A "religious" question.

Is it possible to be an Atheistic Jedi?

Yes. I'm an atheistic Jedi, in that I don't believe in any type of God.

If, however, when you use the term "atheistic", you are referring to Jedi who only believe that which has been scientifically proven, I think you may have a harder time finding them- they seem to be a slightly rarer breed of Jedi. While I don't believe in a God, I do believe in the Force. Which I think need not be seen as a supernatural belief, one can easily view the Force as one's inner compass.

Jediism places a large emphasis on inclusiveness; I see nothing in it's doctrine that is incompatible with atheism.

mariofan251 wrote: Is it possible to be an Atheistic Jedi?

Yep, I think there are quite a few here at the Temple. I might even be too, by some definitions of atheism or definition of a deity... perhaps.

Having been brought up a Catholic, it was hard for me to answer this question when I first came to the Temple. As my understanding grew of the Force, I became more clear on this question.

To be an Atheist means you believe in a god. In the Initiates program you will find the works of Joseph Campbell and Alan Watts. The idea here is that humans give names to ideas like good and bad, right and wrong. There can be no right if you don't know what wrong is, and there can be no good if you do not know what bad is. So in this context, In order for you not to believe in a god, one must exist.

Having said that, to be a Jedi does not require you to have a religion of one kind or another. In my interpretation, the Force Is, Always Was, Always Will Be. The energy field that binds all of nature, which includes humans, exists whether you believe in it or not.

My best suggestion is to complete the Initiates program and study more of the works of Alan Watts and Joseph Campbell. I have read from these two authors beyond the Initiates program and have found them very enlightening. I have also studied some Buddhist texts to enhance my understandings.

The most important thing I can tell you here is this:

It is your path to follow, do not take my word for this or anyone else's. We can help you on your journey, but the footsteps must be yours.

To be an Atheist means you believe in a god.

To clarify: To say you do not believe in a god means that you are inferring there is a god not to believe in. So to say you are Atheist means you believe there is a god.

I take this from the works of Joseph Campbell who states that we as humans created white to be opposite black, good to be opposite bad. There needs to be an opposite to Atheism and that is God.

So I say again, To be an Atheist means you believe there is a God to oppose you!

If I say I don't believe in unicorns that means that unicorns must exist? Or that Santa Clause must exist for me to believe he does not exist? I need a little help with that.

Anyway ...

Atheist means non-theist. There are non-theistic concepts of God. Deism or Pantheism for example. In common use generally a person who says they're an Atheist does not believe in any God.

Yes there are plenty of non-theistic Jedi.

Don't miss 7 Types of Non-Believers at http://www.alternet.org/story/155685/no_religion_7_types_of_non-believers_?page=entire .

Absolutely possible; especially because there are atheistic Jedi here.

Like Adder, I might be considered atheist under some definitions, but like Hypatia, I believe in the Force, too.

And with that...

MTFBWY,
LTK

I call myself an atheist Jedi (as I said in chat) so it is very much possible

I do not 'believe' in The Force as a matter of faith or trust in the existence of some kind of deity or higher power

My 'belief' in The Force is a viewpoint. A perspective and a way of looking at the world and how we are all interconnected. I do not believe there is some vaguely undefined (and scientifically unproven) 'energy field' but there are many Jedi and some do

We are all equal in our beliefs. We just present different perspectives. Much the same with any religion


The link for Br John didn't work for me some I'm reposting here:

http://www.alternet.org/belief/155685/no_religion_7_types_of_non-believers_/ (I think it's the same one but he might want to double check)

Thank you very much.

What I find beautiful is that there is belief, but not 'belief in' something ....

I would not say that I'm an atheist, nor not an atheist. It doesn't matter.

And science is a very shaky foundation for anything. Science is a practice, not an end of 'truth'. We can 'prove' something scientifically, yet the science of tomorrow 'proves' in another way that which was contrarily proven before, to a more or even less correctness, and so goes what on can 'believe in' from the foundations of science.

There's no need to 'prove' the Force, nor God, nor Tao, nor Winnie-the-Pooh scientifically. Physics, Aristotelian to current quantum or relativistic, should serve to calm one's faith in science.

Feel, don't think. Cultivate, don't calculate ...

Not to say that we should do without science -- it is just another human endeavour. That's all...

Belief does not require a physical presents. Unicorns and Santa clause do exist as fantasy creatures. Does God exist? Does the Force exist? It is not in the physical presents that all things exist.

As for Atheism vs non-theism, thank you for the lesson.

The Jedi are all but religious. Jediism is a philosophy not a religion. Faith based belief is stupidity, Experience based Faith is Wisdom. The Jedi don't follow the path of folly, if you follow such path I am at peace with it, but you follow it at your own peril

Alego Soule: The Jedi are all but religious1. Jediism is a philosophy not a religion. Faith based belief is stupidity, Experience based Faith is Wisdom2. The Jedi don't follow the path of folly, if you follow such path I am at peace with it, but you follow it at your own peril3

I'm sorry, but you are mistaken. We had a topic on this a couple weeks ago, and we do have a significant number of Jedi who view Jediism as a religion. And there is no problem with it.

I find your post ironic, you are making disparaging remarks against people who hold faith-based belief, yet you are doing the exact same thing that makes many atheists find religion so harmful. You sound just like the many religious extremists I've encountered in my life. Making sweeping generalizations about entire groups of people1, preaching that things are black and white2, telling people if you don't do things the way I think is best you will suffer3.

I understand where you are coming from- faith-based belief can be dangerous. However, it can also be harmless, even beneficial, it just depends on the breed of belief. To think all faith-based belief leads to peril is itself, I think, dangerous. Because it can lead to an extreme mindset. It can give one the idea that all faith-based belief is harmful, and so must be destroyed. Like how extremist Muslims believe kufr and shirk must be eradicated. This is just the flip side of the coin.

I'm sorry if I mistook anything you wrote. If I did, then obviously if you could clarify your beliefs, I would greatly appreciate it.

TOTJO is a church and that thing we do (for lack of a better word) is called Jediism. Nonetheless, those who personally want to call it a spiritual path are welcome as members.

If anyone really wants to have some fun please state the generally accepted definition of religion.

As I see it, Jediism is a path that could lead to some misunderstanding, but in its own right is not incorrect.

I believe that the Universe has a Perspective. And, its perspective is "like" omnipotence. I am also a Secular Buddhist Jedi, so when I say omnipotence, I am referring to the cessation of suffering through a Universal Perspective.

Jediism is a perspective. And, each person who practices it provides their OWN perspective in accordance with it, or they change it, or they add to it.

No matter your belief, you will find happiness if you are in accordance with the Perspective of the Universe. Compassion. Love. Selflessness. These are things of the Universe. So, Jediism ITSELF is not against this. But, some of the people that practice it (who treat the Force as a Deity) or those who reject all things Jedi in favor of self-gratification for noble deeds (like Vassels or Knights did in the Middle Ages and in the Feudal Japanese era) are NOT in accordance with a Universal Perspective and mar the Jedi Name.