No true scotsmen

if intelligent people can come to a general consensus of what it means to be a warrior

or what it means to be a shaman

or what it means to be a pagan

or what it means to b a soldier

or what it means to be a scientist

or what it means to be a role model

or what it means to be an environmentalist

or what it means to be an activist in general

or what it means to be a healer

or what it means to be a scholar

there may be some room for interpretation in some of these examples

the boundaries may be fairly broad

but there are boundaries which can be agreed on in every case

therefore a general consensus on what it means to be a jedi is plausible, possible, and appropriate

for it to mean anything doesnt it have to mean something?

im curious why a standard definition is not accepted?

i understand that its not appropriate to impose ones defition on other per se - but its only when things are defined that they have definite meaning

i see promotion of the idea that no consensus can be reached and i find that curious

if you dont have a clear definition for yourself of what a jedi is then how can you say that you are one?

with this many people if everyone has a clear definition then why cant a consensus be agreed?

i think because not everyone will agree on everything and by the time you filter through everything to find something that everyone agrees on it may only be 1 thing....and that isn't very definitive....to be definitive requires more than just 1 point of agreement....

by then that one thing is likely to be: a jedi is a jedi....

skills

attributes

functions

ninja have specific skills

saiyens and super saiyens have specific attributes

doctors and therapists have specific functions

"cant never could do nothin"

as an old redneck used to say

There is no requirement for the differentia to be numerous for the definition to be coherent, or 'definitive'. A feminist is somebody who believes in equivalence of the genders in social and legal matters. Nothing more to it. An atheist is somebody who is not convinced that any actual deities really exist. Nothing more to it. Not every label can be narrowed down this easily, of course. A Christian might be no more than somebody who values and partially follows the teaching of Jesus of Nazareth, but it is difficult to claim that that would be 'only' one thing, given that those teachings are in turn numerous and have a number of independant propositions about the nature of physical and metaphysical reality and moral dictates. Being social democrat involves an entire ideo-political construct, more complex still. But all of those labels can have perfectly coherent definitions irrespective of the number of necessary differentia.

And there is nothing to be lost in searching for that one point of agreement, that one defining thing all Jedi share, either. If anything, there is something to be gained from that: We could, in principle, be rid of the constant and unending questions over what is and is not a Jedi or what a Jedi thing to do would be, and we could use the label to refer to just those few things and not presume that it be enough to describe who we individually are as a person or that the sum of our personal stances can be expressed through it alone. If that's what 'Jedi' means to you, for all the information you communicate you might as well call yourself 'Me'.

Because the more narrow the definitions the greater the limitations. Many Jedi are here specifically because they are encouraged to define for themselves what being a Jedi means. No body wants to be rejected or be responsible for the rejection.

It would establish a duality, separating the community. That is what a standard definition would do. To accept it would be to accept dismissal, exclusion and derision. Enemies of Jedi would be born from it.

"jedi are guardians of peace in the galaxy"

this is a function

"jedi use their powers to defend and protect"

this is a function and an attribute which require specific skills, depending on the context

"jedi respect all life, in every form"

this is an attribute although it translates into a function

"jedi serve others"

this is a function

"rather than ruling over them"

this is makes it also an attribute

"jedi seek to improve themselves through knowledge and training"

this is an attribute which results in skills

skills then make functions possible



are we guardians of peace?

how?

who do we protect?

in what ways do we protect them?

what powers do we use/need in order to do this?

who are we serving and how are we serving them?

do we rule ourselves?

what knowledge and what training do we use to improve ourselves?

That is just it: Every one of those questions can be answered with "depends on the circumstances of the individual Jedi in question."

i get what youre saying rugadd and i agree that definitions need to be broad enough to he inclusive - a good leadership principle for instance is that the only useless team member is the one who isnt willing to work; everyone else can help the team to succeed


but if we dont have some basic foundation there is no team lol

i agree also that many peiople are "here" or wherever in order to define what a jedi means - but if ten thousand people run around with different definitions and living their definitions in wasy inconsistent with each other then none of them really are anything in terms of unity

its definitions which makea thing what it is

surely someone has come up with a functional understanding of what it means and requires to be a jedi by now?

if notthen are you doing a very good job of it?
how would.you know?

ok, so lets pick one and explore it

what does it mean to be a guardian of peace
and what are some tangible ways of living up to that function?

OB1Shinobi wrote: ok, so lets pick one and explore it

what does it mean to be a guardian of peace
and what are some tangible ways of living up to that function?

how does one define peace...each persons definition varies to some extent....for me peace is being calm, in control of myself. it also means an absence of violence...

peace can be obtained through violence, through negotiation, through intimidation, through manipulation...
war, diplomacy,posturing,paperwork....