Vegetarianism

What is the temples outlook on eating meat? As I've read that one should respect the sanctity of life? Is this acceptable?

I'm not sure about the Temple, it varies by individual but my personal views is even vegetables are a life form. I do my best to treat my food (or anything that comes from nature such as my crafting materials) with respect. Acknowledge where it comes from, minimize waste, utilize it to the best of my abilities. That sort of thing

As kamizu says it is all about the individual
I am a vegetarian (mostly) since i used to be a follower of mahayana buddhism and i still belive life in all forms are sacred, as all life is a part of the force and i belive my choice to be a vegetarian fits with jediism aswell as my old buddhist way of thinking.
But how we interpret the doctrine also is about the individual (look a bit down)
I also find that i feel cleaner and better when i don't eat meat, but that's just me

As the "jedi belive" claims:

Jedi Belive: In the Force, and in the inherent worth of all life within it.

To me this means that you should respect all life in the way that you do not support the continued reduction of it by buying and consuming meat. And meat is limited, aswell as life is, however plants can be grown time and time again until the end of the world. That is what i belive atleast

And you can eat meatif you want, i belive it is all optional

I see. Having been given these opinions it seems to me that it is a matter of perception. That all things consumed should be treated respectfully. I like this. But what of synthetic foods or junk foods?

So I suppose before eating it is viable to thank many people..the farmers, The Earth, etc...

Thank you guys for your opinions so far!

Makes me wonder about the Japanese phrase, "Itadakimasu."

I respect the sanctity of the circle of life. I have no problem eating meat.

I am a little concerned (but ill equipped) to deal with the horrid treatment of animals.

Hello Djavik and thank you for your thoughts.
Personally i am vegetarian. The only thing that i wait from Totjo right now is just to promote the vegetarianism/veganism as something positive.
This change of diet is a big and difficult step for every human, and i strongly believe that it should be optional for every person to decide.

I have a very simple diet. I avoid a heap of things for health reasons so avoiding what I don't avoid for other reasons is difficult if I want to stay alive
:blink:
But I'd love to avoid meat if I could. I already avoid red meat but have not been able to replace chicken meat yet.

For me some 'ideal' which I might associate as Jedi would only use meat when it was scavenged - to avoid complicity in killing :S

Somethings I didn't know;

"The meat industry is one of the top contributors to climate change, directly and indirectly producing about 14.5 percent of the world’s anthropogenic greenhouse gas emissions, and global meat consumption is on the rise. People generally like eating meat—when poor people start making more money, they almost invariably start buying more meat. As the population grows and eats more animal products, the consequences for climate change, pollution, and land use could be catastrophic."

"Currently, grazing land for ruminants—cows and their kin—accounts for a staggering 26 percent of the world’s ice-free land surface."

By L. V. Anderson Slate


Part of the message is hidden for the guests. Please log in or register to see it.

I am a hunter/fisher and a farmer. I grew up on a farm and have hunted my entire life.

I actively raise animals for food and I harvest animals for their meat. Each year I raise approximately 100 chickens to butcher, a smaller number of geese, ducks, and turkeys along with rabbits. My family also raised beef, sheep and swine (pigs) as well. Every year I gear up for hunting season for white tail deer, wild ducks, geese, grouse etc.

We all walk different paths, however eating meat in itself is not a bad thing. Biologically humans are omnivores. What we think of meat today usually is the furthest thing from it. Without getting into a huge debate about it being good and bad I would like to offer a bit different perspective.

The reason I do what I do is to provide my family and my friends with the highest quality of food I can. I live in a very wild area, wildlife is all around me. In fact just two weeks ago my best freind hit a deer and we were able to save about 40lbs of meat from the carcass. Animals processed through large corporate slaughter houses are raised in terrible conditions, feed awful things etc and are about the most unhealthy thing you can do for your body. Go to youtube to check out more. Its not nice at all. My animals are raised by my hands, in humane conditions, with the best feeds I can afford to give them with wonderful lives, they get to be animals, outside. When their purpose comes they are incredibly healthy choices to put on the dinner plate. If you would like to see actual nutritional numbers I can supply those. One must remember a serving of steak is actually supposed to be the size of a deck of cards. Not half the plate. I worked with our local city council to allow backyard chickens in our town and was the first licensed to have backyard birds in my town. My hens produce eggs that have a nutritional value that is far superior to anything you can purchase in a super market. My garden grows enough to keep us in green and tomatoes for almost an entire year.

When I am out hunting its all about luck. If there are no deer in the area I can have a laser scope with a tank and equipped a GPS unit and will never get a deer. The last two years I have been hunting I have not even brought home a deer. My Master Phortis who was hunting 30 miles from me also left the area without a deer. There is something to be said though about getting away from the crazy life we all lead and go into the woods and become one with it. Listening to the animals, feeling the wind, jumping when you hear a crash only to find out its a squirrel behind you. Or the chipmunk that I mistakenly fed pistachios to keep him quiet........ I think I made an addict out of him..... For me that is the greatest gift of hunting. Being able to get outside and be part of the cycle of life.

I am very passionate about good food. I can go on for hours about it. I have a great respect for everyone's food choices unless they are choosing McDonald's everyday. It is also why I became a Honey Bee Keeper. The world depends on the honey bee for pollination and the honey bee is in very great trouble.

Life is a cycle. We are all part of it. No one is better than another even when it comes to food choices. That being said we can be smarter about those choices. The United States is in a HUGE medical crisis when it comes to health. From Diabetes, to Heart Disease to Cancer. Some Physicians are predicting epidemic levels of these preventable diseases in the coming years. Where does this come from? There are many reasons but the main one is Nutrition. Read labels, know what is going into your body. An pasture raised animal that was feed non GMO feed is nutritionally better than ANY shake that has Red#40 in it. Promise.

Connor made a good point. Knowing how to make better choices is not something that is common knowledge.

How do you go about making better choices? First find out what is in your food. Even your vegetables. Try growing some. I grew up on a 200 acre farm so I had a lot of dirt to play with. Folks in Cities don't have that chance unless you get into a community garden thing. However even in an apartment people can grow food. Start with something simple like tomato plants. If you can get into a community garden great! Have fun! Get dirty! If you have a little bit of land, you can certainly put things in the ground! Growing a garden is actually pretty easy to do. It does require care though.

As for animals......aka meat. Hunting is not for everyone and that is okay too. I hunted with my father for many years before I was even allowed to carry a gun. We are Native American so before we go out we always put out some tobacco and offered a prayer. If we did get a deer we would thank the animal and put down more tobacco and harvest the animal leaving nothing to waste. Even now when I butcher my own livestock I always thank each animal, I humanely dispatch it as quickly as possible and I use everything I can and gift much of it away.

How do you find locally sourced meat from farmers rather than feedlot animals? Start with websites like
http://www.localharvest.org/
You can also find food coops. Or even just try searching google.
One of my favorite folks who is leading the food movement right now is Joel Salatin. There are even some pretty great videos on Netflix about food. There are also some really great podcasts out there as well.

Finally get involved!!!! Go meet a farmer. Learn what it takes! Ask questions, smell the animals, know where and what your food is and where it comes from. Pet the cow, dig up the potatoes, feed the lamb. That's what is all about. Being part of that cycle whatever your food choices might be.

I'm happy to discuss any of what I have talked about here if anyone has any questions.

I'll leave you with this quote because it really sums up this whole post and is exactly what I hope to continue to do for the rest of my life. All folks of all walks of life are welcome at my table, no matter what your preferences might be. I can do a mean vegetarian lasagna. However I can also do a pretty incredible venison one too...

" One of the biggest lies is that food is cheap - it is a lie that dishonors life. In regards to the sacredness of food, if you don't view the pig-ness of the pig or cow-ness of the cow as important and only view it as a sack of protoplasmic protein, you have already committed sacrilege. You cheapen the life that has been sacrificed to sustain your own. How we make this sacrifice sacred is by honoring and respecting the life." Joel Salatin

I believe it's a personal choice. I also believe that the highly industrialized, processed meat and dairy is also the #1 source for cancer and heart disease, among other things, as well as previoulsy mentioned having to do with land and water use. I think there is a case against meat nutritionally, but my problem with that idea is that they usually only are talking about the processed meat. For example, cows that are corn fed in the factory farms produce high omega 6 and fatty meat/dairy that promote disease through inflammation, and grass fed free range cows are higher in omega 3's and actual vitamins and minerals that help prevent disease. Apply this to most of what we eat and anything processed, grown for profit and without care for the quality is going to mess you up. Especially when sprayed with Round Up.

I think avoiding the processed garbage is key, and trying to get as much fresh, local produce in your body as possible, especially fresh, whole, ripe, raw, organic fruits and vegetables.

There are RAW VEGAN bodybuilders who are just as muscular and have just as much strength/endurance as meat eaters. One of the heads of the American Heart Association says a plant based diet is the number one way to pevent heart disease, diabetes, cancer, etc.

Personally I would lean towards being vegan and I have been for more than year before, mainly because of such smooth and easy digestion coupled with near unlimited and light feeling energy.When I was vegan this was my weeks worth of groceries:






But I've been living in Russia for 6 months now and this is my girlfriends dad cutting up fresh, local, organic, grassfed goodness:



I've seen some of the people here treat their animals like crap though. Tying a lamb up to a tree without rope long enough for it to sit or walk, just standing there waiting to die. I like to think like the Indians did, respect the animal, treat it as if it were giving itself to you and RESPECT IT!!!!! Give thanks to it and appreciate it, use everything you can from it, and afterall NONE of us would be alive here today if our ancestors had not ate meat.

EDIT: And when I think about this I also think about Campbell said when referring to the very hardcore Buddhist and such, as they try to avoid or ignore the way life is (life lives on killing, life eats life) and the first step is they stop eating meat. I just think it's funny.

EDIT EDIT: Campbell also said it could be disriminatory to criticize meat eaters while you kill all those wonderful plants that are also full of life. :silly:

It amazes me the intelligence of and respecrespect for life in and of itself here. So many fantastic ideas. I never really thought of how important our food is or how it's raised. Nor did I consider the economic consequence of mass vegearianism. This is really pretty incredible. The reverence for nourishment.

Eat what you enjoy and what gives you strength. What did people eat for thousands of years before you/we were born? Our bodies are no different now.

Rickie wrote: Eat what you enjoy and what gives you strength. What did people eat for thousands of years before you/we were born? Our bodies are no different now.

Hello Rickie and thank you for your thoughts.
I believe that our access on food is different and unfortunately our population is very different of what it used to be thousands of years ago.
Our little earth can still provide us with goods, but this will not be for ever. The vegetables are a more energy effective food than meat, and i assume that will come a day that veganism (and not vegetarianism) will be mandatory.
Unfortunately i am not a Vegan, so my vegetarianism is not more ecological than meat eating.
Best regards.
Robert.

Exarchias wrote:

Rickie wrote: Eat what you enjoy and what gives you strength. What did people eat for thousands of years before you/we were born? Our bodies are no different now.

Hello Rickie and thank you for your thoughts.
I believe that our access on food is different and unfortunately our population is very different of what it used to be thousands of years ago.
Our little earth can still provide us with goods, but this will not be for ever. The vegetables are a more energy effective food than meat, and i assume that will come a day that veganism (and not vegetarianism) will be mandatory.
Unfortunately i am not a Vegan, so my vegetarianism is not more ecological than meat eating.
Best regards.
Robert.

The thing about being total vegan, is compared to eating meat and the rest you are having to consume exponential amounts of food to maintain your calories. Can we grow enough, will the earth be able to withstand it?? Well I think with all the acres just given to cows there might be a chance for massive crop rotations where you just let cows and animals fertilize the acres and rotate. I think the agricultural industry will need to totally revolutionize and increase their standards and quality to promote more harmony with nature.

The thing is we have our immensley populated cities, I personally think overpopulation is a myth cause when you fly all you see is totally empty land. There some statistic that you could fit all of us in Australia or Texas, and the UN says by 2050 we peak and then decline. Anways, the cities will be the hardest to feed, they're going to have to figure something out like having gardens in the sky and stuff like that, recycling their own waste (not a big fan of that though unless everyone mysteriously dropped the drugs, petrochemical bodycare products, and industrial byproducts). You've got BIG MONEY in the way of all this though, the agriculture-energy-pharmaceutical CARTELS control almost everything through the regulatory agencies that are suppose to be the ones controlling them, a mutated facism where the corporations have taken over the state instead of vice versa.

There are many people today realizing they need to look back at history and make their way out into the land where they can live a more sustainable, comfortable, healthy life. In the US I even see a future split of government (most likely violent) between the orwellian highly controlled/regulated cities and the conservative freedom loving rural areas. Way off topic but I think because of tradition there will always be meat eaters but there is a chance of revolutionizing the agriculture industry as it is already happening.

I'm currently a (mostly) vegetarian, although I do sometimes eat seafood. I'm also trying to wean myself from dairy, no pun intended. I try very hard to eat only truly free-range eggs. For a couple of years I was following a primal/modified Paleo diet and eating quite a bit of meat. Before that I was trying to eat only locally sourced, organic meats. If I do go back to eating meat, that is what I will do again. I don't judge other individual's choices, but I do think the modern animal agriculture industry is extremely unhealthy for people and the planet/climate. And the animals suffer terribly and unnecessarily. And to me, respecting life is about alleviating suffering.

I have no problem with eating meat, but i think animals must be treated with dignity and respect (no unnecesary suffering in breeding and slaughtering). As it's already been said, it's a part of the circle of life. Only thing i don't see fit, is finding pleasure in killing. That is, hunting for food (like our ancestors did, like you can find in nature) i see as legitimate, but hunting for sport.... meh.

Djavik wrote: I see. Having been given these opinions it seems to me that it is a matter of perception. That all things consumed should be treated respectfully. I like this. But what of synthetic foods or junk foods?

So I suppose before eating it is viable to thank many people..the farmers, The Earth, etc...

Thank you guys for your opinions so far!

Makes me wonder about the Japanese phrase, "Itadakimasu."

I eat a minimum on meat because biological meat is very expensive here , i oppose bioindustry it breaks my heart how they treat animals , on chemical food i can say one thing , modified food makes me violently ill as some of you could read in chat i recently found out what projectile vomitting means :laugh: the cause was Hellmans mayonaise , a lot of modified ingredients in there. Every food should be treated with respect and prepared with respect , so you are mindfull of the blessing of food and how lucky you are that you have enough food. I dont like Monsanto and big compagnies taking over the food chain i see it as a gross offence against my human rights and i dont buy food from them , i buy local food and milk from farmers who let their cows frolic in the fields .. From my Jedi point of view i think that we should be consious of our food intake because our body is a temporary temple that should be kept in balance.

But sometimes , yeah sometimes , i really need to go to KFC :whistle:

I was vegetarian for about 15 years.

In the last year I came back to eating some meat, it just seemed right.

It's an individual decision but something which I believe all Jedi should at least consider. Whilst we have been eating meat for many thousands of years, we have only been able to produce nutritionally complete alternatives during the course of the last few decades, so that argument doesn't really hold water anymore.

We practiced slavery and thought the world was flat for thousands of years too, an idea's persistence doesn't provide an accurate measure of its value.

Whilst we have been eating meat for many thousands of years, we have only been able to produce nutritionally complete alternatives during the course of the last few decades, so that argument doesn't really hold water anymore.

I'm not following you logic? If people decide to eat alternatives more power to them, eat and be happy!

It was in response to:

Rickie wrote: What did people eat for thousands of years before you/we were born? Our bodies are no different now.

Our bodies aren't different; our food options are. If nothing else that calls for a reappraisal, and the idea that "well we've been doing it this way for thousands of years so why change?" speaks of complacency.

Regardless of your preference for eating meat, a visit to a high-yield factory farm would be enough to convince many who currently enjoy the ignorance of not having looked that we have our approach to getting it to the table rather wrong.

speaks of complacency.

our food options are

I understand the morality/health/socio-economic values of vegetarianism.

I see how we differ, I see it as biology and choice and not at all compliance.

I know others feel/believe otherwise. I leave them in peace to live their lives as they choose and have nothing negative to say about them. I don't impose my values on animal protein anywhere as near as much some vegetarians do.

I'd like to raise chickens and rabbits in my back yard some day.