A Jedi Retreat/Temple

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02 Jan 2017 19:08 #270868 by Gwinn
Replied by Gwinn on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple

Anison wrote: However, I do believe I said something like "I ask that you do not give me the same reasons it supposedly can't happen I have already heard".


To be fair, you didn't really specify what you had heard.

Anison wrote: Many of the responses were comprised of these reasons/excuses it can't/hasn't happened. Again, it will not be easy. Would its' location be an issue? Yes, always. Would it be hard to finance? Yes, always. These are things that well-known religions that have been around for centuries still fight with today. We have many disadvantages compared to them but that would only make our victory more rewarding.


My response contended that a concrete TOTJO location would not actually be a victory.

Anison wrote: I can not pretend I have not wondered if there is a higher possibility of succeeding in this endeavor on my own, at least at first. As a couple of you said (and in more simplified wording) "do it yourself". Clearly, I would not have taken the time to write all of this if I was not prepared to. Though if you think it would be hard for this Order to do it it shouldn't be hard to imagine how much harder it would be for me to alone. If this is the path I decide to take and am fortunate enough to be able to go through with it, I hope that I will be able to call on this Order to help me when I need it.


It is not the mission of this Order to build a location. It should be fairly obvious by now that the majority of leadership and members here are more interested in building people rather than structures.

Anison wrote: I have a lot to think about. I am in love with the vibrancy of this community. For now, I will seek to learn as much as I can about Jediism through the materials available here. I will improve on my patience and one day perhaps myself and like minded individuals will reach a position from which we can make our wildest dreams come true.


I hope you do!

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02 Jan 2017 20:16 #270873 by Anison
Replied by Anison on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
This will be my last post about this. It seems to have had a counterproductive, unintended effect. I am saddened by this because I only meant well.

I will start with steamboat28: Primarily, I would urge you to be careful of what state your mind is in when you post.

What you really mean is that you have a fundamental misunderstanding of why this hasn't happened yet.

I have not misunderstood a thing. I understand it completely and have done research on both this site and the internet as a whole.

You don't know how often or how long this has been discussed

I have seen some of the dated forum posts. Like I said, it surprises me how long it has been discussed.

you don't know what kind of infrastructure would be required to acquire and maintain even the smallest permanent site, nor the logistics necessary to staff or finance it. You didn't bring a plan, you didn't offer suggestions, you didn't even really give reasons why it's necessary.

Details at this point, at least for me, are unnecessary. I am not of a rank (at this time) with the kind of influence where a plan and finite details are useful to post. So instead, I wish to simply keep the conversation alive. Though, as I mentioned above I did not intend for it to take the turn it has. The very last part of this statement is incorrect. I have.

All you did was barge in

I do not view what I have done as barging in. Registering here and starting to become involved has taken some time and thought. Of which, I am sure there is to be much more of.

All you did was barge in and tell us that we can't possibly be serious about this because we haven't solved this "problem" yet.

I think that you are all very serious and it is a part of why I joined. Look at what you all have done. It is no small feat and I envy it.

Do some legwork and realize why we haven't before you dismiss "the same reasons" you've heard before. Those reasons exist because they're good ones.

"Legwork" is an ironic way of putting it but I get your point. I am doing and have been doing research into this. Yes, I realize these are all good reasons. I am not dismissing them. Though as I stated, there will always be good reasons.

Arisaig:
I agree with you completely. The temple, first and foremost, should be of the mind and body. However, as this website has forged a strong community with deep ties, can you imagine the exponential effect a physical Temple would have on this? That idea is what drives me on this topic.

Br. John:
I sent you a private message about this. Though I am sure your inbox must be a busy one so I will answer here as well. Firstly, I would like to thank you for pointing this out to me. I am sure the invitation is open to all but to have a high ranking member such as yourself point it out to me is gratifying since I am sure you have many other things to attend to. Unfortunately, I live in the southeastern United States and am in college. I will make my best attempt to make it. I would love to meet fellow members face to face. That is part of the allure of a Temple in my opinion.

(This is directed to all reading this.) Before it happens, do not use my reasoning for possibly not being able to make it to the meet as an example regarding the Temple. If I am not able to make it, I will still gladly donate what I can to help the meet happen. I plan on donating anyways.

Gwinn:

To be fair, you didn't really specify what you had heard.

I do not need to specify. Anyone who has done their research into this matter knows what the typical reasons are.

My response contended that a concrete TOTJO location would not actually be a victory.

I completely disagree and am confused as to why you think a real Temple would not be a victory for us.

It is not the mission of this Order to build a location. It should be fairly obvious by now that the majority of leadership and members here are more interested in building people rather than structures.

We should always be more focused on building people rather than buildings themselves. What would a Temple be without true Jedi to station it? I think we already have true Jedi though. From here, the Temple is a means to that end. To better ourselves and others as best we can. There is no better way to do that than in person at a place built/acquired for that purpose.


As my subject for this post states, I will not be responding again. The original post has caused the opposite of what I intended and it seems my efforts are not helping it recover. I only meant to keep the idea alive and get us all thinking on its' possibility again. To any who might agree with me on this rest assured I am not giving up on it. Whether it is with this Orders help or without I will do the best I can to make it happen. Even if I fail, I will be glad I tried.

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02 Jan 2017 20:36 #270879 by Rosalyn J
Replied by Rosalyn J on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
Alright sir,

Reasons have been given as to why this has not happened, but you don't seem to mind those. We could probably get through them with a bit of tenacity don't you think?

Well then, what would be the first step?

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02 Jan 2017 20:44 #270883 by Sirch Nayr
Replied by Sirch Nayr on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
As a new person here myself, I too would like to see a physical temple of some kind. I don't bring it up too often because of the backlash I've seen the topic get from the community, but I can't say they are all wrong in saying it's not time.

One argument I've seen is that we're too sparsely populated to have a temple be of any use. That's true in most ways, but I have the opinion that if you get one or two charismatic people who know the TOTJO doctrine to attend and open the temple to the public for speeches, demonstrations, guided meditations and the like you would slowly start to develop a member base in that area that would grow rather large.

Funding is a real concern for everybody, hell I can barely afford groceries. What I've seen many people seem to misunderstand is that the temple should be beautiful, but it does not need to start off that way. You can rent commercial property for a few thousand a month or less depending on the area. While that seems like a lot for one person, a communal effort would make this very affordable. Even more so if apparel and other materials were sold in store. Cranking up the old youtube channel would also be a great stream of revenue and popularity, and while many members here already post great content, I know there is more to be done on that front that I would be happy to get into eventually when I'm more qualified to speak on such matters.

Another argument I've seen against the Idea of a physical temples is that it would be self serving instead of helping the community. That's not necessarily incorrect, but I'm a believer that a future temple could have a dual use to bring people from that community into Jediism while also hosting food drives, blanket/water drives, and other charitable acts through the attendees and word of mouth. A totally isolated temple has its appeal, but I agree that it wouldn't do anybody any good and we should instead keep our focus on things that will more directly help people like our mission tends to state ( I'm not an expert). Maybe a retreat style temple could be considered once we have the infrastructure and populace needed to pull off such a thing without our various charities suffering, but it would be quite a while.

I know it's hard to have a great picture of what things can look like in a perfect world, it's something I am constantly thinking about. It's just a bit far off from being a reality at this point. What I'm reading from some of these posts is that people aren't necessarily against the Idea of physical temples for the long term and I think that's great. As annoying as this topic might be for some people who have been here a while, I hope it keeps getting brought up.

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02 Jan 2017 20:53 #270887 by Rosalyn J
Replied by Rosalyn J on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
Well, why don't those of us who want a physical temple begin to plan what it might look like and where it might be and all of the logistics of it

I would caution us though that the Jedi and Jediism in general is not an original idea. We need to tread lightly on the intellectual property of Disney as it relates to copyright or we will be sued before we can get off the ground

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02 Jan 2017 20:56 #270888 by Strider
Replied by Strider on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
It sounds super exciting and interesting, having a hidden, peaceful place of gathering for quiet training and meditation would be amazing. But I do think the entire world is our "temple", from my viewpoint anyway. Still, a quiet safe-haven for us to study and meditate in would be great.

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02 Jan 2017 20:58 #270889 by Sirch Nayr
Replied by Sirch Nayr on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
I've just recently become a part of Jediism, so I've heard that Disney and George Lucas could do some things to us, but I'm just unsure just how far they could go. Is "jedi" a trademark that could come back to us if we try to sell merch or brand a building? I am a bit foggy on that whole situation.

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02 Jan 2017 21:53 #270902 by Kohadre
Replied by Kohadre on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple

JamesSand wrote: For what it's worth Anison,

This Member has established a lovely little temple in central Australia. It has a comfy room for sleeping, another for private contemplation, somewhere to prepare and enjoy delicious meals, and even a spot to conduct a little physical exercise. It has a Garden with herbs and some staples.

It's all round quite lovely actually.

I know that's not what you want, but you can imagine as a humble fellow living in the *deep south*, neither uprooting myself to assist, or sending my resources to a far away land to build some a Temple has little appeal :)

I do admire your fervour though, and would be keen to see your research on available land and building designs in a location of best fit (I believe there is a user map somewhere that could be a guide)


God I hate ANT threads.

As JamesSand has stated in his post, some members here have created their own small-scale local temples. I'm in the process of saving up for and finding a contractor to build a small monastery made up of several individual cabins and land for homesteading.

It's not going to be TOTJO branded though, because reasons.

Reason 1: I'm not clergy here
Reason 2: I'm not a knight, or apprentice
Reason 3: TOTJO doesn't endorse or encourage monastic practice as part of it's overall faith structure
Reason 4: I'm funding the project, so I don't want a bureaucratic mess (TOTJO politics) interfering with the design I've chosen should I choose to brand it within the TOTJO legal identity.
Reason 5: Nobody seems to want to support a temple project unless its literally in their backyard.

Remember the doctrine; embody the code.
Live the creed; embrace the 16 teachings.
Honor your vows.
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02 Jan 2017 22:25 #270907 by tzb
Replied by tzb on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
Most who have been Jedi for a while and have used that time to study the Force deeply don't feel we need a physical Temple. If this were not the case, we'd have one. The barriers are not so insurmountable.

Given the time and effort which will be required to set one up, why not first go through that same process yourself, and discover whether there is a reason for that incredibly unlikely and surprising coincidence?

(There is.)

You're hearing it, repeatedly, acknowledging it even... but you're not really seeing it. It's also the reason it's primarily very recent members of this faith who pursue this idea. A majority, I'd go so far as estimating. Yet, given time, understanding removes that desire.

You can't be told. You have been. You need to learn the reason we don't have or want a physical Temple yourself. Please, devote your time wisely.

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02 Jan 2017 23:29 #270919 by Sirch Nayr
Replied by Sirch Nayr on topic A Jedi Retreat/Temple
I see a temple as something more for external development rather than internal development that can be done anywhere.

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