commands us to fix ourselves or else face eternal damnation.

Not true. We were made perfect, with free will, which includes the decision not to follow him. He did not make this world (or us) screwed up the way we are. WE did that. We are not set out to "fix" ourselves, but only to trust in Christ that he is the only one that can.

Streen wrote:

Yeshua said that if i found out the truth that it would set me free , and it did , but when i shared that bliss with other christians they started making it more difficult for me and started with all these does and donts so i gave up on being a christian and became me again.

You shouldn't judge Christianity by the people who supposedly follow it. "Christian" just means "Christ-like". If those people don't understand that there is nothing you have to do, then they don't understand Christ.

It's a religion based on fear.

If that's what you think, then your understanding of the Word is poor (or at least, someone lied to you). Christianity is based in Love. I could get into great detail, but I think that would be more of a personal discussion. PM me if you wish.

He created us "broken" and commands us to fix ourselves or else face eternal damnation.

Not true. We were made perfect, with free will, which includes the decision not to follow him. He did not make this world (or us) screwed up the way we are. WE did that. We are not set out to "fix" ourselves, but only to trust in Christ that he is the only one that can.

Like i said i am set free

to me it seems obvious that the bible is not literally true - like, duh

i mean there are historically accurate pieces in it, sure

it is in part a historical document, but there was never a ship that really did hold two of every single animal on earth, thats just silly

there may have been some ship somewhere near some place that was underwater, and there might even have been some animals on it i dont know, but it wasnt the literal origin of the rainbow and all the rest with lions and tigers and bears

to my way of thinking, the components of religious belief which are TRUE are the parts which result in personal and collective transformation - the CHANGE is real, the psychological growth into a more balanced and perceptive human being is real

but the various literary devices which are used to direct this process are almost superfluous; theyre tools rather than facts; ideas that channel perspective and perception so that the human BEING can mature

not historical FACTS in the same way as which of the founding fathers were present at the drafting of the Constitution
(many of them were DEISTS btw - the misconception that christian people created america to be a wholly christian nation is false. there were christians who assumed such but there were quite a few others who did not want america to be in any way religiously biased: look up founding "fathers deist" and "jefferson bible" to start)

when people confuse this, they change something that is powerful and -- well, "divine", into something dogmatic and tyrannical: from hallowed to hollow

next, it seems obvious to me that if god created me, and he knew everything in the world, and also everything about me, and he loved me, then he would know that im not able to believe what christians seem to believe, and that would be cool

he would actually say "you did great son, im proud of you" without me ever having to accept some rumor about some guy who could raise the dead, and died, and is still alive, but gone

watching us, but not here with us

well he is here but he isnt here; hes here with us but he isnt like, RIGHT HERE

see what i mean?

if i give a kid a box of crayons, i dont expect him to paint the sistine chapel; i expect him to come up with some awkward $h!x that MAYBE looks good under a magnet on the refrigerator, and i will be proud of him that he did it

i dont expect him to come up with a something that is way beyond the tools that i gave to him

when i read the bible, jesus said that his followers are supposed to be performing miracles the way that he did

no one is

people pretend to
and people point to things that are "miraculous" and say "thats jesus" or "thats god" but it seems to me that those sorts of things happen equally to all people of all faiths, and so either christians are wrong about these miracles being from god, or at least wrong about what god is and how god works

jesus also told his disciples that his return would happen in their life times - which it obviously didnt

its been 2000 years, and every minute of that time there have been untold multitudes expecting the sky to part and a trumpet to sound ANY MINUTE

for 2000 years!

there's also the fact that so many of the people in the church are just plain wrong about so much, generally speaking

and so many of them are so incredibly judgemental, and opinionated, and downright hostile, that i cant help but to think "whatever theyre doing, it isnt good, and i dont want it screwing me up the way its screwing them up"

and then theres this http://www.christianitytoday.com/gleanings/2015/june/creflo-dollars-board-apologizes-for-plane-fundraising-video.html

thats one in an endless line of confidence artists scamming the shirts off of gullible audiences all over the world, and i cant help but think "if you people knew what the heck you were doing, you would have this shot in check by now"

but we're still arguing about dinosaur bones and bathrooms and its fine if you cant keep up, go at whatever pace you need to, but let go of the idea that you have any business telling anyone else they're going the wrong way

Christianity is not based on fear of god, but on fear of death. The whole purpose of heaven is so that there is something after, for those too scared to transcend and become as one with the Force.

I felt the presence of the divine and it scared me.

It wasn't until later that I discovered the divine can be found everywhere.

I didn't go back for political reasons.

I won't go back now because I am a Jedi of this Temple and that is all the label I need right now as far as religion is concerned.

Streen wrote:

He created us "broken" and commands us to fix ourselves or else face eternal damnation.

Not true. We were made perfect, with free will, which includes the decision not to follow him. He did not make this world (or us) screwed up the way we are. WE did that. We are not set out to "fix" ourselves, but only to trust in Christ that he is the only one that can.

Though we "messed up" in the beginning, for an eternal divine being to cast out his "perfect" creation from some awesome garden, and as an omniscient being, he knew it would happen and could have precluded it from the get-go. So, he did create us flawed, or broken, or ill (whichever you choose) and, in order to rejoin him, we have to make ourselves better. A piece of fruit? Really? Why did he make it to begin with? Maybe god was the one who tempted us to eat of the forbidden tree.

Like most creation myths, there are many things wrong with it and doesn't explain the world very well anymore.

One can try to explain "God's" will all they want, or call "him" out, but divinity by definition is beyond our ability to understand so when you do, remember you can not possible be right about it.

I for one have no interest in partaking in arguments that can't be fathomed adequately, let alone won. If I am going to shake my fist at anyone it will be myself.

Thankfully, I'm mostly over that too.

Luthien wrote: Like most creation myths, there are many things wrong with it and doesn't explain the world very well anymore.

im not sure anyone really knows what it means anymore

ive heard that its likely a fusion of at least two other stories which were likely integrated as a result of a cultural/religious syncretism that happened before written language, but i dont claim to know

i recall someone here at the temple mentioning that as well, but i wouldnt be able to say a name

personally i think its a story of mans evolutionary leap to higher order cognition - like we learned to compare things to each other and make abstract value judgements, and thats where the "knowledge of good and evil" originated and also when we lost our "innocence" and saw our "nakedness"

Prof. J Peterson likes to mention that human eyesight evolved to a great extent to detect the ripening of fruit and the movement of snakes

and i mean he has got the research of evolutionary biologists as a foundation for the position so whether there is a relationship between that and the story or not, it is definitely interesting

but anyway this is a great example of where i think that a literal interpretation misses the point

but lol who am i? just some dude on the internets

Indeed. I don't know the original intention, nor do I care anymore about it. The bible is a collection of books written by men with imperfect understanding. I don't put too much stock in the reality of myths, but, rather, the lessons behind them. Whether or not god exists is beyond any understanding I can muster. It's all speculation for me until it can be proven true, historical accuracy/inaccuracy aside.