Europe under attack again

My thoughts are with the people in Brussels. When will this madness finally end?

I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

MartaLina wrote: I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

What are we doing wrong ?

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote: I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

What are we doing wrong ?

Good question, but its not like we were not warned this was going to happen , esp after the attacks in Paris , they arrested one of the terrorists and it seems this is revenge. Is there really anything we can do against this kind of hate ?

MartaLina wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote: I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

What are we doing wrong ?

Good question, but its not like we were not warned this was going to happen , esp after the attacks in Paris , they arrested one of the terrorists and it seems this is revenge. Is there really anything we can do against this kind of hate ?

Tackling terrorism always seems to be done through fighting symptoms rather than trying to fix the root causes. What makes someone born and raised in Belgium turn into a terrorist and blow himself up? We're obviously not offering these young people enough incentives and opportunity to lead a productive life in our society

I believe that it was 23 confirmed deaths now. not sure though
My thoughts are with the citizens of Brussels, and also with the people around the world who experience this daily.

Where has humanity come to..

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote: I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

What are we doing wrong ?

Good question, but its not like we were not warned this was going to happen , esp after the attacks in Paris , they arrested one of the terrorists and it seems this is revenge. Is there really anything we can do against this kind of hate ?

Tackling terrorism always seems to be done through fighting symptoms rather than trying to fix the root causes. What makes someone born and raised in Belgium turn into a terrorist and blow himself up? We're obviously not offering these young people enough incentives and opportunity to lead a productive life in our society

I dont know what its like in Belgium , but here a lot of these young people choose another path, its their responsibilty as well as ours meaning that the choice of violence can not alone lie with what we have to offer . The really sad thing is that people pull eachother down with these actions and it reflects terrible on young people who dont want violence but suffer now from the racist backlash of these actions. I notice this with my students who are today deeply saddened but also , very scared , they are refugees and feel caught in the middle , i reassured them , we have the same enemy ..hate

Cyan Sarden wrote: When will this madness finally end?

When the governments stop worrying about political correctness and start controlling their borders, taking the time to thoroughly vet refugees and migrants before letting them in and then keep a close eye on them when they're in.

I realize that waves of a 100,000+ people are hard to control and vet and they find their ways in anyways but then they need to step up and start going after these people but unfortunately that gives rise to a police state.

Governments shouldn't be worrying about handing out this and that, suppressing their own culture in order to not a offend a different culture coming in because the incoming culture should be grateful they are getting any help whatsoever coming from the conditions they're used to and if they want to complain about no PS3 and their host's values, commit crimes, bring their terrorist baggage with through ignoring and pretending the extreme parts of their culture aren't there, they should just be forced back to their part of the world to clean up their own mess.

The sick, elderly, woman and children should be helped, but in the videos you just see tons and tons of young men, that should be back where they come from fixing the problems that forced them to leave. I enjoy all those videos and news about the women fighters in the ME taking care of business, while thousands and thousand of men run and try to take over another place to turn it into the craphole they came from through Sharia law patrols, harrassing women and Christians. It's the same on the other side though because the right wingers will attack refugees and migrants, disrespect and hurt those that are different, when they should've been taking control of the situation before it happens through their government of supposed elected representatives.

It's a huge problem, there's much more to than all this too but it really seems like just another Soros style instigated creation of crisis to lower the standards of living and brew conflict so power and money can change hands while the pawns fight with each other and everybody loses. :silly:

MartaLina wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote: I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

What are we doing wrong ?

Good question, but its not like we were not warned this was going to happen , esp after the attacks in Paris , they arrested one of the terrorists and it seems this is revenge. Is there really anything we can do against this kind of hate ?

Tackling terrorism always seems to be done through fighting symptoms rather than trying to fix the root causes. What makes someone born and raised in Belgium turn into a terrorist and blow himself up? We're obviously not offering these young people enough incentives and opportunity to lead a productive life in our society

I dont know what its like in Belgium , but here a lot of these young people choose another path, its their responsibilty as well as ours meaning that the choice of violence can not alone lie with what we have to offer . The really sad thing is that people pull eachother down with these actions and it reflects terrible on young people who dont want violence but suffer now from the racist backlash of these actions. I notice this with my students who are today deeply saddened but also , very scared , they are refugees and feel caught in the middle , i reassured them , we have the same enemy ..hate

Young people tend to be idealistic - that's not a bad thing per se of course. But idealsism + a weak character make people easy targets for manipulation. The question is: can an 18-year-old make responsible decision and can he be held accountable for them? According to law: sure. But the reality is often different - many of my students in that age range still behave like children and I find it difficult to hold them responsible for getting manipulated into doing something immensely stupid. There are lots that are full adults at 18 as well, obviously.

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote:

MartaLina wrote: I know , 2 explosions in airport and at least 2 explosions in Metro stations

What are we doing wrong ?

Good question, but its not like we were not warned this was going to happen , esp after the attacks in Paris , they arrested one of the terrorists and it seems this is revenge. Is there really anything we can do against this kind of hate ?

Tackling terrorism always seems to be done through fighting symptoms rather than trying to fix the root causes. What makes someone born and raised in Belgium turn into a terrorist and blow himself up? We're obviously not offering these young people enough incentives and opportunity to lead a productive life in our society

I dont know what its like in Belgium , but here a lot of these young people choose another path, its their responsibilty as well as ours meaning that the choice of violence can not alone lie with what we have to offer . The really sad thing is that people pull eachother down with these actions and it reflects terrible on young people who dont want violence but suffer now from the racist backlash of these actions. I notice this with my students who are today deeply saddened but also , very scared , they are refugees and feel caught in the middle , i reassured them , we have the same enemy ..hate

Young people tend to be idealistic - that's not a bad thing per se of course. But idealsism + a weak character make people easy targets for manipulation. The question is: can an 18-year-old make responsible decision and can he be held accountable for them? According to law: sure. But the reality is often different - many of my students in that age range still behave like children and I find it difficult to hold them responsible for getting manipulated into doing something immensely stupid. There are lots that are full adults at 18 as well, obviously.

That is correct , i think 27 is a more realistic age if any but i think like that in a lot of areas , even here at the Temple where you can be a Knight at 18 ( lol starting something now haha)

Lightstrider wrote:

Cyan Sarden wrote: When will this madness finally end?

When the governments stop worrying about political correctness and start controlling their borders, taking the time to thoroughly vet refugees and migrants before letting them in and then keep a close eye on them when they're in.

I essentially agree with that - but many of the perps were born here, some second, some third gen.

That said: if the EU wants to be taken seriously, it's high time for a common defense strategy (e.g. a common army) and a common border control policy (e.g. a common border force). Why is that so difficult?

Interesting video about some of the issues with hardline Islam and the West;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIdHDtYNqGc

'Religious beliefs are ultimately incompatible with civilization.' From a Tweet by Sam Harris in response to the attacks this morning. I'd agree with this if it said 'organised religion is ultimately incompatible with modern civilization'. Only a personalization of religion in combination with syncretism seems to work today.

Cyan Sarden wrote: That said: if the EU wants to be taken seriously, it's high time for a common defense strategy (e.g. a common army) and a common border control policy (e.g. a common border force). Why is that so difficult?

This could be the very scenario that does that, whether or not it is intentional as part of somea agenda or not though I think the multiculturism of the EU itself prevents the EU from truly being an EU as in some ways it was/is already collapsing in on itself.

Nothing is perfect, at my home in the US the union of states are being torn apart by it's own multiculturism as we are experiencing new levels of racial tension, class warfare, left wing extremists vs right wing extremists but a lot of this can also be seen as a Soros style instigated crisis (a lot of activist groups tied to his organizations) to keep the people divided and fighting amongst themselves instead of going after the economic/political corruption and no accountability which are the root to all the problems we face.

I know governments and other power structures can't serve everyone's interests because interests are infinite and resources are mostly finite. Obviously there are some groups that could make a huge difference in areas like world hunger but they choose not to, while there are many groups that don't have much and they do a lot of great things to just generally help uplift the species.

I think that maybe around the Western world the people are realizing their national, traditional, personal interests are not being represented by their elected officials and that their governments are serving the interests of big powerful figures, families and corporations with all the wars, deterioration of social services and infrastructure through benevolently subversive means. I know this sound a bit strange but perhaps the powers that be have decided that now that they have used all our tax money to conquer, colonize or negatively stir up through proxy wars, sanctions, meddling in the affairs of others for their own benefit, almost the entire world that now it is time to bring it all home in order to reduce standards of living, cause cultural conflicts that will force everyone to give up their traditions in favor of a new system.

If that's not true whatsoever then perhaps I think what is happening is just people clinging to their own traditions or in a sense their egos, which creates all the dissonance throughout the human societal system on all levels. Some folks want to establish their own global <insert religious/political utopia title here>, then this group thinks that group is out to destroy all religions and establish a totalitarian system of oppression and dehumanization, or that group thinks this group wants to just force everyone to worship this god and follow these rules. Or simply this group wants to live like that, that group wants to live like this, and these groups just can't stand it.

The lack of tolerance is at the heart of most of these violent issues. While I know a lot about the ideas of the 'elite' humans that want to essentially rid the world of nations with a global government, perhaps even a global religion, no money, nobody will be born without a job to do, Orwell and Huxley type stuff, there should be a point in time where people realize we are all one race and this entire planet is our home.

We don't have to give up traditions, I like traditions and different cultures, like each religion they tell the stories of a people from where and who they came from. I've crossed through a variety of types being raised in the midwest and Christian, to moving to the Pacific northwest where there's a lot of Eastern style religious people, Burning Man is one hell of an experience with many traditions and cultures most people could never think of, Russia and Georgia with orthodox Christians and the Caucasus where my girlfriend is from with mostly those of the Islamic faith. Most people I encounter are generally good people, of course we're all human and we have our schemes, tricks, bad habits. Some people are very conservative and will physically attack family members for not going along to traditions, others are very liberal and let them live with a foreigner unmarried.

Oh the wonders and mysteries of humans, perhaps this is just how things should be and through all of the violence and conflict we as a species learn and grow?

It is a sad and frightening day for many today, and it may soon turn into a very angry one for some as well. I watched a terrorist attack unfold on my doorstep just 3 months ago and I can identify with these feelings. It is easy to fall victim to a knee-jerk reaction, but as a Jedi I remember that I am meant to be an instrument of peace. We must not rush to ill-informed action.

Despite the carnage inflicted by misguided and violent people, we have grown closer as a community here in San Bernardino. Rather than lash out at others or recoil in fear, we have learned to communicate better. The surrounding cities have pledged support and there is an air of cooperation. Terrorists do not win when their cowardly acts inspire the best from the rest of us.

On a personal level, I know my neighbors now. I say 'good morning' to police officers rather than avoid them. I look to lift people up who need help instead of ignoring them. I am no longer afraid. I am motivated.

Emotion, yet Peace
Ignorance, yet Knowledge
Passion, yet Serenity
Chaos, yet Harmony
Death, yet The Force

I'm having a hard time grasping how someone or group can hate so much that they resort to killing large groups of innocent people.

Senan wrote: It is a sad and frightening day for many today, and it may soon turn into a very angry one for some as well. I watched a terrorist attack unfold on my doorstep just 3 months ago and I can identify with these feelings. It is easy to fall victim to a knee-jerk reaction, but as a Jedi I remember that I am meant to be an instrument of peace. We must not rush to ill-informed action.

Despite the carnage inflicted by misguided and violent people, we have grown closer as a community here in San Bernardino. Rather than lash out at others or recoil in fear, we have learned to communicate better. The surrounding cities have pledged support and there is an air of cooperation. Terrorists do not win when their cowardly acts inspire the best from the rest of us.

On a personal level, I know my neighbors now. I say 'good morning' to police officers rather than avoid them. I look to lift people up who need help instead of ignoring them. I am no longer afraid. I am motivated.

Emotion, yet Peace
Ignorance, yet Knowledge
Passion, yet Serenity
Chaos, yet Harmony
Death, yet The Force

This is what i told my students , this should get us closer together, they are in pain because yet again these crimes are commited in the name of Islam 6 of my 8 students are muslim . We are taking some time of now , i will see them next week again , they need to give this a place , the shock is big , its only 1,5 hours away from here and they as we dont feel that safe anymore , but we assure them that that is not our way...we stick together now even more than ever ! And as a Jedi i fully agree with what you are saying Senan.. motivation in stead of fear ! Good one ...

Rickie wrote: I'm having a hard time grasping how someone or group can hate so much that they resort to killing large groups of innocent people.

They have been severely mislead and brainwashed , not saying that they are not responsible cause they are ...but stlll

It's still unfathomable hate. Sadly

It is sad that we think we did something wrong or think what did I do? This is a choice those who have made to forward their cause. War in my opinion should always be a last resort. seems like the only one some have come out with but that's neither here nor there. My heart goes out to those who have been effected by the hate that is out there. I hear things like this and it makes me think of shakespher when he says and some one can fix my quote

rom "out of HER favor where I am IN love.
ben " Alas that love, so gentle in view
Should be so tyrannous and rough in proof!
rom "Alas, THAT love, so gentle in his view,
Should without eyes see pathways to his will!

---

rom

---

What fray was here?
Yet tell me not , for I have heard it all.
Here's much to do with hate, but more with love.
Why then ,O brawling love! O loving hate!
O anything, of nothing first create!
O heavy lightness! Serious VANITY!
Misshapen CHAOS of well seeming forms!
Feather of lead, bright smoke, cold fire, sick health!
Still-walking sleep, that is not what it is!
This love feel I, that feel no love in this.
Dost thou not laugh?
ben No, Coz, ide rather weep.
rom "Why, such is love's transgression.

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