Best martial art?

parkour would be a really cool place to start, sure

the first condition of being an effective fighter is fitness and the next is the confidence to go one hundred with whatever youre doing, and parkour would help develop both
i would say those are maybe more important than anything else - having those you have a chance of winning even if your technique isnt great, but if youre out of shape and timid then your technique might never even have a chance to work

BOXING

my opinion about self defense is that boxing is the best place to start FOR MOST PEOPLE

reasons

1) every boxing program is going to get you fit (you may have to take responsibility for your own self motivation at first because trainers like to work with people who are actually fighting
so as a newbie, DEPENDING ON WHERE YOU TRAIN, you may be somewhat on your own for a while

but you will have access to the information and equipment that you need to move forward and people will be watching and if you stick with it they tend to appear when youre ready, generally

2) youll learn how to move and control distance

from a certain perspective, boxing is more about your feet (and then your core) than it is about your hands

unless youre like three times taller than the other person, if they have good footwork and good head movement and you dont, theyll get the better end of things

with just being fit and able to move around well youll have a huge advantage over about half to two thirds of the guys you see out and about (with some conditions; weight classes exist for a reason and experience is better than enthusiasm as a general rule)

you get this with kickboxing too, PLUS you get kicks, so you might wonder why i suggest boxing and not kickboxing to begin with - simple - BECAUSE there are no kicks!

this is probably going to be a long post regardless so i wont say too much on the issue of kicks in a SD situation except that

3) generally speaking hands are more intuitive and comfortable, and therfore it is faster to get effective with your hands

and

4) because you *only hit with your hands, there is much less to learn but its still very effective for self defense

and if youre training footwork well, you should find that your punching gets better pretty much in time with your moving around

and punching works!

and once you get some basic foundations set you will be able to spar

in a boxing gym, the word "sparring" might throw you off if youre from a traditional MA - there is "light contact" sparring, but,

5) when you spar in boxing you are hitting and getting hit, and this it will toughen you into someone who can handle the physicality of fighting

you do NOT get that kind of sparring in very many tma dojo (here in the states)

everyones pace is different
when a youre fit and you move decent and your punches are crisp, thats when i would say to open it up with kickboxing

KICKBOXING

muay thai and american kick boxing and french savate are all very good kickbox systems - savate does not use clinch work which is too bad because otherwise its really great

boxing will introduce you to clinch work, kick boxing will teach you how to make it really dangerous

this point i would say its also time to get into

GRAPPLING

at least learn the basics of staying on your feet, changing position if you do go to ground and then how to get back up

for submissions i would say learn a couple chokes, a couple arm bars and shoulder locks and a couple wrist locks and wrist compressions and maybe one or two leg or ankle locks

some people dont have the body type to be as mobile or quite as crisp with striking - theyre more like bears or boars and theyll do better to charge in and grab a hold

for these guys its better to start with the submission systems and then go to the striking imo

whats really going to be important is your mindset regardless of what or where you train

when you get in to grappling youre going to find a bunch of choices

IMO the order goes
japanese jujutsu and aiki jujutsu and korean hapkido all make up a group
and and then catch wrestling, followed by sambo and then and then judo and then bjj after that aikido

bjj gets all the good press because of its effectiveness on the ground

and it is arguably the best system for ground fighting

but HAVING to go to ground is not good imo- yes it teaches some stand up - but stand up is where the other systems are all better

still, all of those are good in their own right - but -its important to remember that (except for most aikdo) these systems all have competitions in which other systems are not allowed to participate - and so much of the training is not geared specifically to SD but rather to competition against others who will be using the same tactics

bjj and catch wrestling and i think sambo as well have MMA and SD mini communities which are quite good

this does make a difference in certain ways - more or less depending on where you train and how you train

but any training is theoretically better than no training

most aikido does not compete, but there is something which i think began with tomiki aikido where they have a competition based on a knife attack - one guy gets a wooden tanto and tries to stab the other guy in the chest

if you do two web searches - one on aikido knife tournaments and one on real life knife attacks (not that its strictly necessary or appropriate for everyone to see that right away) what you find is that they look absolutely nothing alike

which brings me to my problem with

AIKIDO

aikido has got perfectly valid techniques for dealing with knife attacks and pretty much any attack that involves someone putting their hands near you

theres even some kick defense although its not a lot

but very few aikido dojo actually train to be able to fight

this is the importance of competition

judo is a good example of a martial art which is more sport oriented than sd oriented and as a consequence has a fair share of stuff thats really not too good from SD side of things - and yet -because the techniques do actually work and because they train to really use them against someone who wontplay along, someone with good judo background will be able to handle themself just fine in most sd instances (especially if they have cross trained in boxing or kb)

whereas there are maybe thousands of aikido black belts who would not be able to protect themselves from anyone on the offensive line at the average american high school

most people, including most aikidoka, dont actually understand the concept of AIKI as it distinguished itself in aiki-jujutsu

we have the flowery sort of "way of harmony" ideas and the "mystical ki energy" ideas which have been really exaggerated by westerners

O'sensei was very well responsible for the beginning of this but there is the hugely significant cultural movement of japanese expansionism and what we think of as WW2

as well as O'sensei's personal life experience and ties to shinto that all worked together to make the context for his aikido
and which to a great extent is totally overlooked in how we in the west understand it

ki in aikido is really not the same as chi in tai chi -or it wasnt, originally

imo aikido is great if you find a good dojo
but that is a challenge; i willsay i am impressed with "tenshin" aikido

but no matter what you do you have to take responsibility for your own training

KRAV MAGA
is an excellent system for S.D. and for fitness -its really one of the best imo

PANKRATION

less well known is pankration, modelled after the system used by the ancient greeks

which is one of the first systems which we would recognize as "MMA"

its not widely known but it was highly influencial in opening peoples minds to the concept of mixed martial arts

CAPOEIRA

capoiera is great for fitness and awesomeness - it looks super cool and carves your body into something powerful, fast and limber, and some of thekicks are absolutely devastating

much the same for wushu in general, as has been mentioned

KUNG FU AND QIGONG

shaolin kung fu has a lot of actual competetive fighters as well as having a deep philosophical perspective

its pretty much par for the course to do qigong energy and breath work if you study shaolin

and qigong and tai chi are definitely good for general health and mental focus and since they are CHI based systems, if you belive in energy work (which i do) then these are definitely things to look at

NINJA

ninjutsu is a system which is vulnerable to a lot of b.s. but has some really good stuff if you dont get pulled in to thejibberish

i wasnt really impressed with hatsumi sensei, in all honesty,but steven k hayes did serve for a while as security adviser for the dalai lama and hes a smart guy so theres merit there

AKBAN NINJA

for anyone interested in ninjutsu i specifically recommend looking into AKBAN (yosi sherrif is probably the most well known name)
those guys are doing some good stuff

theres russian systema - im not really impressed for the most part - i think sambo is way way better

but
systema is advocating that it has fresh insight into ways of striking - one example is what they call "the wave" - which is worth keeping up with

just dont buy anything from them (imo)

KOREAN ARTS

the first time i heard the term "mcdojo" it was in reference to taikwondo, which had developed a reputation as pretty much being a day care that gave out black belts for good behavior

that being said - tkd was the first art i was ever involved in and i was fortunate to go to a really good dojo and the founation i got there has masted a lifetime

tkd does with kicking what boxers do with punching

look up tkd knockouts if youre unsure

HAPKIDO
hapkido is pretty impressive grappling/striking system which is essentially a fusion of akijujutsu and korean kicking philosophy

and many tkd dojo also train hapkido

there are a couple other korean arts like tang soo do and kuk sool won which have some following outside of korea but i couldnt venture an opinion on how effective they would be except to say that korean arts arts are pretty damn good from what ive seen so long as you take the training seriously

FILLIPINO ARTS

like kali, escrima, arnis are weapon arts

they have empty hand techniques but they are weapon based systems and its important to understand that when you watch them

they are good lol

fillipinos probably have the most well developed knife fighting techniques in the world and possibly the best "rope" style flexible weapon techniques

by extension they also have very good knife counter techniques


BRUCE LEE

jeet kune do was the system developed originally by bruce lee and refined by dan inosanto who had a wide range ofmartial background, including phillipino arts

lee was originally a wing chun practitioner but he was one of the very first really well known people to promote the idea of mixed martial arts - which is basically what jeet kune do was intended as

"absorb what is useful, discard what is not, add what is uniquely your own"

its got a strong wing chun influence but there are a lot of other influences as well

one thing jkd did to really contribute to M.A. was to coin the term "alive" as a method of training

to train ALIVE means to train in a way that is as realistic as safety will allow

one thing i can tell you about jkd people is that they are always fit

im sure it exists but i have never seen an out of shape looking jkd instructor

ir even advanced students

they might be BIG - but they are big and FIT
which says a lot for the art

well, i feel like i am missing some but this is a pretty broad overview i think

sorry for the length
i hope someone gets something useful out of this cause it took FOREVER to write lol

duh i forgot karate lol
some karate styles hold full contact competitions and any time people are allowed to knock each other unconscious the results are that people learn to knock people unconscious

"karate" is perfectly fine as for self defense if you train to fight

if you train to look cool then as long as you dont ever get in a fight youll be fine

some of them are integrating grappling into their systems but none are really strong with this except for kenpo/kempo which may have aquired their locking and throwing techniques from aikijujutsu

lyoto machida is a well know karate based fighter (i think kyukushin)

MMA

mma just means mixed martial arts which is as open as it sounds

you could scour the internet for all the techniques you think are legit and put them together and there you go, youre mma

boxing, (muay thai) kick boxing, brazilian juijitsu and greco roman wrestling make up the most common mix for what usually gets taught at gyms that advertise "mma"

brazilian jui jitsu philosophy is to control POSITION
basically who is on top and who is on bottom

this is not a comprehensive analysis lol

the heart of bjj strategy is to weather the storm of their aggression safely as possible, get a superior position, achieve a submission

because of how effective bjj players are from the guard postion specifically and from ground fighting in general, imo its THE BEST style for women to protect themselves from sexual assault

its also one of the very very few styles that actually lives up to the claim that you dont have to be bigger or stronger for the techniques to work

a lot of styles say that but its really not true most of the time

apologies for the triple post but i felt this was important to add

corrections; spelling is taekwondo not taikwondo and korean arts usually refer to their place of training as dojang not dojo

since im writing this i may as well add

krav maga is really good for weapon disarms

"combat jujutsu" is awesome AND amazing and most things are neither so thats good

capoeira also gets you ready to hit the clubs with some funky dance moves and there is a community of capoeirists who are fighting full contact events

even though i think sd is best for most to start with boxing, if i had to choose between a striking system and a grappling system and there was no integration (except for what the system itself taught) ultimately i would choose a grappling system

pankration is probably the best "mma" system because historical pankration is very very fragmented

most of the original greek techniques and training was lost

so jim arvantis, when he basically invented modern pankration (late 60s/early70s), borrowed heavily from other styles and effectively developed "MMA" into a single system - "MMA" would not be what it is today without Arvantis

his original background was greco roman wrestling, western boxing, french savate, and judo

so basically he was mma before mma existed

As a general rule I try to stay out of these discussions, but this one has dragged on and on for quite a while now.

There is no best martial art. The problems people have with any art of this nature, lies within their own understanding of the arts. The art is not the problem, the way they use it is. The amount of training they actually put into it is. It doesn't matter if you have a blackbelt in any of these systems of fighting, if you don't actually know how to defend yourself. There is a huge differemce between a mat and a bunch of rules designed to keep people safe, and an actual fight. I'm worthless on a mat in a tournament, but I can hold my own and often protect myself out on the streets better than most people who have any kind of rank in any system.

You can always learn from everyone, on any thing, and when it comes to fighting, the whole reason for martial arts, is to not fight.

That is the ultimate aim of the study of these arts.

~Calanon

Calanon wrote: As a general rule I try to stay out of these discussions, but this one has dragged on and on for quite a while now.

There is no best martial art. The problems people have with any art of this nature, lies within their own understanding of the arts. The art is not the problem, the way they use it is. The amount of training they actually put into it is. It doesn't matter if you have a blackbelt in any of these systems of fighting, if you don't actually know how to defend yourself. There is a huge differemce between a mat and a bunch of rules designed to keep people safe, and an actual fight. I'm worthless on a mat in a tournament, but I can hold my own and often protect myself out on the streets better than most people who have any kind of rank in any system.

You can always learn from everyone, on any thing, and when it comes to fighting, the whole reason for martial arts, is to not fight.

That is the ultimate aim of the study of these arts.

~Calanon

If I may be so free, why would someone learn marterial arts, if he/she is learning to never use it? It sounds like a contradiction. I feel confused.. :blush:

Aqua wrote:

Calanon wrote: As a general rule I try to stay out of these discussions, but this one has dragged on and on for quite a while now.

There is no best martial art. The problems people have with any art of this nature, lies within their own understanding of the arts. The art is not the problem, the way they use it is. The amount of training they actually put into it is. It doesn't matter if you have a blackbelt in any of these systems of fighting, if you don't actually know how to defend yourself. There is a huge differemce between a mat and a bunch of rules designed to keep people safe, and an actual fight. I'm worthless on a mat in a tournament, but I can hold my own and often protect myself out on the streets better than most people who have any kind of rank in any system.

You can always learn from everyone, on any thing, and when it comes to fighting, the whole reason for martial arts, is to not fight.

That is the ultimate aim of the study of these arts.

~Calanon

If I may be so free, why would someone learn marterial arts, if he/she is learning to never use it? It sounds like a contradiction. I feel confused.. :blush:

All the founders of the arts taught them as a method to keep peace. They train to reach the point where they don't have to fight. They are taught for self discipline, self respect, respect of others, health, etc..

I do not take pride in my ability to be violent. I'm really good at it. But The only reason I have ever felt the need to use it is for defense of myself and my family. I abhor violence, and wish for peace, but you can't just have peace by avoiding violence. Sometimes you have to use it. It is a sad day when you have to. But sometimes it is necessary.
Read The Art of Peace by Morihei Ueshiba.

Aqua wrote:

Calanon wrote: If I may be so free, why would someone learn marterial arts, if he/she is learning to never use it? It sounds like a contradiction. I feel confused.. :blush:

i train because i want to
because i like it
maybe my liking it and doing it is a result of who i am, but who i am is also a result of liking and doing it

i dont hope never to use the things that i learn - i train with the understanding that there are probably still moments ahead where it will fall on me to use what i train

for myself or someone else
and my hope is that i dont back down or fall short in some way

someone - i cant remember who - has a sig that says something like "the brave men didnt kill the dragons, the brave men rode them"

im riding one of my dragons

Calanon wrote:

Aqua wrote:

Calanon wrote: As a general rule I try to stay out of these discussions, but this one has dragged on and on for quite a while now.

There is no best martial art. The problems people have with any art of this nature, lies within their own understanding of the arts. The art is not the problem, the way they use it is. The amount of training they actually put into it is. It doesn't matter if you have a blackbelt in any of these systems of fighting, if you don't actually know how to defend yourself. There is a huge differemce between a mat and a bunch of rules designed to keep people safe, and an actual fight. I'm worthless on a mat in a tournament, but I can hold my own and often protect myself out on the streets better than most people who have any kind of rank in any system.

You can always learn from everyone, on any thing, and when it comes to fighting, the whole reason for martial arts, is to not fight.

That is the ultimate aim of the study of these arts.

~Calanon

If I may be so free, why would someone learn marterial arts, if he/she is learning to never use it? It sounds like a contradiction. I feel confused.. :blush:

All the founders of the arts taught them as a method to keep peace. They train to reach the point where they don't have to fight. They are taught for self discipline, self respect, respect of others, health, etc..

I do not take pride in my ability to be violent. I'm really good at it. But The only reason I have ever felt the need to use it is for defense of myself and my family. I abhor violence, and wish for peace, but you can't just have peace by avoiding violence. Sometimes you have to use it. It is a sad day when you have to. But sometimes it is necessary.
Read The Art of Peace by Morihei Ueshiba.

I have trained for many years in several arts of budo and kobudo, but the more I learned the more emotional I developed.. I do not wish to fight or hit anyone ever again. Fighting gives me not so happy feelings, makes me a feeling like hurting people for selfish reasons.
I have respect for you that you are capable to do it, not every person is the same. And I guess the world needs a little bit of everything..

Thank you for your explanation.

taekwondo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPVuC6ugmAw