Spiritual agnostic talks.

This thread is for those that have a political debate,
for life plus meaning. In respects I like to use Creator
or energy. Can use god or gods.

I believe mankind is captive on earth and we are
far from knowing the galaxy. Also my belief
is sole responsible for fate. Science is a part of
evolution. That's my start. Add some insight whatsoever,
of personal view.

I consider myself an Agnostic as well, friend. I think there was most likely some divine creator, but as far as what or who it was, I firmly believe we cannot possibly know what / who it is. There is no overwhelming proof for any one religion to be true, so therefore how can we rationally justify its validity? If the answer is "faith" that the religion is true, and that one's god is true, it is simply preposterous. That logic could be applied to anyone anywhere on any belief and it would work. You could raise a child up from birth telling him that there were 3 gods, a cat, a dog, and bird, and each had his respective realms and jobs, and tell that child that the only proof he needs to the existence of these gods is his "faith" that they are real, and in my opinion, it would be foolish of that child to believe in the triad of pets that he was taught were gods as a child. Am I the only one who thinks this way? And I apologize if I offend anyone, that is absolutely not my intention, I merely am submitting my beliefs as so many others regularly do.

“You should never doubt what no one is sure about”

Willy Wonka from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory

A fine quote, and absolutely true. Sometimes I am not a very eloquent speaker despite my doomed attempts to be so. I don't think in my last rant I managed to actually illustrate my point correctly. I am not saying these things are wrong, and I am not saying they are bad things to believe I truly think religion of any kind (not of a destructive nature) maintains and upkeep the psyche. My original point, however, is that I believe that there is no reason to believe one way or another. I believe no one is completely justified in believing in their faith, and that I am not sure if I admire, envy, or pity those with absolute faith in a religion based around things we cannot possibly know.

EDIT:
After reading through this, I find that I am still quite in opposition to that quote Br. John, and I guess that makes me somewhat of a liar from my first statements, however I think it solidifies me as an Agnostic in saying "I don't know, and I don't think anyone does." This is, of course, my reason for coming to the temple in the first place. I seek what I think every man must at some point in his life: Answers.

Even if we know the answer... will we be satisfied with it?

Let A(x) be a proposition that is either true or false.
Let the set of entities thinking about A(x) only contain entities who are processing this algorithm.
Let application of Wonka's quote be a duty proper. Let B be the name of that duty.
Let i be a counting index set to 0 at the outset.
Let m be a user-defined variable. Let m equal infty, if no value is specified

1. I am not sure of proposition A(x).
2. From 1 and B: I do not doubt proposition A(x).
3. From 2: Two options:
   • (a) I absolutely reject proposition A(x) completely. Followed by 4.
   • (b) I absolutely accept proposition A(x). Let A(x) be called D(x) henceforth. Followed by 5.
4. (a)' I now completely accept proposition not-A(x). Let not-A(x) be called D(x) henceforth.
5. By contraposition of duty B: Since I am now sure of D(x), I must come to doubt D(x).
6. From 5: I am now not sure of proposition D(x).
7. I rename D(x) to A(x).
8. Increase counting index i to i+1.
   
9. Abort algorithm if counting index exceeds the value of m.
   
10. Return to step 1.

First we have to admit we don't know what we don't know. Then we take our best guess.

We are insignificant spects in the cosmos. That's our place. There are things greater than us that we can't imagine.

We are insignificant spects in the cosmos. That's our place. There are things greater than us that we can't imagine.

This speck, isnt insignificant to me. Not at all. Our place is not out there in any case. I do not have a third person view, but first person view, and here, everything is significant, or people wouldnt worry about this little speck and our species continued existence on it.

Best to admit what we do know so we can know what we dont, so we can admit that.

As it is, the average person doesnt truly know how ignorant they may be, because they have no idea how much we arent.

Khaos wrote:

Best to admit what we do know so we can know what we dont, so we can admit that.

As it is, the average person doesnt truly know how ignorant they may be, because they have no idea how much we arent.

I think we are on the same page. I just don't see myself as the center. Center of my life yes but still a speck in the big picture. Just a matter of perspective and a view of self importance. To each their own. I can't say who is wrong just what I believe.