Amen - and its possible "origin"?

Why do we say "amen"? What does it really mean? Does anyone really know?
What do you think it means and why do you say it?

Here is a wonderful read that I just read that basically explains what I discovered the history and purpose of the word to be -

Basically put, I feel that "Amen" in all of its glory and variations is simply the honoring of history’s first monotheist, the Pharaoh Akhenaten - Amen - hotep.

We was the original "sun god" and his symbol is the "sun disk" with fourteen hands coming out of it like "rays" of the sun. He is the first person in history - written and modern history to implement a "monotheistic" religion.

Is it possible that this word remains an honoring to him?
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The Origin of Amen[/center]

Amen is perhaps a word like no other. It is certainly used hundreds of millions of times daily to conclude prayer or supplication to omnipotent beings, and as a way to acknowledge the spiritual presence of something, or some “other” than one’s self. But from where did “amen” originate? And from what history or tradition?

Etymologically, the word’s root is Hebrew in origin, with its use spreading to eventually encompass Christianity and Islam. Amen is found in the Bible, of course, but also in the Quran and in Hinduism. Amen is a shared response to liturgical rites and a means of affirming sacred scripture. Beyond Judaism, in the fading mists of early history, the word can be traced to ancient Egypt and a particular line of pharaohs, that of the Amun or Amen –hotep lineage.

While there is absolutely no historical proof for the patriarch Abraham, there is plenty of evidence for the existence of four rulers of the Amen –hotep line. The last of these, Amen –hotep IV is today known as the heretic king, the most ancient ruler to whom history can attribute another origin, that of monotheistic belief. Amen –hotep IV, or Akhenaten as he is known, founded his new religion at the expense of the Egyptian neteru, the many faces of the trinity Amen – Ra – Horus, all of whom were banned under his short, ten-year rule, their images defaced and their temples destroyed.

During an indeterminate period of the Amen –hotep lineage the first Biblical character with a historically verifiable presence joined the Egyptian court. The biblical Joseph was perhaps a contemporary of Akhenaten (Amen –hotep IV) or of his forbears. The influences of monotheistic thought on this Semitic addition to the court of the Amen –hoteps could well have carried forward as an early form of proto-Judaism.

Though religious leaders will scoff at the coincidence of the relationship of the word amen to its royal forbear, it is virtually certain that much of the Hebrew language, as well as Aramaic, was derived from earlier Egyptian. In fact, at the time of Moses, a distinct Hebrew language had only recently come into existence. Moses, the Prince of Egypt, likely spoke Egyptian which made him unintelligible to the fledgling Hebrew population. In the Bible God suggests that Aaron speak for Moses, not because he stuttered, as biased scholars would have it, but because Moses needed an interpreter to speak to his Hebrew flock.

The very usage today of the word “amen” is an interesting conundrum. Is amen a holy affirmation, or is it simply a part of our collective memory of history’s first monotheist, the Pharaoh Akhenaten?

Amen.
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Christians
Christians say either 'Ahh-men' or 'Ay-men'.

The 'Ahh-men' pronunciation tends to be a bit more formal and used in liturgy, choral music, etc. An example can be heard in the closing part of Handel's Messiah 'Worthy is the Lamb'2. The Ahh-men in the final chorus is repeated dozens of times, runs to six pages in a typical choral score, and usually takes around 3 minutes 40 seconds to sing.

The 'Ay-men' pronunciation is often associated with evangelical Christians and gospel singing. Unlike Handel's Messiah, the gospel chorus 'Amen' has only five words, all the same (Ay----men, Ay----men, Ay----men, Ay-men, Ay--men.) yet can take much longer to perform as it is repeated over and over again, bringing the congregation into harmony.

Jews
For Jews, Amen is also an acronym for El Melech Ne'eman, which means "Mighty, Faithful King".

Muslims
Muslims use Amen (Amin or Ameen) in the same way as Christians and Jews, even though the word does not appear in the Qur'an. Muslims say it after reciting Surah al-Fatihah, after completing their prayers, at the end of letters, etc.

Buddhists and Hindus
Many Buddhists and Hindus also use Amen at the end of prayers and as concurrence in the same way as the other religions.

But where did it all begin?

Pagans
From old Egyptian texts we can see that people regarded the Sun as the emblem of the Creator. They called the Sun Ra, and all other gods and goddesses were forms of the Creator. One of these gods was Amen; a secret, hidden and mysterious god named variously Amen, Amon, Amun, Ammon and Amounra. For the first eleven dynasties (c. 3000-1987 B.C.) Amen was just a minor god, but by the 17th dynasty (c. 1500 B.C.) he had been elevated to be the national god of southern Egypt. This position gave Amen the attributes and characteristics of the most ancient gods, and his name became Amen-Ra, that is, a supreme form of God the Creator. By the 18th Dynasty (1539-1295 B.C.) a college had been established to study Amen-Ra and as a focal point for worship.

The Jews settled in Egypt for around 400 years4 from 1847 B.C. and during this sojourn there is no doubt they would have been fully exposed to the worship of Amen-Ra. By the time of their exodus from Egypt in 1447 B.C., Amen would certainly be in their language even if it was not their god. It would be a word that had associations with reverence and majesty. This is not difficult to understand. People still talk about Moses, Jesus, Mohammed and Buddha, and often use those names completely out of context as expletives. Amen was seen as a powerful god and the name continued, out of context, as an exclamation or salutation; a classic example of language evolution. From the Jews, the word was adopted by Christians, Muslims and others.

So Amen was originally the name of a Pagan god, who was considered a form of God the Creator. But he was certainly not considered God, or Christ. Interestingly, most Pagans today tend not to use the word, preferring instead to say "So mote it be", an old Anglo-Saxon term. Perhaps they see the word Amen in the Bible and the Tanakh and don't want to be associated with Christianity or the like. Indeed, in the Bible3 we see Jesus Christ referred to as "The Amen". Christ is God's Amen to all that he has spoken. Thereby the name used for an old Egyptian god is replaced by the same name used for Christ.

Like many other words used in religion, (or art, mathematics, medicine, etc) it's easy to believe that our ancestors saw no point in creating new vocabulary when existing and familar words could be recycled. Yet some people are vehemently protective of things and believe Amen is a Biblical word which is also found in the Tanakh and in Islam, and happens to sound like the name of a Pagan god. Others believe it is an Islamic word that can also be found in the Bible and Tanakh. And so on. The whole issue is hotly debated and any Pagan link denied by many. Who knows how many accidental or deliberate mistranslations have crept in over the centuries.

Those who believe that God is the Great Mathematician will no doubt point to the numeric value of Amen:

"Finally, we may note that the word Amen occurs not infrequently in early Christian inscriptions, and that it was often introduced into anathemas and gnostic spells. Moreover, as the Greek letters which form Amen according to their numerical values total 99 (alpha=1, mu=40, epsilon=8, nu=50), this number often appears in inscriptions, especially of Egyptian origin, and a sort of magical efficacy seems to have been attributed to its symbol."

(Catholic Encyclopedia Vol. 1; 1907)

Nowhere in the Bible, the Tanakh or the Qur'an can we find words to suggest one can be redeemed by merely uttering a magic word.

Whether Amen is magic, rooted in a Pagan deity, originally a Christian word, a Muslim word, a Jewish word, or anything else, the question is the same: So what? When Christians, Jews and Muslims say Amen, they do not invoke any god or any power just by saying that word or indeed any other word. Amen does not even make other words more sincere. But Amen, like all the other language we use, helps us to focus on what we mean in our hearts.
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http://www.nairaland.com/283217/pagan-origin-word-amen

Aummmmmmmmmmmmmmmm en



I think perhaps humming is a tangible and simple way of experiencing vibration and so some concept of harmony, resonance etc. Kid's with Autism can sometimes do a lot of monotonal humming. Perhaps various mystics used this to reach some trance and so it got carried along as a spiritual/religious practise.

Humming and toning is very powerful.

Etymologically, the word’s root is Hebrew in origin, with its use spreading to eventually encompass Christianity and Islam. Amen is found in the Bible, of course, but also in the Quran and in Hinduism. Amen is a shared response to liturgical rites and a means of affirming sacred scripture. Beyond Judaism, in the fading mists of early history, the word can be traced to ancient Egypt and a particular line of pharaohs, that of the Amun or Amen –hotep lineage.

baru wrote: Why do we say "amen"? What does it really mean? Does anyone really know?
What do you think it means and why do you say it?

It means "So be it," "May it be," or ""truly." It's an affirmation of faith in what was said before; to paraphrase Romans 4:17, it's the faith to call things that aren't as though they were, and watch them become so.

Basically put, I feel that "Amen" in all of its glory and variations is simply the honoring of history’s first monotheist, the Pharaoh Akhenaten - Amen - hotep.

Akhenaten - "Effective for Aten, where Aten = jtn, the Sun disk, which this ruler (who reigned during the Eighteenth Dynasty and) was instrumental in making the religious focus of his Kingdom.

Amenhotep - "Amun is satisfied", where Amun = jmn, a Theban deity of some small regard, later fused with Ra to create Amun-Ra, until such time as Amenhotep IV changed his name and religion to bring Aten into the forefront.

To assume that the semitic word "amen" is to praise Akenaten for being monotheistic (which isn't technically accurate) is without any linguistic support that I have seen. Most texts point to "amen" in Abrahamic faiths being derivative of the Semitic root a-m-n, which carries a meaning of "truth" or "confidence."

This claim is further supported by its lack of ties to the "monotheistic" (probably more accurately henotheistic) nature of Akenaten when one realizes that most biblical scholars agree that the shift from the monolatry of the early faith to the proper monotheism of the current one came not during the era of Egyptian slavery, but instead the Babylonian captivity, something widely attributed to the immersion in the Zoroastrian faith the Hebrews found in Babylon.

We was the original "sun god" and his symbol is the "sun disk" with fourteen hands coming out of it like "rays" of the sun. He is the first person in history - written and modern history to implement a "monotheistic" religion.

The original sun god was the sun. Animism is evidenced as one of, if not the, primary stages in religious evolution the world over. The anthropomorphic stage, where personalities and human traits are assigned to otherwise non-sentient and inanimate objects of worship, comes later. Thus, it stands to reason that the sun predated any Sun Gods as the center of solar worship for nearly every culture on the planet. Of which Egypt is arguably not the first.

Amen is perhaps a word like no other.

Except for آمين, and Tolkien's násië (which may not count as a constructed language), or sooth, or vraiment or any of the other words that mean exactly the same thing and are used in much the same way.

Etymologically, the word’s root is Hebrew in origin, with its use spreading to eventually encompass Christianity and Islam.

Then why did this article spend so long discussing Egypt?

Though religious leaders will scoff at the coincidence of the relationship of the word amen to its royal forbear, it is virtually certain that much of the Hebrew language, as well as Aramaic, was derived from earlier Egyptian.

Scholar David Steinberg suggests instead that the origins of Hebrew are shared with those of other Semitic languages. Yossi Garfinkel called the oldest inscription resembling Hebrew "proto-Canaanite". In point of fact, though both Semitic and Egyptian languages are members of the Afro-Asiatic language family, they are in distinct lingual subdivisions, with languages like Hebrew and Arabic tracing their lineages back to the same place as Akkadian, rather than Egyptian. This is evidenced, at least in my mind, in that Arabic and Hebrew share their exonym of Egypt (transliteratred as Mitzráyim in the latter and Miṣr in the former), where we know the endonym of ancient Egypt was km.t, "the Black [Land]" (one possibility for the origin of the English words "chemistry" and "alchemy"). If we look to the same color words in Hebrew, we find that the modern Hebrew word for the color is שָׁחֹר (forgive me if that's incorrect; I'm terrible with writing Hebrew) which is phonologically distinct.

For Jews, Amen is also an acronym for El Melech Ne'eman, which means "Mighty, Faithful King".

Technically, I think this is a backronym, as the word existed first, and then mystics took hold of it to make it "mean something."

Muslims use Amen (Amin or Ameen) in the same way as Christians and Jews, even though the word does not appear in the Qur'an. Muslims say it after reciting Surah al-Fatihah, after completing their prayers, at the end of letters, etc.

Among Muslims, it is apparently also used for the same intent in non-religious situations.

When Christians, Jews and Muslims say Amen, they do not invoke any god or any power just by saying that word or indeed any other word.

That's actually also untrue if you subscribe to the theory that our will shapes our world. It's a word of affirmation, of faith, and of telling the universe to shift itself in such a way as these things come to pass. It is not an impotent word at all. It's just misunderstood, obviously, and very misused.

steamboat28 wrote:

baru wrote: Why do we say "amen"? What does it really mean? Does anyone really know?
What do you think it means and why do you say it?

It means "So be it," "May it be," or ""truly." It's an affirmation of faith in what was said before; to paraphrase Romans 4:17, it's the faith to call things that aren't as though they were, and watch them become so.

Basically put, I feel that "Amen" in all of its glory and variations is simply the honoring of history’s first monotheist, the Pharaoh Akhenaten - Amen - hotep.

Akhenaten - "Effective for Aten, where Aten = jtn, the Sun disk, which this ruler (who reigned during the Eighteenth Dynasty and) was instrumental in making the religious focus of his Kingdom.

Amenhotep - "Amun is satisfied", where Amun = jmn, a Theban deity of some small regard, later fused with Ra to create Amun-Ra, until such time as Amenhotep IV changed his name and religion to bring Aten into the forefront.

To assume that the semitic word "amen" is to praise Akenaten for being monotheistic (which isn't technically accurate) is without any linguistic support that I have seen. Most texts point to "amen" in Abrahamic faiths being derivative of the Semitic root a-m-n, which carries a meaning of "truth" or "confidence."

This claim is further supported by its lack of ties to the "monotheistic" (probably more accurately henotheistic) nature of Akenaten when one realizes that most biblical scholars agree that the shift from the monolatry of the early faith to the proper monotheism of the current one came not during the era of Egyptian slavery, but instead the Babylonian captivity, something widely attributed to the immersion in the Zoroastrian faith the Hebrews found in Babylon.

We was the original "sun god" and his symbol is the "sun disk" with fourteen hands coming out of it like "rays" of the sun. He is the first person in history - written and modern history to implement a "monotheistic" religion.

The original sun god was the sun. Animism is evidenced as one of, if not the, primary stages in religious evolution the world over. The anthropomorphic stage, where personalities and human traits are assigned to otherwise non-sentient and inanimate objects of worship, comes later. Thus, it stands to reason that the sun predated any Sun Gods as the center of solar worship for nearly every culture on the planet. Of which Egypt is arguably not the first.

Amen is perhaps a word like no other.

Except for آمين, and Tolkien's násië (which may not count as a constructed language), or sooth, or vraiment or any of the other words that mean exactly the same thing and are used in much the same way.

Etymologically, the word’s root is Hebrew in origin, with its use spreading to eventually encompass Christianity and Islam.

Then why did this article spend so long discussing Egypt?

Though religious leaders will scoff at the coincidence of the relationship of the word amen to its royal forbear, it is virtually certain that much of the Hebrew language, as well as Aramaic, was derived from earlier Egyptian.

Scholar David Steinberg suggests instead that the origins of Hebrew are shared with those of other Semitic languages. Yossi Garfinkel called the oldest inscription resembling Hebrew "proto-Canaanite". In point of fact, though both Semitic and Egyptian languages are members of the Afro-Asiatic language family, they are in distinct lingual subdivisions, with languages like Hebrew and Arabic tracing their lineages back to the same place as Akkadian, rather than Egyptian. This is evidenced, at least in my mind, in that Arabic and Hebrew share their exonym of Egypt (transliteratred as Mitzráyim in the latter and Miṣr in the former), where we know the endonym of ancient Egypt was km.t, "the Black [Land]" (one possibility for the origin of the English words "chemistry" and "alchemy"). If we look to the same color words in Hebrew, we find that the modern Hebrew word for the color is שָׁחֹר (forgive me if that's incorrect; I'm terrible with writing Hebrew) which is phonologically distinct.

For Jews, Amen is also an acronym for El Melech Ne'eman, which means "Mighty, Faithful King".

Technically, I think this is a backronym, as the word existed first, and then mystics took hold of it to make it "mean something."

Muslims use Amen (Amin or Ameen) in the same way as Christians and Jews, even though the word does not appear in the Qur'an. Muslims say it after reciting Surah al-Fatihah, after completing their prayers, at the end of letters, etc.

Among Muslims, it is apparently also used for the same intent in non-religious situations.

When Christians, Jews and Muslims say Amen, they do not invoke any god or any power just by saying that word or indeed any other word.

That's actually also untrue if you subscribe to the theory that our will shapes our world. It's a word of affirmation, of faith, and of telling the universe to shift itself in such a way as these things come to pass. It is not an impotent word at all. It's just misunderstood, obviously, and very misused.

And among Freemasons the term "So Mote it Be" is used at the end of every prayer/meditation.

My personal belief is in short that the meaning of Amen is The "Flame". Could be the flame of a candle or "holly flame" or for our sake both together - sacred flame.
Also Amen in ancient Egyptian " IMN" means God or sacred flame.

" Force be with You "

The word Amen is one of a small number of Hebrew words which have been imported unchanged into the liturgy of the Church, propter sanctiorem as St. Augustine expresses it, in virtue of an exceptionally sacred example. "So frequent was this Hebrew in the mouth of Our Saviour", observes the Catechism of the Council of Trent, "that it pleased the Holy Ghost to have it perpetuated in the Church of God". In point of fact St. Matthew attributes it to Our Lord twenty-eight times, and St. John in its doubled form twenty-six times. As regards the etymology, Amen is a derivative from the Hebrew verb aman "to strengthen" or "Confirm".
~New Advent by Carl Horst.

Amen is a declaration of affirmation found in the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament. Its use in Judaism dates back to its earliest texts. It is said to be of Hebrew origin; however, the basic root from which the word was derived is common to a number of Semitic Languages such as Aramaic or Syriac. The word was imported into the Greek of the early Church from Judaism. From Greek, amen entered the other Western languages. According to a standard dictionary etymology, amen passed from Greek into Late Latin, and thence into English.

Muslims use the word ʾĀmīn when concluding a prayer, and especially after reciting the first surah of the Qur'an, with the same meaning as in Judaism and Christianity. Besides that, in Islam, Muslims say "Amiin" after hoping something good after being stated.

Popular among some theosophists, proponents of Afrocentric theories of history, and adherents of esoteric Christianity is the conjecture that amen is a derivative of the name of the Egyptian god Amun (which is sometimes also spelled Amen). Some adherents of Eastern religions believe that amen shares roots with the Hindu Sanskrit word, Aum. Such external etymologies are not included in standard etymological reference works.
The Hebrew word, as noted above, starts with aleph, while the Egyptian name begins with a yodh.

I would suppose that it is possible, but from what I have been able to find, I feel it is unlikely.

From Wikipedia...
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amen

Amen

The word amen is a declaration of affirmation[1][2] found in the Hebrew Bible and the New Testament. Its use in Judaism dates back to its earliest texts.[3] It has been generally adopted in Christian worship as a concluding word for prayers and hymns.[2] In Islam, it is the standard ending to Dua (supplication). Common English translations of the word amen include "verily" and "truly". It can also be used colloquially to express strong agreement,[2] as in, for instance, amen to that.[4]

EtymologyEdit


Amen in East Syriac Aramaic
The usage of Amen, meaning "so be it", as found in the early scriptures of the Bible is said to be of Hebrew origin;[5][6] however, the basic triconsonantal root from which the word was derived is common to a number of Semitic Languages such as Aramaic or Syriac. The word was imported into the Greek of the early Church from Judaism.[1][7] From Greek, amen entered the other Western languages. According to a standard dictionary etymology, amen passed from Greek into Late Latin, and thence into English.[8] Rabbinic scholars from medieval France believed the standard Hebrew word for faith emuna comes from the root amen. Although in English transliteration they look different, they are both from the root aleph-mem-nun. That is, the Hebrew word amen derives from the same ancient triliteral Hebrew root as does the verb ʾāmán.[9]

Grammarians frequently list ʾāmán under its three consonants (aleph-mem-nun), which are identical to those of ʾāmēn (note that the Hebrew letter א aleph represents a glottal stop sound, which functions as a consonant in the morphology of Hebrew).[8] This triliteral root means to be firm, confirmed, reliable, faithful, have faith, believe.

In Arabic, the word is derived from its triliteral common root word ʾĀmana (Arabic: آمن‎), which has the same meanings as the Hebrew root word.

Popular among some theosophists,[10] proponents of Afrocentric theories of history,[11] and adherents of esoteric Christianity [12][13] is the conjecture that amen is a derivative of the name of the Egyptian god Amun (which is sometimes also spelled Amen). Some adherents of Eastern religions believe that amen shares roots with the Hindu Sanskrit word, Aum.[14][15][16][17] Such external etymologies are not included in standard etymological reference works. The Hebrew word, as noted above, starts with aleph, while the Egyptian name begins with a yodh.[18]

The Armenian word ամեն /ˌɑːmˈɛn/ means "every"; however it is also used in the same form at the conclusion of prayers, much as in English.[19]

Hebrew Bible
The word first occurs in the Hebrew Bible in Numbers 5.22 when the Priest addresses a suspected adulteress and she responds “Amen, Amen”. Overall, the word appears in the Hebrew Bible 30 times.

Three distinct Biblical usages of amen may be noted:[1]

Initial amen, referring back to words of another speaker and introducing an affirmative sentence, e.g. 1 Kings 1:36.[1]
Detached amen, again referring to the words of another speaker but without a complementary affirmative sentence, e.g. Nehemiah 5:13.[1]
Final amen, with no change of speaker, as in the subscription to the first three divisions of Psalms.[1]
New Testament
There are 52 amens in the Synoptic Gospels and 25 in John. The five final amens (Matthew 6:13, 28:20, Mark 16:20, Luke 24:53 and John 21:25), which are wanting in certain manuscripts, simulate the effect of final amen in the Hebrew Psalms. All initial amens occur in the sayings of Jesus. These initial amens are unparalleled in Hebrew literature, according to Friedrich Delitzsch, because they do not refer to the words of a previous speaker but instead introduce a new thought.[20]

The uses of amen ("verily" or "I tell you the truth", depending on the translation) in the Gospels form a peculiar class; they are initial, but often lack any backward reference.[21] Jesus used the word to affirm his own utterances, not those of another person[citation needed], and this usage was adopted by the church. The use of the initial amen, single or double in form, to introduce solemn statements of Jesus in the Gospels had no parallel in Jewish practice.[22]

In the King James Bible, the word amen is preserved in a number of contexts. Notable ones include:

The catechism of curses of the Law found in Deuteronomy 27.[1]
A double amen ("amen and amen") occurs in Psalm 89 (Psalm 41:13; 72:19; 89:52), to confirm the words and invoke the fulfillment of them.[23]
The custom of closing prayers with amen originates in the Lord's Prayer at Matthew 6:13.[citation needed]
Amen occurs in several doxology formulas in Romans 1:25, 9:5, 11:36, 15:33, and several times in Chapter 16.[1] It also appears in doxologies in the Pss (41:14; 72:19; 89:53; 106:48). This liturgical form from Judaism.[24]
It concludes all of Paul's general epistles.
In Revelation 3:14, Jesus is referred to as, "the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of God's creation."
Amen concludes the New Testament at Rev. 22:21.
Amen in JudaismEdit

See also: Reciting amen
Although amen, in Judaism, is commonly stated as a response to a blessing, it is also often used as an affirmation of any declaration.

Jewish rabbinical law requires an individual to say amen in a variety of contexts.[25]

With the rise of the synagogue during the Second Temple period, amen became a common response, especially to benedictions. It is recited communally to affirm a blessing made by the prayer reader. It is also mandated as a response during the kaddish doxology. The congregation is sometimes prompted to answer 'amen' by the terms ve-'imru (Hebrew: ואמרו‎) = "and [now] say (pl.)," or, ve-nomar (ונאמר) = "and let us say." Contemporary usage reflects ancient practice: As early as the 4th century BCE, Jews assembled in the Temple responded 'amen' at the close of a doxology or other prayer uttered by a priest. This Jewish liturgical use of amen was adopted by the Christians.[22] But Jewish law also requires individuals to answer amen whenever they hear a blessing recited, even in a non-liturgical setting.

The Talmud teaches homiletically that the word amen is an acronym for אל מלך נאמן (ʾEl melekh neʾeman, "God, trustworthy King"),[26] the phrase recited silently by an individual before reciting the Shma.

Jews usually approximate the Hebrew pronunciation of the word: /ɔːˈmeɪn/ aw-mayn (Ashkenazi) or /ɑːˈmɛn/ ah-men (Sephardi).[27]

Amen in ChristianityEdit

The use of "amen" has been generally adopted in Christian worship as a concluding word for prayers and hymns and express strong agreements.[22] The liturgical use of the word in apostolic times is attested by the passage from 1 Corinthians cited above, and Justin Martyr (c. 150) describes the congregation as responding "amen" to the benediction after the celebration of the Eucharist.[1] Its introduction into the baptismal formula (in the Greek Orthodox Church it is pronounced after the name of each person of the Trinity) is probably later. Among certain Gnostic sects Amen became the name of an angel.

In Isaiah 65:16, the authorized version has "the God of truth," ("the God of amen," in Hebrew. Jesus often used amen to put emphasis to his own words (translated: "verily"). In John's Gospel, it is repeated, "Verily, verily." Amen is also used in oath (Numbers 5:22; Deuteronomy 27:15–26; Nehemiah 5:13; 8:6; 1 Chronicles 16:36). "Amen" is further found at the end of the prayer of primitive churches (1 Corinthians 14:16).[23]

In some Christian churches, the amen corner or amen section is any subset of the congregation likely to call out "Amen!" in response to points in a preacher's sermon.[citation needed] Metaphorically, the term can refer to any group of heartfelt traditionalists or supporters of an authority figure.

Amen is also used in standard, international French, but in Cajun French Ainsi soit-il ("so be it") is used instead.

Amen is used at the end of Our Lord's Prayer,[28] which is also called the Our Father or the Pater Noster.

Amen in IslamEdit


ʾĀmīn in Arabic.
Muslims use the word ʾĀmīn (Arabic: آمين‎) when concluding a prayer, and especially after reciting the first surah (Al Fatiha) of the Qur'an, with the same meaning as in Judaism and Christianity.[29][30] Besides that, in Islam, Muslims say "Amiin" after hoping something good after being stated. For example: I wish all the people in this world could unite and live in peace, Amiin ya Allah or the same as Amen to That in Christianity.

Zenchi wrote:

Warning: Spoiler!

The lesson for today kids is to list ALL exterior sources when cutting & pasting...

That was the simplest explanation of what I had found.
If I were to have copied it all word for word I would have. But since I edited it down to be simpler I figured it wasn’t necessary.

what does "Mote" mean in this context?

And among Freemasons the term "So Mote it Be" is used at the end of every prayer/meditation.

baru wrote: what does "Mote" mean in this context?

It's an archaic form of "may" or "might" stemming from earlier versions of English. In this instance it's the same as "So may it be."

I just listened to a podcast about the Dogon. It stated that the word Amen is in Dogon, Egyptian, and Hebrew. The root of this word means something like - the Creator, the starting place, to establish. It is the vibration tone of creation. it is the tone below all other tones.

I have seen this word written as: Aum-en. It is similar to Om or AUM.

baru wrote: I just listened to a podcast about the Dogon. It stated that the word Amen is in Dogon, Egyptian, and Hebrew. The root of this word means something like - the Creator, the starting place, to establish. It is the vibration tone of creation. it is the tone below all other tones.

I have seen this word written as: Aum-en. It is similar to Om or AUM.

...but those are all vastly distinct and different language families, so at absolute best, those words are false cognates (words that seem similar in form and meaning, but are wholly unrelated at all), and most likely, they're false friends (words that seem similar but have vastly different meanings and etymologies). The likelihood that they are in any way related is so linguistically small that I hesitate to give it any credence.

based on all of my research - they come from the same language family - Atlantis.
This could be some "heavy stuff" or totally "whacky" to some, but I do believe that there was a civilization before our modern age and i generally refer to that "original", progenitor culture as "Atlantis".

There is a lot of study into linguistics that show that these "ancient" cultures seem to have a common root for a lot of their words. There are words in Irish (Gaelic), Hebrew, Egyptian (ancient), Greek, Chinese, Tibetan, and Dogon that are the same.

I find it interesting that Modern European cultures seem to reject this notion that something could have existed before what believe is the present culture. When I lived in Tibet, they talked about older civilizations. they talked about a time that had greater technology than they have now. I saw ruins that related to an older time that had knowledge that they do not have now. I feel sites like Newgraunge and the pyramids prove this. The book Underworlds does a great job at depicting this evidence.

Irish Origins of Civilization and other books convey a reasonable justification for this as well.

I feel that we are limited in our acceptance of Atlantis (an older civilization) is because of how we are now. When I look at our present world - I am challenged to accept that at some point in our history we all got along, we all spoke the same language and that we built amazing things like the Great Tombs.

But this research into our Progenitors makes me happy because it reminds me that at one time that was true and we can do it again!

I look forward to when we, as a collective world, accept that we are all one and that we have more in common with each other than we think.

Knowing that this word "Amen" is in all of our languages could be a key to triggering our memory of that time.

baru wrote: There is a lot of study into linguistics that show that these "ancient" cultures seem to have a common root for a lot of their words. There are words in Irish (Gaelic), Hebrew, Egyptian (ancient), Greek, Chinese, Tibetan, and Dogon that are the same.

That's because there is a limited number of sounds that the human body can create through speech, and because of the migration of humans from a common ancestral point, most likely found in Africa.

I find it interesting that Modern European cultures seem to reject this notion that something could have existed before what believe is the present culture.

Because there's no scientific evidence for any civilization earlier than the neolithic cultures that are found in Africa, Asia, and Mesopotamia.

I feel that we are limited in our acceptance of Atlantis (an older civilization) is because of how we are now.

Do you mean a civilzation that asks for proof of something that can be proved before it is accepted as fact?

Knowing that this word "Amen" is in all of our languages could be a key to triggering our memory of that time.

It isn't in "all of our languages." It's in Semitic languages. There are similar sounding words (we think) in Egyptian (though the closest we get to pronouncing the abjadic/semanto-phonetic Egyptian writing system is modern Coptic interspersed with a lot of 'e's for ease of speaking, since there were no actual vowels recorded in hieroglyphics), but that doesn't make them the same words.

I'm not here to dissuade you from your belief in an "earlier" civilization. I'm just pointing out that there is no actual, scientifically-valid evidence for any of the claims that this word is a universal word by way of linguistic evolution that I have ever, ever seen. Nor is there any scientifically-valid evidence for this proposed "earlier" civilization. And until I have some of either, I'm going to continue my disbelief in both theories.

I enjoy discussion like this. This is how we get to a central truth.

(I am not good with creating quotes just yet, so I will do this)

"from Africa" - That is the convent truth that most alternate theory archaeologists are happy to dispute. As an archaeologist, I would agree that humanity did not originate from Africa. Even Leaky was quoted as saying that "like did not originate from Africa or the Olduvai Gorge. Its mostly histories and the meida that made those distracting claims. Our modern understanding of history is guided by agenda and ego. Its very difficult to get the "truth" out of a filter with such tiny holes.

"evidence" - there is a lot of evidence, but it is suppressed so the leading elites can have their time in the sun. "new ideas" are usually at least ten to twenty years old. Usually the old guard has to pass on before the new ideas emerge. When I worked in Nicaragua, most of our discovers where sold on the black market or stowed away in closets until they could be sold.

"language" - I like your points. I would need to do more research into that. But based on my research of other people's research (being a true arm-chair anthropologist), it seems that these root words are from a similar source. Until we actually accept the existence of "atlantis" and we allow conflicting research to surface, we will truly never know. Based on my own personal experience in the field, I know that stuff is suppressed and new ideas are met with resistance. I feel that we are finally coming into an age where we will see more reveled about our past than ever before. I am so excited.

Have you check out the "old tomb" of Ireland that are older than the oldest pyramids in Egypt or the underwater structors in the book Underworlds?

I love these types of debates. Thank you for your offers and point of views. I agree that we would benefit from a "hard truth" but in the end - what matters to me is the idea that we once lived together harmously with the Force as our guide and I look forward to returning to that. I look forward to people accepting that we can actually all get along and serve something higher than ourselves - no matter what name or langauge is used.

baru wrote: (I am not good with creating quotes just yet, so I will do this)

Quotes are easy! You can either hit the "Quote" button at the bottom of the screen, and cut out whatever you don't want to quote, or, you can do this: and it'll take care of it for you!

"from Africa" - That is the convent truth that most alternate theory archaeologists are happy to dispute. As an archaeologist, I would agree that humanity did not originate from Africa. Even Leaky was quoted as saying that "like did not originate from Africa or the Olduvai Gorge. Its mostly histories and the meida that made those distracting claims. Our modern understanding of history is guided by agenda and ego. Its very difficult to get the "truth" out of a filter with such tiny holes.

I agree that one, central origin point in Africa makes very little sense, given what we know of history, geography, and many other disciplines. That said, a common point of origin of species does make sense if we trace it back to the earliest instances, before the differing types of hominids murdered and bred each other out of existence until we got to Homo sapiens.

"evidence" - there is a lot of evidence, but it is suppressed so the leading elites can have their time in the sun. "new ideas" are usually at least ten to twenty years old. Usually the old guard has to pass on before the new ideas emerge. When I worked in Nicaragua, most of our discovers where sold on the black market or stowed away in closets until they could be sold.

In the age of global communications and conspiracy theorists, I find it hard to believe any verifiable information can be "suppressed" adequately. Things like that can only be kept secret--really secret--if you have the ability to kill literally everyone who might talk about it, and that kind of firepower is pretty noticable.

"language" - I like your points. I would need to do more research into that. But based on my research of other people's research (being a true arm-chair anthropologist), it seems that these root words are from a similar source. Until we actually accept the existence of "atlantis" and we allow conflicting research to surface, we will truly never know. Based on my own personal experience in the field, I know that stuff is suppressed and new ideas are met with resistance. I feel that we are finally coming into an age where we will see more reveled about our past than ever before. I am so excited.

Words are kind of my thing. It's why I'm always screaming that "words mean things". When we understand what they mean, why they mean it, and where they come from, we start to understand how we (culturally) feel and think about the things they represent.

Have you check out the "old tomb" of Ireland that are older than the oldest pyramids in Egypt or the underwater structors in the book Underworlds?

I have not, but hominids have created cairns for their dead before they created cities for their living, so it wouldn't surprise me at all.

I love these types of debates. Thank you for your offers and point of views. I agree that we would benefit from a "hard truth" but in the end - what matters to me is the idea that we once lived together harmously with the Force as our guide and I look forward to returning to that. I look forward to people accepting that we can actually all get along and serve something higher than ourselves - no matter what name or langauge is used.

Truth can be helpful or hurtful. I just ask, personally, for proof of things that can be proved. Everything else, I will entertain on faith. I find I, personally, am far less stressed about things that way.

Not sure if this was already said (a lot to read) but my understanding was that AMEN was a shortened version of ALL MEN. As in "are ALL MEN in agreement?" Considering that many churches say AMEN like a question, such as "Christ loves us, amen?" To which everyone says AMEN.

It's rather irritating, actually. Everyone says it, but no one knows what it means.

Streen wrote: It's rather irritating, actually. Everyone says it, but no one knows what it means.

This annoys me about most of language, honestly. It's not hard to find out what things like this mean, and we just choose not to understand how we're communicating.