Physical TOTJO Temple in Texas Project

Jamie Stick wrote:

The Owl wrote:

Jestor wrote: I'm no lawyer, lol...

I was informed as long as we are not "for profit" we were left alone...

Those sites, zazzle and cafe press are "for profit" sites...

For more info, I'll defer to Br. John, lol....

I see where the contradiction lies. The religion being NFP is allowed to generate income but not so much that it would be deemed a for profit enterprise.

Not quite, a non-profit organization is a corporation like many others, except that it has no shares and no shareholders. It isn't publicly traded, but it is held accountable to the public (anyone can request an accounting of TOTJO's financial holdings). Board members, directors, and officers of a non-profit cannot receive compensation, but managers, administrative staff, and such are allowed to receive decent salaries. Basically, a non-profit is headed by a board of volunteers.

Source: legal dictionary

However there is a thin line between a decent salary and what is deemed excessive. That is to say if any member receives more than is "justified" they would be there for reward and thus the whole thing deemed a for profit exercise. There was someone disputing a church officials salary in the paper not so long ago. As for the "justified" salary I have no idea how they work that out.

Lol....

Off topic, and we are all volunteer...

Forgiveness if this has been brought up, I did not get a chance to read through the pages, let me share with you my thoughts, if you will...

The Temple has a logo, which works for us, and in turn works in the same effect as any other copyrighted logo...

I find copyright infringement would be in affect is if we attempted to sell a product without the consent of the owner of the Star Wars franchise, which we explicitly state we are unaffiliated with...
Take the toy makers for example, they make Star Wars toys to sell, for profit, they either got the consent, or bought the use to put the name on the package... We are chump change, pennies, compared to the massive franchise universe of Star Wars, if we shown significant profit from using the word Jedi, I suppose I could see a legal issue... Still, we do not market the temple Jedi, as the Star Wars Jedi... Our logo, is not the Star Wars logo...

There's a band called Jedi Mind Trick so with that in mind and the fact that Jediism is a recognized religion there shouldn't be any legal issues with using the word. Besides, I would say that the word has crossed into public domain, a cultural concept, because it has become synonymous with someone extraordinarily skilled. Of course, a disclaimer stating the lack of affiliation with the Star Wars brand would probably be a good idea.

A Temple would be beautiful but I think it's hard to "just" plan and do, it's a thing that needs to grow organically by people meeting regularly, increasing in numbers and from that build the new for a dedicated site. Why a park or similar wouldn't fulfill the need in the same manner is, to me, a matter of privacy. When engaging in my spiritual beliefs I don't want curious onlookers around since my spirituality is deeply personal and something I don't feel like sharing with anyone but other like-minded*. And I certainly don't want it to be some kind of show for random passer-by's, that would be too intrusive and disruptive.
A Temple would grant the level of privacy I'd like.
But it will have to grow from need and not desire.

*This is not meant as elitist as it may sound, I just didn't know how express better.

Llama Su wrote: Forgiveness if this has been brought up, I did not get a chance to read through the pages, let me share with you my thoughts, if you will...

That's all anyone has to offer, lol... I picked your quote cause its closest, :lol:....

You [an individual] can have all the thoughts and opinions we want....

But, when it comes to the law, well, the word "Jedi" is trademarked, and in a legal battle, that's what counts...

Unless some here is a lawyer, and can argue the point in a court of law, it make no sense for us to claim anything...

"Acceptance" is key....

We can only deal with "what is", not what "ought to be" or "what we think it should be"...

There merely is, "what is"....

Thank you Calem, back to the thread title topic...

LOL!


I already know how this is going to work: I'm going to buy the land myself, build my temple as a monastic get-away for Jedi and then donate to the Temple when I die. See? Now none of you have to worry about it anymore!

Okay, someone needs to win the lottery and donate some of the winnings towards this project. :lol:

Goodness....17 pages....Im still reading.

Let me at least say....As one of the Organizers/Co-Organizors of Jedi Gatherings since the Year of 2004 I can Accurately say that Texas is a terrible place to put up any sort of building dedicated to Gathering/Meet Up/Training.

A large percentage of memberships who actually do participate and have proven dedicated to meeting offline resides in the Michigan/Illinois-Chicago/Indiana/Ohio/Kentucky regions.

Those semi active in offline events upon the west coast would be in California.

If something was ever built....it would be my suggestion to follow the Gathered Communities area of most population.

Honestly I would put it on the boarder of IL & MI right next to the Great Lakes tip. But thats just me from years of researching events and location for Offline Gatherings. *Shurgs*


At the long and the short of it. Unless the land is owned by one charitable person willing to loan it out for gathering/offline events. A physical location is not practical. Gatherings happen all over the United States and Never repeated in one location. This is because we try to reach out to everyone in the US and recognize that other Jedi cannot pay for the expenses of travel. This year it was in Michigan. Next year 2015 it is in Indiana and Colorado.

Kitsu Tails wrote: Goodness....17 pages....Im still reading.

Let me at least say....As one of the Organizers/Co-Organizors of Jedi Gatherings since the Year of 2004 I can Accurately say that Texas is a terrible place to put up any sort of building dedicated to Gathering/Meet Up/Training.

A large percentage of memberships who actually do participate and have proven dedicated to meeting offline resides in the Michigan/Illinois-Chicago/Indiana/Ohio/Kentucky regions.

Those semi active in offline events upon the west coast would be in California.

If something was ever built....it would be my suggestion to follow the Gathered Communities are of most population.

Honestly I would put it on the boarder of IL & MI right next to the Great Lakes tip. But thats just me from years of researching events and location for Offline Gatherings. *Shurgs*


At the long and the short of it. Unless the land is owned by one charitable person willing to loan it out for gathering/offline events. A physical location is not practical. Gatherings happen all over the United States and Never repeated in one location. This is because we try to reach out to everyone in the US and recognize that other Jedi cannot pay for the expenses of travel. This year it was in Michigan. Next year 2015 it is in Indiana and Colorado.

Yes, however that is with your current data. That is not including our data, and that is not including the likelyhood of growth of membership over the years

With growth comes new needs. One day, maybe not now, there will be a need, and a stronger desire for a physical location. From what I read is that one of the main reasons for Texas was land prices. I've lived up in that area before. Its extremely expensive. (Don't get me started on the cigarette prices). So logically, for the first Temple, you would want a location where there is a strong influx of members, but ALSO since it would be a time of growth, the financial aspect of things has also got to be thought of. I believe when ever the first physical Temple is created, it will get the word out even more and I do believe you will have more and more members flocking to the religion. With more members comes more donations. More donations yield other Temples, in other areas of the country. Which equal even more exposure, members, and donations. It eon't be done in a day, a year or several. It will require a lot of dedicated members of the clergy, council members, and parishioners, howeverbi do believe in the future it will be applicable, and will be done.

I wasn't disagreeing with any of that. Heck...I have plans and layout for and entire Retreat Center with everything a community would need to sustain itself offline

I was merely disagreeing with the location I would not put it in texas.

Similar dream, Kitsu...

Jestor wrote: There are many things fighting against the idea, and what happens I'd it sounds like we are hanging up....

Take your proposal of west Texas, who is going to man it? Move there to maintain it?

It can't just sit empty, with the keys 3-4 hours away...

The progression will most likely be:

We will grow more dense, then we will have get togethers in parks, halls, and homes more and more frequently...

Then we will seek a existing building to rent, SOMEDAY, we will get there, but not soon, and this isxwhy the thoughts die...

At this juncture, owning land, even if given to us, where we have any kind of expense like the taxes, is difficult...

We still are not able to support the website on donations...

Its a long rroad, and there needs to be a progression...

We can't jump from learning to crawl to flying to the moon without the progressive growth...

Jestor, if you get the land, I got a tent and camping gear. "Go into exile we must go, until the time is right" ( ok, well not exactly...but i'll become the crazy old hermit in the desert and look after the property if it gets me away from my wife lol

Kitsu Tails wrote: I wasn't disagreeing with any of that. Heck...I have plans and layout for and entire Retreat Center with everything a community would need to sustain itself offline

I was merely disagreeing with the location I would not put it in texas.

Something something "if you build it...".

Keep in mind you have 4 TOTJO members living in Texas currently. Brenna, Wes, and I will soon all be living within 5 minutes of each other, and John (the founder) is 4.5 hours away from us.

So, from a TOTJO perspective, it could be fun to have it in Texas!

...( Whispering voice) ....If you build it...they will come....

Field of Dreams

I think this impulse is as deeply human as can be, just look at Stonehenge...

I think all the reasons to want the physical Temple are valid. I think its fine to plan and save for the goal of buying land, but do something Force-ful with it! Not just another building... Something off the wall, blow-out Schrodinger's box!

I sincerely don't believe the Force needs another building...

Heck, I used to live in Texas, and I loved it. I'm just looking for a reason to go back. In all honest if there was a physical Temple there I'd move in a heart beat. I still keep in contact with a lot of the people I met when I lived in Texas.

SilverWolf wrote: ...( Whispering voice) ....If you build it...they will come....

Field of Dreams

Hehe. My buddy in boot camp used to whisper this to me during formations. It was almost impossible to keep from laughing

SilverWolf wrote:

Jestor wrote: There are many things fighting against the idea, and what happens I'd it sounds like we are hanging up....

Take your proposal of west Texas, who is going to man it? Move there to maintain it?

It can't just sit empty, with the keys 3-4 hours away...

The progression will most likely be:

We will grow more dense, then we will have get togethers in parks, halls, and homes more and more frequently...

Then we will seek a existing building to rent, SOMEDAY, we will get there, but not soon, and this isxwhy the thoughts die...

At this juncture, owning land, even if given to us, where we have any kind of expense like the taxes, is difficult...

We still are not able to support the website on donations...

Its a long rroad, and there needs to be a progression...

We can't jump from learning to crawl to flying to the moon without the progressive growth...

Jestor, if you get the land, I got a tent and camping gear. "Go into exile we must go, until the time is right" ( ok, well not exactly...but i'll become the crazy old hermit in the desert and look after the property if it gets me away from my wife lol

Dude that would be awesome. We could get a rebel base going and stop the Corporate Empire from enslaving the Earth. Can you imagine all the people living for today? You may say I'm a dreamer... but I'm not the only one.

Whyte Horse wrote: Dude that would be awesome. We could get a rebel base going and stop the Corporate Empire from enslaving the Earth. Can you imagine all the people living for today? You may say I'm a dreamer... but I'm not the only one.

Waco 2.0, Order #66.

To actually complete my post... squirrel....

While I acknowledge the deeply rooted human-impulse to temple-up, I don't find the concept as powerful a siren song as I might have at one time in my life.

I think it is worthwhile to plan for, but I think there are a number of priorities which need to be realized prior to making it a major focus...

I agree with the sentiment that there are already lots of existing spaces in the world which offer ample place to connect with the Force.

For everything there is a time... As mentioned by someone else, in connexion with another topic, in a different thread, it is just a matter of priorities...